Change in building codes to adapt to cars being left running in garages
09-03-19 | 09:43 AM
#16
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From: Maryland
are the heaters and water heaters in the garage as well here?
now you have less garage wall space, something else that can break, another way for animals and pests to get in. Great. Who is going to inspect these on occasion to make sure they work? Mandatory inspection?
now you have less garage wall space, something else that can break, another way for animals and pests to get in. Great. Who is going to inspect these on occasion to make sure they work? Mandatory inspection?
Who inspects smoke alarms to make sure they work? Who inspects circuit breakers? Just because something MAY break doesn't mean it doesn't provide a safety benefit. If your furnace or water heater is putting out CO then you have been remiss in your responsibility to maintain it properly. So, we shouldn't care about mandatory CO detectors?
I don't see how this is a negative thing at all. If it saves some lives somewhere it's worthwhile...and I'm somebody that 100% agrees people who leave their cars on are responsible for their own deaths if that kills them.
09-03-19 | 10:00 AM
#17
which is attributed to 100% user error, not random failures like a faulty heater does. If you know how to turn a car off properly then there is no danger.
yea good luck, like many people inspect their dryer duct for clogs and smoke detectors at the proper intervals. Many people dont even realize you should replace smoke detectors after 10 years regardless.
yea good luck, like many people inspect their dryer duct for clogs and smoke detectors at the proper intervals. Many people dont even realize you should replace smoke detectors after 10 years regardless.
Inspecting these garage vents is probably easier to do since you can test the CO detector and ensure the vent is free flowing by putting your hand in front of it, all in a matter of seconds. It's only one more detector to inspect and test.
09-03-19 | 03:06 PM
#19
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From: Southeastern PA
I don't see what the issue is here. The point of building codes are to make homes and buildings safer for people. This to me accomplishes exactly that, and that whole apparatus might cost $250.
Garage construction code has come a LONG way. Do you know that for years now garages have had to be self sealing? Doors between the garage and house have to close on their own. Doors have to be metal and fire rated, has to be a 2 hour fire barrier between a garage and habitable space within a house. GFCI breakers in bathrooms are because people are too stupid not to put their hairdryers in the sink.
The whole point of these codes are to make houses safer and this does just that with very little added cost. I think this is a genius idea.
Garage construction code has come a LONG way. Do you know that for years now garages have had to be self sealing? Doors between the garage and house have to close on their own. Doors have to be metal and fire rated, has to be a 2 hour fire barrier between a garage and habitable space within a house. GFCI breakers in bathrooms are because people are too stupid not to put their hairdryers in the sink.
The whole point of these codes are to make houses safer and this does just that with very little added cost. I think this is a genius idea.
There's a ton of tech and gadgetry that is attributable to user error (AEB, rear occupancy alarms, BSM, RCTA, etc.). Regardless of how or why the tech was developed, the fact is that it prevents loss of life. In this case, the error is 100% on the user, i.e. the driver who leaves the car on. That doesn't mean the rest of the family living in the house should die as a result.
Inspecting these garage vents is probably easier to do since you can test the CO detector and ensure the vent is free flowing by putting your hand in front of it, all in a matter of seconds. It's only one more detector to inspect and test.
Inspecting these garage vents is probably easier to do since you can test the CO detector and ensure the vent is free flowing by putting your hand in front of it, all in a matter of seconds. It's only one more detector to inspect and test.
09-03-19 | 08:33 PM
#21
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From: Canada
But then, having the exhaust fan stick out from the wall and take up storage space may be a good thing; it may deter you from placing stuff in front of the fan, reducing its capability.
09-03-19 | 08:41 PM
#22
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From: Maryland
The installation shown in the original post seems to be a retrofit. Could you not install a new CO exhaust system in the wall, fitting the exhaust fan between wall studs, especially as it will be required for all new homes? Original installations are usually done flush with the wall; it is self-done retrofits that are tacked on the wall.
But then, having the exhaust fan stick out from the wall and take up storage space may be a good thing; it may deter you from placing stuff in front of the fan, reducing its capability.
But then, having the exhaust fan stick out from the wall and take up storage space may be a good thing; it may deter you from placing stuff in front of the fan, reducing its capability.
Could you fit the ducting and all within the walls? Sure.
09-04-19 | 06:23 AM
#23
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Joined: Apr 2007
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From: Southeastern PA
The installation shown in the original post seems to be a retrofit. Could you not install a new CO exhaust system in the wall, fitting the exhaust fan between wall studs, especially as it will be required for all new homes? Original installations are usually done flush with the wall; it is self-done retrofits that are tacked on the wall.
