Next AMG C63 to ditch V8 for hybrid four-pot
10-17-19, 09:21 PM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
I’ve had 2 v8’s, my lexus gs400 which was quiet when i bought it but after all the mods because quite the noise monster but certainly sounded awesome. After that i had my exploder 4.6L v8 which was not really refined in sound but sure was reliable.
i’m half kidding about noisy engines the sound can still be pretty awesome, but even before EVs my fave sound was no sound.
i’m half kidding about noisy engines the sound can still be pretty awesome, but even before EVs my fave sound was no sound.
10-17-19, 10:04 PM
#18
Lexus Fanatic
Not sure what the reasoning is for this. They are doing something none of the buyers of those vehicles are asking for or wants and which will likely make the decision easy to just not get one. People who buy AMG cars want highly tuned V8's and V12's because they are special and the furthest thing from a engine that is in a econo car, they don't care about fuel economy, it is not a priority. Just because you can make as much power with a highly tuned 4 cyl as a V8 does not mean it is a good idea, there are other compromises when you add huge power to 4 cylinders.
10-18-19, 07:01 PM
#20
Lexus Champion
I’ve said on here (to much ridicule) that V8’s days are numbered. Lexus getting rid of the V8 on the LS was a shockwave. I know mustangs still offer them but the ecoboost 4 cylinder is almost as powerful these days. Software, computer modeling, and emissions regulations have changed everything.
and if you don’t like the sound of a screaming 4 banger, how do you like the sound of silence or slight whine of an electric?
and if you don’t like the sound of a screaming 4 banger, how do you like the sound of silence or slight whine of an electric?
Yes Mercedes on the C63 AMG is losing 4-clyinders, but it is not losing power. The new Cadillac V's are losing power. There is another version of the CT5-V with the 4.2L Blackwing coming, but the damage has been done to Cadillac 'V'. Honestly had they simply called them the CT4 VSport and CT5 VSport, I would have 0 issues. Instead they turned their back and tarnished 16 years of V.
CT4-V 325 hp and 380 lb-ft vs ATS-V 464 hp and 445 lb-ft
CT5-V 355 hp and 400 lb-ft vs CTS-V 640 hp and 630 lb-ft
I love Cadillacs concepts. The Cadillac Sixteen (2003) had a 13.6L V16, never came to fruition, would have made a statement to German V12's. The Cadillac Converj (2009) was a gorgeous PHEV sport coupe - we got the expensive and lackluster ELR instead. The Cadillac Ciel (2011) was a gorgeous drop top convertible that commanded presence and had power with a TTV6 and hybrid system, never came to fruition. The Cadillac Elmiraj (2013) was a massive coupe (205 inches long) sporting a 4.5L TTV8 aimed squarely at the S-Class coupe. It also featured a pillar less hardtop profile last used in the 70's, didn't come to fruition. The Cadillac Escala (2016) was a stunning full-size sedan with your beloved Blackwing V8. We got the majorly watered down CT6 instead. I am hard on Cadillac because what they dream up is akin to their old 'Standard of the World' slogan, but what we get is 'ho-hum cars of the world'.
Bringing this back to Mercedes, the loss the of the V8 in the AMG C is like dipping their toe in the water of diluting the AMG image vs Cadillac V which dove head first with the CT4-V and CT5-V.
For the record, I'll miss the V8 dearly. I haven't experienced the new 4.0TT V8, but I have had the privilege of driving the C63 AMG with the 6.2 NA V8 for a few days and it sounded like a Howitzer cannon. Music to my ears
CT4-V 325 hp and 380 lb-ft vs ATS-V 464 hp and 445 lb-ft
CT5-V 355 hp and 400 lb-ft vs CTS-V 640 hp and 630 lb-ft
I love Cadillacs concepts. The Cadillac Sixteen (2003) had a 13.6L V16, never came to fruition, would have made a statement to German V12's. The Cadillac Converj (2009) was a gorgeous PHEV sport coupe - we got the expensive and lackluster ELR instead. The Cadillac Ciel (2011) was a gorgeous drop top convertible that commanded presence and had power with a TTV6 and hybrid system, never came to fruition. The Cadillac Elmiraj (2013) was a massive coupe (205 inches long) sporting a 4.5L TTV8 aimed squarely at the S-Class coupe. It also featured a pillar less hardtop profile last used in the 70's, didn't come to fruition. The Cadillac Escala (2016) was a stunning full-size sedan with your beloved Blackwing V8. We got the majorly watered down CT6 instead. I am hard on Cadillac because what they dream up is akin to their old 'Standard of the World' slogan, but what we get is 'ho-hum cars of the world'.
