Toys4RJill

MattyG

I didn't know that Mary Barra and the GM board of directors participated on CL's Club Chat. Running a multi-billion dollar corp on the basis of the pluses and minuses of one singular vehicle in the Buick lineup that is the measure of profitability? Lol.

Toys4RJill

MattyG

Of course they are not the leader in that respect and Toyota earned its position over the decades, there is no doubt about that. But that's a function of history and automobile manufacturing processes and culture. GM did all these bad things to itself as did Ford and Chryco while the Japanese were busy working to school Detroit on how to make good cars. But today's reality is much different because GM is the company that went into bankruptcy and emerged as a new corp. Toyota never had to do that.

GM makes its domestic money on pickup trucks and BoF SUVs in terms of profit margins, and on domestic car based crossovers. GM on those, does it on volume and MSRP games.

But given, it's a global corporation, Buick is the big brand in China and that's where the Envision has sold really well since 2014. Bringing it here is simply a function of filling a slot and getting some extra awareness of a midsize CUV in the Buick brand.

If you look at Envision numbers in China, they are huge. So as Bitkahuna pointed out, this is about China not the US.

mmarshall

The Envision was also brought over from China for the obvious reason....it could be built there at lower cost than at a North American plant. And, from what I've seen at least, just as well.

All that, of course, could change if Trump gets the 35% tariff he wants on American-badged vehicles sold here that are built overseas. He campaigned on that in 2016, but has not really said much about it since.

LexBob2

Last year Buick sold 41,040 Envisions in the U.S. (3420 per month), probably more in China. In January they sold 2,487. Whether that's good or bad can be debated but that is sizeable U.S. volume for a division like Buick

Toys4RJill

mmarshall

The Encore is still their bread-and-butter, hands, down....it now accounts for one-third of all U.S. market Buick sales. I've never liked the Encore's choppy looks, and consider it underpowered, but I can understand its huge popularity....reasonable price, plush interior, quietness/refinement, AWD versatility, trim size for easy parking/manuverability, and good space efficiency for its size. I'll be surprised if Envision sales, here in the U.S., reach that of the Encore. I'm not saying it won't (or can't) happen....but only that I would be surprised if it does.

MattyG

Yes, it is. Because apparently buyers of the Envision disagree with your opinion. 25% discount on a semi-premium product? Why would I pay more for something just because I think someone else is selling something in the same category for more money? Am I someone who carelessly tosses my money into the fireplace, or do I look at options and figure out what my threshold point is?

I think the accountants at Buick see the cost of manufacturing and shipping into the US from China, and happily tell dealers that 25% off is not a bad discount. What does the GM factory worker make in Detroit vs China? I'd say you can happily offer steep discounts without harming your "brand".

Whether something is made in China and a moral issue about country of manufacturer is going to lead you into a rabbit hole. Where is your smartphone, tablet or tv made?

Propulsion

Toys4RJill

Sulu

That may not be enough Envisions sold to justify setting up an assembly line to build them here in North America; it must still be cheaper to build them in China and import to North America.

Each assembly line requires a minimum number of vehicles to justify the cost; building a line and running below minimum capacity costs more money than the vehicles sold would bring in -- in other words, it would be a negative return on investment. GM, as a business, has figured out that they can make money by selling Buick Envisions built and imported from China but could not make money building them here.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

mmarshall

Although it was originally Jill's statement and not mine, I'm not sure I follow you here. How is it "racist" to favor a car made in one Far-East Asian country over another...or, for that matter, even in South Korea? Seems to me like that is more of an issue of nationality than race.

Toys4RJill