But then, having the exhaust fan stick out from the wall and take up storage space may be a good thing; it may deter you from placing stuff in front of the fan, reducing its capability.
But then, having the exhaust fan stick out from the wall and take up storage space may be a good thing; it may deter you from placing stuff in front of the fan, reducing its capability.
09-04-19 | 05:52 PM
#24
Hey, gov't need surviving people to keep paying those taxes
And regarding spontaneous combustion, doesn't the fisker karmer have more incident than teslas?
09-04-19 | 07:20 PM
#26
Racer
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,599
Likes: 139
From: PA
I don't see what the issue is here. The point of building codes are to make homes and buildings safer for people. This to me accomplishes exactly that, and that whole apparatus might cost $250.
Garage construction code has come a LONG way. Do you know that for years now garages have had to be self sealing? Doors between the garage and house have to close on their own. Doors have to be metal and fire rated, has to be a 2 hour fire barrier between a garage and habitable space within a house. GFCI breakers in bathrooms are because people are too stupid not to put their hairdryers in the sink.
The whole point of these codes are to make houses safer and this does just that with very little added cost. I think this is a genius idea.
Garage construction code has come a LONG way. Do you know that for years now garages have had to be self sealing? Doors between the garage and house have to close on their own. Doors have to be metal and fire rated, has to be a 2 hour fire barrier between a garage and habitable space within a house. GFCI breakers in bathrooms are because people are too stupid not to put their hairdryers in the sink.
The whole point of these codes are to make houses safer and this does just that with very little added cost. I think this is a genius idea.
09-04-19 | 10:00 PM
#27
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,193
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From: Maryland
I don’t see the issue here, looks like a cheap system that hardly takes up any space. In MD I have never seen a hot water heater in a garage like I do in CA, now that takes up a lot of room. In MD I’ve seen a fair amount of houses that have had radon systems/fans installed that are plumbed in the garage and it takes up about the same amount of space so this doesn’t look any more offensive to me.
09-05-19 | 08:24 AM
#28
37 deaths since 2005 for a 2019 article from people accidentally leaving a keyless car running in the garage. That's under 3 people a year in the entire US. You're more likely to be killed by CO from your water heater and HVAC than your car which is a random failure and not an intentional one like leaving a car running is. Makes a lot of sense if the heaters are also in the same location as this detector. Which begs the question if the govt truly cared about saving people why wasnt a vent system installed required already for water heaters and HVAC heaters which have been around a lot longer than keyless cars. I can leave a key in a keyed car and it will never make an alert. For people with attached garages, they typically do not lock them so you can enter the house from the garage without your keys
Most of the deaths occurred in FL (not helping stereotypes here). So if you're digging around in Virginia that's not where the money is. Because of car emissions getting much cleaner over the decades its much harder to kill yourself with car CO than it was in the past.
https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...de/1419233001/
28 deaths 45 injuries from keyless since 2006 for 2018 article
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/13/b...?module=inline
439 deaths 72000 injuries from all CO a year
https://smallbiztrends.com/2018/11/c...tatistics.html
so a water heater/HVAC is over 100x more likely to kill and what 5000x more likely to injure you but how come no vent claptrap is coded for those which have been around FAR longer than keyless cars? Interesting. Facts matter instead of this "if it saves one life mentality" It is impossible to be 100% safe.
Most of the deaths occurred in FL (not helping stereotypes here). So if you're digging around in Virginia that's not where the money is. Because of car emissions getting much cleaner over the decades its much harder to kill yourself with car CO than it was in the past.
https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...de/1419233001/
28 deaths 45 injuries from keyless since 2006 for 2018 article
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/13/b...?module=inline
439 deaths 72000 injuries from all CO a year
https://smallbiztrends.com/2018/11/c...tatistics.html
so a water heater/HVAC is over 100x more likely to kill and what 5000x more likely to injure you but how come no vent claptrap is coded for those which have been around FAR longer than keyless cars? Interesting. Facts matter instead of this "if it saves one life mentality" It is impossible to be 100% safe.
Last edited by 4TehNguyen; 09-05-19 at 08:39 AM.
09-05-19 | 10:14 AM
#29
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From: Maryland
33 people doesn't sound like a lot unless you or somebody you love is one of those 33 people.
And there are MANY MANY codes pertaining to gas water heaters and furnaces, requirements for CO detectors and multiple failsafe features built into those units by code.
Its impossible to be 100% safe, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be as safe as possible.
And there are MANY MANY codes pertaining to gas water heaters and furnaces, requirements for CO detectors and multiple failsafe features built into those units by code.
Its impossible to be 100% safe, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be as safe as possible.