Porsche vs Tesla? Tesla Model S 'Plaid' prototype lap Laguna Seca
09-12-19, 02:54 PM
#1
Porsche vs Tesla? Tesla Model S 'Plaid' prototype lap Laguna Seca
1:36.555
Meanwhile, something's up at the Nürburgring
Blame Porsche for Elon Musk's and Tesla's sudden urge to prove their cars' lap credentials. Once discussion questioning if the Taycan or a Tesla would be faster on the track began, Musk was quick to tweet about a Model S at the Nürburgring. In the spy photographs, it was clear the Model S P100D was not stock, as it had slight aero tweaks, fender flares, wider wheels, and Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R semi-slick competition tires. We speculated Tesla could be preparing a competition-spec performance package for the Model S, and a new tweet with video further suggests a new variation is in the works.
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This might be the Tesla Model S that will challenge the Porsche Taycan's Nurburgring time
Following the reveal of the Porsche Taycan Turbo S, there was some buzz on Twitter about which would be faster on the Nürburgring: the Porsche, or something from Tesla. The Porsche Taycan Turbo S has already set a time of 7 minutes, 42 seconds, with the video to prove it. Tesla hasn't sent a car out for a lap yet, but head honcho Elon Musk tweeted that this will soon change Tweeting "Model S on Nürburgring next week"
The car they're testing is a Model S P100D, which makes sense since its 762 horsepower and 723 pound-feet of torque closely matches the Porsche's 750 horsepower and 774 pound-feet of torque.
This clearly isn't a stock Model S P100D, though. Up front, the lower grille opening has been enlarged, probably to improve cooling for the motors and batteries. It has subtle fender flares at each corner to house much wider wheels and tires. Our spy photographer says the tires were Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R tires, which are semi-slick competition tires that are street legal. At the back is a fairly pronounced lip spoiler.
While there's nothing wrong with running a modified car at the Nürburgring, the problem here is that the Porsche Taycan was driven in a stock form. And by modifying the car beyond stock form, Tesla can't really compare the Model S honestly or claim any sort of "victory" if it manages to get a faster time. There is the possibility that Tesla will start offering wider tires and a revised fascia as part of a new performance package, and that would change things a bit. The thing is, it probably wouldn't want to offer the tires it's using here, since they wear fast and don't have good wet grip. These are tires meant for lapping tracks and autocross courses in dry conditions.
It will still be interesting to see what happens with Tesla's 'Ring attempt. Hopefully it'll consider doing a more stock run. We're also curious to see if F1 racer Nico Rosberg will do the lap, as he offered on Twitter.
The car they're testing is a Model S P100D, which makes sense since its 762 horsepower and 723 pound-feet of torque closely matches the Porsche's 750 horsepower and 774 pound-feet of torque.
This clearly isn't a stock Model S P100D, though. Up front, the lower grille opening has been enlarged, probably to improve cooling for the motors and batteries. It has subtle fender flares at each corner to house much wider wheels and tires. Our spy photographer says the tires were Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R tires, which are semi-slick competition tires that are street legal. At the back is a fairly pronounced lip spoiler.
While there's nothing wrong with running a modified car at the Nürburgring, the problem here is that the Porsche Taycan was driven in a stock form. And by modifying the car beyond stock form, Tesla can't really compare the Model S honestly or claim any sort of "victory" if it manages to get a faster time. There is the possibility that Tesla will start offering wider tires and a revised fascia as part of a new performance package, and that would change things a bit. The thing is, it probably wouldn't want to offer the tires it's using here, since they wear fast and don't have good wet grip. These are tires meant for lapping tracks and autocross courses in dry conditions.
It will still be interesting to see what happens with Tesla's 'Ring attempt. Hopefully it'll consider doing a more stock run. We're also curious to see if F1 racer Nico Rosberg will do the lap, as he offered on Twitter.
09-12-19, 03:12 PM
#2
Lexus Test Driver
Its a triple motor drivetrain. Maybe a detuned Roadster motor? Obviously it will have much improved cooling. Even if it gets near the Taycan's times, this will be a triumph...what will the ICE track nerds complain about then...."oh it doesn't have soul because there is no noise..."
Competition is awesome...i hope BMW and Mercedes join the fun soon so it really heats up.
