Genesis, Kia, Hyundai top JD Power Study
06-21-18 | 07:57 AM
#17
Lead Lap
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,672
Likes: 1,184
From: NY
JD Power's IQS ranking is an absolutely stupid scoring system that senselessly mixes "design quality" with "mechanical quality", two completely different qualities that should've been put into two completely separate studies.
Mechanical quality issues are things that don't work as designed, while design quality issues are things that work as designed but are disliked by the users. They are simply completely unrelated measurements that have no business in being averaged together into one score.
Lexus's IQS ranking has been on a steady downhill slide ever since they put the dreadful remote touch interface in place of a touch screen and stubbornly refusing to adopt infotainment software designed by actual software companies, while all the other automakers have moved on to much more driver-friendly implementations and software that doesn't look 15 years old.
Were it not for the their dreadful infotainment system dragging down their "design quality" scores and therefore the overall IQS scores, they would've easily ranked at the very top. Just take a look at the actual details of the scoring. Lexus absolutely dominates the mechanical quality scores. No other premium maker comes even close.
http://www.jdpower.com/cars/study/In...y-Make/4171ENG
Again, JD Power needs to split IQS into two studies, one for mechanical quality and one for design quality. And Lexus needs to wake the hell up and try to understand why just about everyone's complaining about their infotainment system, redo the control interface, and let real software companies do the software for them.
Mechanical quality issues are things that don't work as designed, while design quality issues are things that work as designed but are disliked by the users. They are simply completely unrelated measurements that have no business in being averaged together into one score.
Lexus's IQS ranking has been on a steady downhill slide ever since they put the dreadful remote touch interface in place of a touch screen and stubbornly refusing to adopt infotainment software designed by actual software companies, while all the other automakers have moved on to much more driver-friendly implementations and software that doesn't look 15 years old.
Were it not for the their dreadful infotainment system dragging down their "design quality" scores and therefore the overall IQS scores, they would've easily ranked at the very top. Just take a look at the actual details of the scoring. Lexus absolutely dominates the mechanical quality scores. No other premium maker comes even close.
http://www.jdpower.com/cars/study/In...y-Make/4171ENG
Again, JD Power needs to split IQS into two studies, one for mechanical quality and one for design quality. And Lexus needs to wake the hell up and try to understand why just about everyone's complaining about their infotainment system, redo the control interface, and let real software companies do the software for them.
To me, the takeaway from this survey is that the best alignment of owner satisfaction with non-mechanical features is held by Genesis/Kia/Hyundia. Jaguar/Land Rover, Volvo and Subaru need to get better at understanding what their user base wants in terms of non-mechanical features and satisfy those priorities a bit better.
06-21-18 | 07:57 AM
#18
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 91,717
Likes: 90
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
For those who think, however, that the Koreans bought their way into the JD Power ranking, notice that, even with Consumer Reports, which does not now allow manufacturers to advertise or make any cash-contributatios to the magazine, the Koreans still rank pretty high. The simple fact is that there is indeed something good to the way that they are (now) built.
Buick's high reliability ranking in Consumer Reports has also been the subject of controversy. Some people are saying that, if Buicks use essentially the same components as Chevys and Cadillacs (which, in fact, is only partially true, as a number of Buicks are Opel-designed) then they should have comparable reliability ratings as well. They attribute Buick reliability to the idea of most of their aged owners drive them very gently, avoid stress on the components, don't put a lot of miles on them, use them for very light stuff like church on Sundays and daily errands, and are diligent about regular maintenance. Older people also tend to rely more on Consumer Reports (which they have been reading for decades) instead of J.D. Power.....so they are simply giving CR more owner-data. There may be some truth to that......but it also dismisses the idea that the average age of Buick owners has been dropping for almost a decade.