Bringing this back to Mercedes, the loss the of the V8 in the AMG C is like dipping their toe in the water of diluting the AMG image vs Cadillac V which dove head first with the CT4-V and CT5-V.
For the record, I'll miss the V8 dearly. I haven't experienced the new 4.0TT V8, but I have had the privilege of driving the C63 AMG with the 6.2 NA V8 for a few days and it sounded like a Howitzer cannon. Music to my ears
Well summed up. Very disappointing.
10-18-19, 07:14 PM
#21
Speaks French in Russian
Agreed, but disagree with starting with a 6 cylinder. Should be a V8.
Personally I can't stand the sound of a 4 cylinder but, more than that I can't stand the sound of an electric car. Why can't they just reduce the size of a V8???
Don't buy an AMG just for the power, the sound of the car is a big factor as well.
Well summed up. Very disappointing.
Personally I can't stand the sound of a 4 cylinder but, more than that I can't stand the sound of an electric car. Why can't they just reduce the size of a V8???
Don't buy an AMG just for the power, the sound of the car is a big factor as well.
Well summed up. Very disappointing.
10-18-19, 07:27 PM
#22
Lexus Champion
Why not just down size the V8, what is the difference between a 2L V8 and 4 cylinder engine emissions wise? I am not considering the cost element but, people who buy AMG already know they are paying a premium so I don't think that cost should really be a factor here.
10-18-19, 07:41 PM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
Maybe you’ve heard of these things called governments and regulators and do-gooders who want to decide for you what fuel economy your car must get because of a so-called “climate emergency”.
Tons of articles on modern turbo engines that are VERY stout with amazing power. My car’s 3.3 twin turbo v6 is WAY more powerful and responsive than the 4.0 v8 or the 4.6 v8 i’ve had, AND gets much better fuel economy than both. It’s a win win. And i’ve not heard of any reliability issues, PLUS people are modding them.
I agree the sound of a v8 is awesome. A v10 and a v12 are amazing too so why stop at v8? It’s just what you’re used to and appreciate.
because the mechanical overhead of a 2.0L V8 would be absurd.
Because they don’t need 6 to achieve their goals.
Why can't they just reduce the size of a V8???
Because they don’t need 6 to achieve their goals.
10-19-19, 07:11 AM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
10-19-19, 01:08 PM
#26
Lexus Champion
Disagreeeeeeee. I bet this motor scores in the black in consumer reports after a year or so.
Over 200hp/liter? Is the block made of Kryptonite?
There's a local Benz shop near my house and the amount of newish ones (out of warranty) always there astounds me. Lots of S550s, etc. with the N/A 5.5.
Over 200hp/liter? Is the block made of Kryptonite?
There's a local Benz shop near my house and the amount of newish ones (out of warranty) always there astounds me. Lots of S550s, etc. with the N/A 5.5.
10-20-19, 12:35 PM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
oh well it was a good run... i've got my big under-stressed supercharged V8 assembled by Mr. Robert Feiler and no complaints (apart from the fuel economy but it's worth it lol)
10-20-19, 01:03 PM
#28
Lexus Test Driver
also the reason you stop at a V8 is because it's the only type of engine that gives that muscle car rumble hot rod sound! the firing order of a cross-plane V8 with 4 to 1 exhaust headers results in 2 exhaust pulses simultaneously overlapping on a single side per cycle, which gives the classic blublublub sound... ferraris and such use a flat-plane crankshaft which gives perfectly even exhaust pulse spacing and makes a different sound (there's of course tradeoffs to this)
now what i don't get is why you can't just use a V8 with cylinder deactivation... i'm pretty sure the cadillac sixteen from like 15 years ago was mentioned in this thread, that had a V16 but could run on only 4 cylinders at a time, i don't see why a modern V8 couldn't do the same
oh and sorry but your 3.3T is not more responsive than the engine in your GS 400, more power and torque for sure but not more responsive... and especially not from idle or if you manually downshift before stepping on it
10-20-19, 01:14 PM
#29
Lexus Test Driver
i heard a GLC 43 do a full acceleration through 1st and 2nd next to me the other day as it merged and it sounded ricey
10-20-19, 02:23 PM
#30
Tons of articles on modern turbo engines that are VERY stout with amazing power. My car’s 3.3 twin turbo v6 is WAY more powerful and responsive than the 4.0 v8 or the 4.6 v8 i’ve had, AND gets much better fuel economy than both. It’s a win win. And i’ve not heard of any reliability issues, PLUS people are modding them.