Next time may be a little different.
03-11-20, 01:33 PM
#76
Lexus Fanatic
03-11-20, 01:42 PM
#77
Lexus Fanatic
EV's do not work for long trips for those who have experience with gas and want to do it the same way based on timing and distance. I could see a possible future where you rent a hotel room and you pay for a reservation to charge your EV in the hotel room parking spot that is only reserved for you. But I doubt it will be cheaper to reserve this than fill up a Toyota Camry. I personally think early adopters are fooled into thinking it will be so cheap for a EV down the road, once there is a significant demand for EVs, the associated costs, surcharges, even proposed tire taxes for EVs will offset gas costs. But EV owners will never stop and look at things from a distance or an open-minded POV
Evidence: Ontario Canada is proposing at 10% luxury tax on purchases over $100,000...A Porsche Taycan EV is $220K in Canada, whereas a Porsche Panorama starts at a lot less, like $100K or so
Evidence: Ontario Canada is proposing at 10% luxury tax on purchases over $100,000...A Porsche Taycan EV is $220K in Canada, whereas a Porsche Panorama starts at a lot less, like $100K or so
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 03-11-20 at 01:48 PM.
03-11-20, 01:46 PM
#78
Racer
You're both correct, Steve/Jill. That is my biggest concern too. As popularity and EV adoption grows, I am worried about overcrowded charging stations. Even at work there are grumblings of how to share the limited charging spots among the two dozen EVs, but that's not as bad as running into a full station on a roadtrip.
I agree with what Steve wrote earlier regarding not forcing an EV to fit one's lifestyle. Seeing the long lines at Costco gas and waiting half an hour for my turn 4x a month also didn't work for me any longer. Doesnt bother my wife to wait in the Costco line though. Of course, there are several.other nearby gas stations but they're also a few dollars more per fill-up so it's a trade-off between time and money.
I agree with what Steve wrote earlier regarding not forcing an EV to fit one's lifestyle. Seeing the long lines at Costco gas and waiting half an hour for my turn 4x a month also didn't work for me any longer. Doesnt bother my wife to wait in the Costco line though. Of course, there are several.other nearby gas stations but they're also a few dollars more per fill-up so it's a trade-off between time and money.
03-11-20, 01:50 PM
#79
people dont stop to eat every 300 miles. Bathroom breaks take 10 minutes or less. All of that assumes you have a supercharger available on your route. Imagine having to take a big detour off your route just because you have to get to a supercharger. This is going to cost time in addition to charging time. You would literally have to plan an entire trip around where superchargers are located. Hopefully its not a very cold/hot day or get stuck in a wreck on the freeway that day as all of these will affect your range. I can go 600+ miles on a single tank in my truck and gas up anywhere in under 10 minutes. Heck if someone got the ecodiesel ram with 33 gallon tank thats 1000 mile range. Honest question, range is 300 miles at what highway speed? Here around Houston if you are not driving 80 mph you will get run over on the freeway. When you start to get out of town, not uncommon for people to drive 85-90 mph. These speeds will definitely affect the range. I'm not going putt putt around on the freeway at 65 mph to maximize my range because youll get run over in addition to the, guess what, additional time it will take to get somewhere as if there isnt enough time bleeding out already.
03-11-20, 02:04 PM
#80
Lexus Test Driver
people dont stop to eat every 300 miles. Bathroom breaks take 10 minutes or less. All of that assumes you have a supercharger available on your route. Imagine having to take a big detour off your route just because you have to get to a supercharger. This is going to cost time in addition to charging time. You would literally have to plan an entire trip around where superchargers are located. Hopefully its not a very cold/hot day or get stuck in a wreck on the freeway that day as all of these will affect your range. I can go 600+ miles on a single tank in my truck and gas up anywhere in under 10 minutes. Heck if someone got the ecodiesel ram with 33 gallon tank thats 1000 mile range. Honest question, range is 300 miles at what highway speed? Here around Houston if you are not driving 80 mph you will get run over on the freeway. When you start to get out of town, not uncommon for people to drive 85-90 mph. These speeds will definitely affect the range. I'm not going putt putt around on the freeway at 65 mph to maximize my range because youll get run over in addition to the, guess what, additional time it will take to get somewhere as if there isnt enough time bleeding out already.
03-11-20, 02:17 PM
#82
They absolutely do. Most people 100% follow the manufacturer's recommendations when it comes to service intervals. In fact, I don't know anybody outside of enthusiasts who don't.
I can think of a bunch of $55k "family sedans" I would select over a Tesla Model 3. I just don't like it, I think they are unattractive inside and out, and I don't like the drawbacks of the EV powertrain. Its just not a car I would ever even consider buying. The only Tesla I find attractive from the outside is the Model S, and with that I hate the interior.
MY issue with Tesla fanboys is they don't understand that everybody who doesn't worship a Tesla isn't stupid, or backwards, or a Tesla hater. Not everyone would buy a Tesla if they "just drove one" or "if they had an open mind". Not everybody likes what you like. I have driven Telsas, they are cool but I wouldnt buy any of the ones they currently make. Would I be open to a luxury sedan built like my LS or an S Class with the performance and powertrain of a Model S? Absolutely. Would I buy one? No because I still dont like the EV limitations. If we got to the point where I could charge it everywhere in 5 minutes would I consider one? Absolutely.
I'm glad you like your Model 3 but it is NOT "Waaaay better than any other car".
I can think of a bunch of $55k "family sedans" I would select over a Tesla Model 3. I just don't like it, I think they are unattractive inside and out, and I don't like the drawbacks of the EV powertrain. Its just not a car I would ever even consider buying. The only Tesla I find attractive from the outside is the Model S, and with that I hate the interior.
