bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

you bring up these equity figures frequently and seem to be impressed by 'bigness'. yet if what you said were true, these impressive big companies wouldn't be acquiring or heavily investing in all kinds of 'small' companies. huge companies often can't get out of their own way or just have so much baggage in systems, supply chain, "methodologies" and process, not to mention bureaucracy, unions, complex partnerships, etc., that they simply can't do what a nimble smaller company can. tesla is by no means a small company any longer.

toyota may well 'squash' tesla, or at least become a big player in EVs but they've got a loooooooong way to go and i believe they are wasting their time and money on their fuel cell stuff but they have to do it because their Japanese govt has told them they have to as part of a long term national energy strategy there.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

you're contradicting yourself. you say big companies will crush "liddle" (sic) companies and then you cite impressive things done by a chinese little company (with presumably little to no or negative "equity").

for some reason you just don't like tesla, maybe?

single-handedly, they've made it more 'normal' to have an EV, something neither GM nor anyone else could do. THAT is amazing. while 40% of teslas are sold in california, i continue to be amazed at how many i see in my small town in central florida. the word is obviously getting out! after definite rushed manufacturing problems on the 3 rollout, mostly about panel fitment, controls, etc., they appear to have worked very hard to improve quality. so now people can buy a reasonably priced 3 that will cost almost nothing to own, is almost silent, charges over night, has range enough for most people... and even those who take long trips can either rent a car for that, or deal with a charge stop on route. my most frequent long trip is to south florida, and there's tesla superchargers on the florida turnpike so it would work out for me.

meanwhile, hyundai/kia is trying to make it more mainstream with koma/niro duo and getting pretty good reviews of them. mercedes and audi are starting with their mid-ute models and we'll see how that plays out. the jaguar ipace appears to be a dud, as have been the flat awful BMW "i" models (with all their "equity" they couldn't crush tesla).

Toys4RJill

Not sure why you keep bringing up no maintenance for EVs. That is not true. There is maintenance costs for Tesla models.

EZZ

I love the big boys argument. When you have nothing to argue on the merits of their current cars, they go there. lol

The EVs are generally much cheaper to replace parts outside of the battery. Motors cost ~$3k but rated around a million miles. The actual labor is a couple hours. The battery itself is about ~$8k now. May come down in the future but who knows. Fleet Teslas typically need battery replacement at 300-500k miles. The non-drivetrain parts are the same cost as all other cars such as suspension. Its just a very different vehicle and has significant advantages in terms of simplicity.

EZZ

Its relatively very minor compared to ICE cars. Thats my point. I'm talking drivetrain of course. If you want to throw in suspension, cabin filters, etc...those are a wash. Maintenance is terribly cheap on the Tesla. Go to an active Tesla forums and maintenance is actually the least talked about issue because of how little people pay. You'll see a ton of other issues such as paint quality etc...that are Tesla specific issues but maintenance is so insignificant. When Toyota brings out an EV, what will people complain about? What will service centers do to EVs when almost nothing breaks and a customer walks through their doors once every 2 years for servicing their battery coolant? Its gonna be tough for service centers to maintain their current revenues for sure in an EV world.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

]

not sure what you mean by that.

what do you base this on about inventory? in looking at some 'inventory' vs. custom build, i'm finding exactly the same pricing. now there's 'inventory' of models you can no longer get new (like standard range X) which are cheaper, but that's understandable.

as far as calling a rep, it doesn't surprise me if they have end of month or end of quarter incentives. more power to them.

yes, one can choose to spend huge amounts of time and have the runaround and deliberately confusing different offers from different dealers that are almost impossible to compare with different trims, different dealer installed garbage, different ways of presenting the confusing 'calculation', etc.

i know some people are successful in doing the email and wait method but many dealers won't communicate with customers via email, they require you to go into their den of vipers.

still comparing to 'discounts' on fake inflated MSRPs huh? can't be bothered...

i'd say you'd be informed if you said that, not uninformed, because ev's are clearly cheaper from a maintenance standpoint.

except loads of "indys" have no idea what they're doing. there's no way they can work on tons of brands of vehicles and have the training, certification, computers, tools, to do everything. but there will always be a place for "indys" for a) old cars, and b) simpler mechanical things (suspensions, brakes, etc).

Toys4RJill

But is not relatively minor. It’s an improvement, but your comments always say it’s nothing.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

^^^ good info.

EZZ

This is the old schedule and outdated. They since revised it and state:

"Tesla recommended the service every year or 12,500 miles for the Model S and Model X and every two years or 25,000 miles for the Model 3.

Now Tesla tells owners: "Your Tesla does not require annual maintenance and regular fluid changes," and instead recommends only periodic, as-needed servicing of brake fluid, pads, and calipers, filters, and air conditioning."

https://www.greencarreports.com/news...ic-maintenance

My owners manual states I have to get it looked at periodically. The things that are recommended are brake fluid check every 2 years (only replace if contamination is detected). Replacement of cabin air filters every 2 years. Tire rotation every 10-12k miles. Lets see...if my brake fluid holds up, maybe a hundred to replace cabin air filters every 2 years? Discount tires will do my rotations for almost nothing. Way cheaper than what you've estimated using the outdated schedule.

Toys4RJill

What about coolant?

EZZ

Inspection only now. replace as needed.

"Fluid Replacement Intervals

Your Battery coolant does not need to be

replaced for the life of your vehicle under

most circumstances. Brake fluid should be

checked every 2 years, replacing if necessary.

Note: Any damage caused by opening the

Battery coolant reservoir is excluded from the

warranty."

Model 3 probably needs the least maintenance of any car on the street.

LeX2K

O'RLY? What are they waiting for, oh right they don't want to. But will, because you said so.

Toys4RJill

So how does Tesla all of sudden just decide to change their maintenance requirements?

Also, I see on Audi e-tron, there is a minor then standard service every 10K. Also add in a few a la carte things as well. So the manufacturers will still get these EV buyers in for service.

https://www.audidevon.com/audi-etron...e-devon-pa.htm
Yikes

EZZ

Tesla changes its maintenance requirements because the Model 3 was a new car when they first wrote them. They probably have evidence to modify them to benefit the customer. Thats right...they don't have a franchisee to worry about. They just have to do the customer right. I've given you irrefutable proof on the maintenance schedule being SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED from an ICE car. Given the current maintenance schedule, you have to admit the franchisee service centers would see SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED REVENUE from an EV world.

That is the only point I was trying to make.

Toys4RJill

But not Telsa S or X?


But is not significant. An E-Tron Audi still goes in once per year, just a like a ICE Audi. (I am trying to find the costs)