Competition is awesome...i hope BMW and Mercedes join the fun soon so it really heats up.
09-12-19, 10:13 PM
#4
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by patgilm
The ICE track nerds won’t have to complain since the Porsche ICE car does it in sub 7 minute times. I would be impressed if the Model S runs a sub 7 minute time.
The Model S is a 4 door sedan that seats 7. If it gets near Taycan / Panamera levels of performance, that's good enough to get all the naysayers off their back about worthless track performance in a sedan. If it gets under 7, that will be the most impressive time ever given it's 5000 lb weight.
09-13-19, 07:15 AM
#5
Lead Lap
Simple, ask a stock Model S to best the taycans in an endurance challenge. A stock S, would probably overheat, hence why this particular model is kitted out differently. Not saying Tesla is doing anything differently, since mfgs try all sorts of tricks and mods before launching time trials.
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09-16-19, 09:58 PM
#8
Driver School Candidate
Competition in the electric segment is always good. TSLA has been running the market for some time now so I'm excited to see what Porsche and Audi bring. TSLA still seems to have a stranglehold on the super charging network, though.
09-16-19, 10:01 PM
#9
Lexus Fanatic
Why isn't there a singular charging standard I find this ridiculous. And it would be so easy to do.
09-16-19, 10:05 PM
#10
Driver School Candidate
09-17-19, 12:03 AM
#11
Simple, ask a stock Model S to best the taycans in an endurance challenge. A stock S, would probably overheat, hence why this particular model is kitted out differently. Not saying Tesla is doing anything differently, since mfgs try all sorts of tricks and mods before launching time trials.
So now we are at the "tit for tat" stage, where the Taycan betters, then a special Model S betters, then a special Taycan betters, then the Tesla Roadster 2 door betters, then a Porsche 2 door EV betters etc etc.
Some time down the track, one of the players may emerge to be genuinely dominant...
09-17-19, 05:54 AM
#12
Aside from battery size adjustments over the years, the S only got a motor refresh this past year so Porsche is beating 7 year old tech. Congrats? Plus, Model S EPA range is 370 for the LR or 345 for the P100D while the Taycan's current estimates are probably going to be in the 240s. I'd personally value daily drivability than track performance
09-17-19, 06:35 AM
#13
Lexus Test Driver
I'd be shocked if the Model S comes within breathing room of the Taycan given its size and weight. The Taycan also features an 800V system so it's built for repeated high output driving. I highly doubt the original Model S has that in mind when it was being designed. The new plaid motor has many new unknowns including the voltage.
But none of this is as critical as the rumor that the Model 3 is getting LUDICROUS MODE! My car feels too slow at 3.2s to 60... I want to be at 2.7 seconds!
But none of this is as critical as the rumor that the Model 3 is getting LUDICROUS MODE! My car feels too slow at 3.2s to 60... I want to be at 2.7 seconds!
09-17-19, 08:32 AM
#14
Pole Position
Reports are coming in that the Plaid powertrain Model S recorded a time (unofficially) of 7:23, so very quick indeed. And the car looks great with what I think is a new wheel design.
The time is still to be confirmed, and it was not a production spec vehicle so the time wont count for the time being, but it points to a very interesting 2020 and beyond for Tesla.
The time is still to be confirmed, and it was not a production spec vehicle so the time wont count for the time being, but it points to a very interesting 2020 and beyond for Tesla.
09-17-19, 08:43 AM
#15
Lexus Test Driver
Damn. I didn't think a 5k lb vehicle could do that...
Tesla’s testing of new Model S vehicles, including a 3-motor ‘Plaid’ Model S, continues at the Nürburgring racetrack and now a witness says that Tesla already crushed Porsche Taycan’s time.
As we previously reported, following the recent launch of the Porsche Taycan, Tesla CEO Elon Musk appears to be on a mission to show that Tesla’s vehicles are still the highest-performing EVs available today.
Last week, he said that Tesla would bring a Model S to the Nürburgring race track — right after Porsche established a new 4-door electric car record at the track.
However, in the following days, Tesla announced a Model S with a 3-motor “Plaid powertrain” and new a “chassis prototype.”
Musk also said that Tesla has a new 7-seater Model S prototype at the Nürburgring racetrack and it seems like the track testing could simply be about testing new versions of Tesla’s Model S and the new 3-motor ‘Plaid Powertrain’ instead of going after the Taycan.