MY issue with Tesla fanboys is they don't understand that everybody who doesn't worship a Tesla isn't stupid, or backwards, or a Tesla hater. Not everyone would buy a Tesla if they "just drove one" or "if they had an open mind". Not everybody likes what you like. I have driven Telsas, they are cool but I wouldnt buy any of the ones they currently make. Would I be open to a luxury sedan built like my LS or an S Class with the performance and powertrain of a Model S? Absolutely. Would I buy one? No because I still dont like the EV limitations. If we got to the point where I could charge it everywhere in 5 minutes would I consider one? Absolutely.
I'm glad you like your Model 3 but it is NOT "Waaaay better than any other car".
03-11-20, 02:23 PM
#84
Lexus Test Driver
EV's do not work for long trips for those who have experience with gas and want to do it the same way based on timing and distance. I could see a possible future where you rent a hotel room and you pay for a reservation to charge your EV in the hotel room parking spot that is only reserved for you. But I doubt it will be cheaper to reserve this than fill up a Toyota Camry. I personally think early adopters are fooled into thinking it will be so cheap for a EV down the road, once there is a significant demand for EVs, the associated costs, surcharges, even proposed tire taxes for EVs will offset gas costs. But EV owners will never stop and look at things from a distance or an open-minded POV
Evidence: Ontario Canada is proposing at 10% luxury tax on purchases over $100,000...A Porsche Taycan EV is $220K in Canada, whereas a Porsche Panorama starts at a lot less, like $100K or so
Evidence: Ontario Canada is proposing at 10% luxury tax on purchases over $100,000...A Porsche Taycan EV is $220K in Canada, whereas a Porsche Panorama starts at a lot less, like $100K or so
03-11-20, 02:48 PM
#85
Lexus Fanatic
Seeing the long lines at Costco gas and waiting half an hour for my turn 4x a month also didn't work for me any longer. Doesnt bother my wife to wait in the Costco line though. Of course, there are several.other nearby gas stations but they're also a few dollars more per fill-up so it's a trade-off between time and money.
And then; all of that money you saved by waiting all of those hours to buy cheaper fuel are obliterated by trading a car in on a Tesla and paying twice as much for it as the car you traded in.
The economics here just dont make sense lol
You're assuming i take my little daily beater for a long drive somewhere. Its my daily commuter weapon...silent, deadly fast, cheap to run. I'll take my swagger wagon on long trips because my kids LOVE the space. You don't have to get a car for the 0.1% of the time you decide to go somewhere far vs. the 99.9% of the time you use the car for commuting.
Most people do indeed have to buy one car for 100% of their needs yes.
And to those of us outside of CA the number of charging stations in CA means nothing to us.
Last edited by SW17LS; 03-11-20 at 03:01 PM.
03-11-20, 03:45 PM
#86
You've surveyed most people and what they do regarding oil changes? Anytime somebody says most people they are just pulling that out their ***.
The question was "what happens when you go to a charging station and all the spots are taken". My response, I live in California. So why should I care that you have a limited amount of charging stations, I don't so that doesn't affect us.
The question was "what happens when you go to a charging station and all the spots are taken". My response, I live in California. So why should I care that you have a limited amount of charging stations, I don't so that doesn't affect us.
03-11-20, 03:51 PM
#87
Lexus Fanatic
Translation: If my statement was BS, so was yours.
But we do have a forum, so I'm going to start a poll
The question was "what happens when you go to a charging station and all the spots are taken". My response, I live in California. So why should I care that you have a limited amount of charging stations, I don't so that doesn't affect us.
Enjoy your Tesla. I don't like them and they don't fit into my needs. Its okay, I don't have to like them or want one for you to enjoy yours.
Last edited by SW17LS; 03-11-20 at 03:55 PM.
03-11-20, 05:05 PM
#88
Racer
30 minutes?!? You seriously wait 30 minutes every week to save a few dollars on a fill up? How much is your time worth? I just filled my LS up from the gas light, with admittedly a large Giant food per gallon discount for $48. I mean, if I value my time at $80 an hour which is low the gas would have to be free to make it worth waiting 30 minutes.
And then; all of that money you saved by waiting all of those hours to buy cheaper fuel are obliterated by trading a car in on a Tesla and paying twice as much for it as the car you traded in.
The economics here just dont make sense lol
And then; all of that money you saved by waiting all of those hours to buy cheaper fuel are obliterated by trading a car in on a Tesla and paying twice as much for it as the car you traded in.
The economics here just dont make sense lol
If it's one thing I learned on this forum, and from you, that is to get what makes you happy. I mean, don't go bankrupt doing it but you have the idea. In my small attempt to steer the conversation back to the OP's point(s), we learn a lot about ourselves through life experiences, one of which is the car buying and ownership experience. At least cars are easier to change with your tastes than changing spouses/partners.
03-11-20, 05:17 PM
#89
Lexus Fanatic
If it's one thing I learned on this forum, and from you, that is to get what makes you happy. I mean, don't go bankrupt doing it but you have the idea. In my small attempt to steer the conversation back to the OP's point(s), we learn a lot about ourselves through life experiences, one of which is the car buying and ownership experience. At least cars are easier to change with your tastes than changing spouses/partners.
03-11-20, 05:36 PM
#90
Intermediate
So what? Apples and oranges. EVs can charge at home, while owners go about their lives. When supercharging, owners can get something to eat, shop, etc. Even if they choose to stay in the car while it is charging, it is not lost time, they can watch TV, play games, read from the car's screen, even nap. .