Buick's high reliability ranking in Consumer Reports has also been the subject of controversy. Some people are saying that, if Buicks use essentially the same components as Chevys and Cadillacs (which, in fact, is only partially true, as a number of Buicks are Opel-designed) then they should have comparable reliability ratings as well. They attribute Buick reliability to the idea of most of their aged owners drive them very gently, avoid stress on the components, don't put a lot of miles on them, use them for very light stuff like church on Sundays and daily errands, and are diligent about regular maintenance. Older people also tend to rely more on Consumer Reports (which they have been reading for decades) instead of J.D. Power.....so they are simply giving CR more owner-data. There may be some truth to that......but it also dismisses the idea that the average age of Buick owners has been dropping for almost a decade.
06-21-18 | 09:26 AM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 8,491
Likes: 372
From: PA
I've only bought 3 new cars in my life, and of the 3, only 1 had an issue with it, within the first 90 days. It was the GM vehicle, at 23 miles. Then again, GM had a TSB out already, and you know how TSBs go, it's do this, if customer complains. If not, do nothing.
So based on the above, Nissan and BMW should be perfect, and GM should be below average. Still doesn't say anything at all.
So based on the above, Nissan and BMW should be perfect, and GM should be below average. Still doesn't say anything at all.
06-21-18 | 09:31 AM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 8,491
Likes: 372
From: PA
06-21-18 | 09:48 AM
#22
perhaps it should be called the 'initial perception study' although that's not very catchy. 
i think lexus and toyota's horrible infotainment system and controls have hurt them badly, but obviously their vehicles are still extremely reliable. problem is, all new vehicles are extremely reliable. as for how are they at 200k mi. and 15 years - no one knows because new cars haven't gotten there yet
basing new car perceptions on that 1998 lexus is bogus.
i think lexus and toyota's horrible infotainment system and controls have hurt them badly, but obviously their vehicles are still extremely reliable. problem is, all new vehicles are extremely reliable. as for how are they at 200k mi. and 15 years - no one knows because new cars haven't gotten there yet
basing new car perceptions on that 1998 lexus is bogus.
06-21-18 | 10:27 AM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 91,717
Likes: 90
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Sorry (no offense)...but, in my book, it takes more than one bad apple to completely cut one's self off from the apple tree. I only did that once in my life.....in the early 1980s, after several examples of truly garbage Chrysler products. And, today, even that bad experience is out of date...there are a couple of Chrysler products I'd consider owning.
06-21-18 | 12:40 PM
#24
Lexus Champion
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,841
Likes: 74
From: FL
One experience? Sorry (no offense)...but, in my book, it takes more than one bad apple to completely cut one's self off from the apple tree. I only did that once in my life.....in the early 1980s, after several examples of truly garbage Chrysler products. And, today, even that bad experience is out of date...there are a couple of Chrysler products I'd consider owning.
Sorry (no offense)...but, in my book, it takes more than one bad apple to completely cut one's self off from the apple tree. I only did that once in my life.....in the early 1980s, after several examples of truly garbage Chrysler products. And, today, even that bad experience is out of date...there are a couple of Chrysler products I'd consider owning.Last edited by Diesel350; 06-21-18 at 12:52 PM.
06-21-18 | 03:28 PM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 91,717
Likes: 90
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Not just my experience but my dad's experiences and my friends experiences all bad relating to quality. Even friends that have brand new GT350's with multiple quality issues directly from factory. If Ford is so great why do they have alot more TSB's than other car companies?
06-21-18 | 06:02 PM
#27
Racer
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,457
Likes: 45
From: FL
I've always considered the initial quality survey to be a joke. I'd venture to say most people don't now their new car yet and what it's capable of. It's mostly based on electonics, but cup holders??
Would you buy a car based on this survey?
Would you buy a car based on this survey?
06-21-18 | 07:12 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 91,717
Likes: 90
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Nothing, of course, even a survey, beats one's own inspection and test-drive. But, yes, given my actual experience looking at recent Korean products, the survey is pretty much on track. I'd definitely buy one....in fact, the AWD Genesis G80 was very high on my option-list when I bought my Lacrosse.
06-21-18 | 08:13 PM
#30
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 91,717
Likes: 90
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