Nonetheless, it’s clear that Tesla wants to push those vehicles to their limits on the demanding racetrack and according to German car magazine Auto Motor und Sport, they brought Nordschleife expert Thomas Mutsch, amongst others, to drive the cars.
The magazine has an “observer” at the track who reportedly recorded Mutsch doing a 7:23 minutes lap in one of the modified Tesla Model S vehicles:
Tesla’s new time isn’t likely to be official, but the company has been rumored to have some time slots to attempt record times later this month.
However, if Tesla really attempts a record time to beat the Taycan, it is likely going to be disputed as being achieved with a non-production vehicle.
Last week, we reported on the Tesla Model S prototypes at Nürburgring having new fascia, a strange rear spoiler, and more modifications.
As for the new ‘Plaid powertrain’, CEO Elon Musk said that it wouldn’t be released until next year.
Again, if it’s really just about beating the Taycan, which I doubt is the case, it won’t work because people will claim that it’s non-production car versus a production car.
Maybe it’s just to showcase the performance of the new Plaid powertrain, but that would be a bad move since it’s still a year away and it would affect Tesla’s sales of Model S and Model X performance vehicles.
It leads me to think that it’s maybe as simple as Tesla needing to test its new powertrain and knowing that it would be seen or would leak, they made the announcement.
But I don’t know. I am open to other suggestions. Let us know in the comment section below.
Tesla’s testing of new Model S vehicles, including a 3-motor ‘Plaid’ Model S, continues at the Nürburgring racetrack and now a witness says that Tesla already crushed Porsche Taycan’s time.
As we previously reported, following the recent launch of the Porsche Taycan, Tesla CEO Elon Musk appears to be on a mission to show that Tesla’s vehicles are still the highest-performing EVs available today.
Last week, he said that Tesla would bring a Model S to the Nürburgring race track — right after Porsche established a new 4-door electric car record at the track.
However, in the following days, Tesla announced a Model S with a 3-motor “Plaid powertrain” and new a “chassis prototype.”
Musk also said that Tesla has a new 7-seater Model S prototype at the Nürburgring racetrack and it seems like the track testing could simply be about testing new versions of Tesla’s Model S and the new 3-motor ‘Plaid Powertrain’ instead of going after the Taycan.
Nonetheless, it’s clear that Tesla wants to push those vehicles to their limits on the demanding racetrack and according to German car magazine Auto Motor und Sport, they brought Nordschleife expert Thomas Mutsch, amongst others, to drive the cars.
The magazine has an “observer” at the track who reportedly recorded Mutsch doing a 7:23 minutes lap in one of the modified Tesla Model S vehicles:
“But what the new drive can do he has already shown on some very fast laps. Our observer reports a hand-stopped lap time of 7:23 minutes – as I said: hand-stopped with corresponding inaccuracies. But that would be about 20 seconds faster than that Porsche Taycan. The weather conditions on Monday (16.9.) were rather cool with 18 degrees and heavy cloud cover.”
Porsche claimed the Nürburgring racetrack ‘electric four-door’ record with the Taycan completing a 7:42 minutes lap last month.Tesla’s new time isn’t likely to be official, but the company has been rumored to have some time slots to attempt record times later this month.
However, if Tesla really attempts a record time to beat the Taycan, it is likely going to be disputed as being achieved with a non-production vehicle.
Last week, we reported on the Tesla Model S prototypes at Nürburgring having new fascia, a strange rear spoiler, and more modifications.
As for the new ‘Plaid powertrain’, CEO Elon Musk said that it wouldn’t be released until next year.
Electrek’s Take
If the time is accurate, it’s impressive modifications or not, but I still don’t understand the strategy.Again, if it’s really just about beating the Taycan, which I doubt is the case, it won’t work because people will claim that it’s non-production car versus a production car.
Maybe it’s just to showcase the performance of the new Plaid powertrain, but that would be a bad move since it’s still a year away and it would affect Tesla’s sales of Model S and Model X performance vehicles.
It leads me to think that it’s maybe as simple as Tesla needing to test its new powertrain and knowing that it would be seen or would leak, they made the announcement.
But I don’t know. I am open to other suggestions. Let us know in the comment section below.