AJT123

I have, a little. You were right. I never hated it or anything, I just think they toned it down too much. It’s no longer the best looking of the big GMs.

A decked out Sport Version in white or black or red definitely does it for me. But the “luxury trims” without all the blacked out trim and grill, eh kinda boring.

pbm317

Lincoln quality has actually been quite good overall. Yes, much maligned about the launch of the Aviator, but overall metrics put Lincoln's initial quality and longer durability ahead of many luxury brands.

The only Wow thing in the Navigator is the front seats, but for many they can seem like overkill. The Escalade went with the triple OLED screens to really be a talking piece and it has largely worked. The Navigator decided to launch in 2018 with a 10" touchscreen because that's all the Ford Motor Company part bin afforded them at the time. Navigator, their most expensive model, couldn't justify the development of an exclusive screen?? 10" wasn't even that big in 2018, especially for a luxury SUV north of $80K. So Lincoln missed on the tech mark. Lincoln is scrambling with screens now, look at the 2021 Nautilus that gets a 13.2" unit.

Escalade has always been the more in your face type design of the two Detroit ultra luxe SUVs. Where Lincoln continues to harp on sanctuary and quiet flight. While buyers might ultimately appreciate those elements, the branding and persona of the Escalade seems to win the day, despite the baggage of being a Cadillac even. Escalade far outsells Navigator. Even the relative newcomer X7 has jumped ahead of Navigator in sales.

Navigator's biggest problem is the brand and focus of Lincoln. Helped my brother look at larger 3-row units, and despite relatively good features and huge discounts on a Navigator, he said he simply can't do it. He'd do an Escalade, but would never consider a Lincoln because of the continued associations of the overall brand. That is also the case with many consumers that we do work with and have studied.

Toys4RJill

Over time I think the new Escalade will work out well for GM. I think the trend for front ends will calm down a bit and GM is already there for the trend.

mmarshall

The Corsair has also had a lot of launch-problems (not as many as the Aviator)....and I say that as someone who was impressed enough with the Corsair that I almost bought one. There is a reason why Lincoln ranks dead last in reliability among all the brands that Consumer Reports has enough data for in 2020/2021.

Here is Consumer Reports' ranking of the major automotive brands, according to their average reliability score:

1. Mazda (83)
2. Toyota (74)
3. Lexus (71)
4. Buick (70)
5. Honda (63)
6. Hyundai (62)
7. Ram (58)
8. Subaru (57)
9. Porsche (55)
10. Dodge (54)
11. Infiniti (54)
12. BMW (52)
13. Nissan (51)
14. Audi (46)
15. Kia (45)
16. GMC (43)
17. Chevrolet (42)
18. Volvo (41)
19. Jeep (41)
20. Mercedes-Benz (40)
21. Cadillac (38)
22. Ford (38)
23. Mini (37)
24. Volkswagen (36)
25. Tesla (29)
26. Lincoln (8)

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

Lincoln may be dead last in Consumer Reports but it's above average in J.D. Power VDS. Cadillac is also above average. VDS surveys owners, CR is doing road tests and averaging scores. While I like Consumer Reports, they should be taken with a grain of salt.

Toys4RJill

The Average Cadillac Escalade Now Sells for More Than $100,000

https://www.gearpatrol.com/cars/a361...de-sales-2021/


Happy to see Cadillac doing well with this model.

AJT123

I haven't seen one new one yet which is really, weird. This area is littered with the outgoing one. Passed a school zone where the parents park off to the side today, there were two identical white Escalades right behind each other.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

dealers are probably just ordering them loaded out. Especially now since new vehicle production is slim, they gotta pump the margins on each one

Shaboom

Is that actually a billion dollars in gross sales? My mental math becomes unreliable at that level!

Toys4RJill

‘Yeah. Add in the Tahoe and Yukon. BIG money

Shaboom

And, yet, they were in bankruptcy and seem to have fallen behind companies like Toyota and Honda. Hard to understand.

Toys4RJill

‘I think they are doing really well now. They struggled because they were so bloated with so many low profit cars as well as Opel and some other brands that were sinking them. I think Toyota is like the complete opposite of GM, they make their big profits on smaller cars, hybrids and mid size stuff.

mmarshall

In the American market, GM doesn't have any big cars left to make any profits on.......save for a couple of small-to-mid-sized sedans at Cadillac and Chevrolet. GMC and Buick currently sell nothing but trucks and crossovers. All of the Buick crossovers except the Enclave are considered compact or smaller, and even the Enclave is not a true full-sizer in the sense of the Tahoe/Suburban line.

So, it's apparent GM is making a lot more money now on smaller vehicles than they did just a few years ago....although its most profitable vehicle, period, is probably the Silverado truck in terms of money from total sales, and the Escalade as the most money per individual vehicle. I saw some data recently (I think it was in this thread) where the average price of a new Escalade is now 100K or more....same with the Navigator.

Hrocks

I don't know how much price enters into it in your DC/Arlington Virginia area, because I've never seen so many black Suburbans! Seems like all of the various governmental agencies, and livery companies use them. I still have a Tahoe and occasionally follow that forum, and there are SO many used PPV vehicles available. Some of the ex Secret Service (all black of course!) vehicles are heavily modified in many different ways. Some are supercharged, armored, some have modified interiors that have second row seats facing the sides and a rear seat facing backwards...wonder why? ;-)

mmarshall

Government agencies here use those large Suburbans, for one thing, simply because they have large underground parking garages, and there are reserved spaces for them. And it they are attacked or rammed by another vehicle, there is a lot of metal and sheer mass in them for protection. But they can be a pain in the *** to park and maneuver in some areas.

My neighbor's black Expedition is privately-owned, not a government vehicle.