bagwell

trying to help my friend get something new and get out of a 2009 BMW 335xi w/157K - right on the edge of being a money pit (Carvana I think offered only about $5K).

Any suggestions on dumping the 335xi (besides Autotrader)??

Guessing RAV4 Prime won't be had for a great deal anywhere? Friend lives in Denver but could fly wherever the deal is!!!

thanks for the help!

stasek

According to cars.com, there are only 110 Primes in the entire US. Chances are slim to none to get a “deal”, unless paying MSRP is considered a “deal”.

LX5280

I'm in Denver, I had no idea about the PHEV Rav4 Prime until you posted this, very interesting, it qualifies for the $7500 Federal tax credit + the $4K Colorado credit so even at msrp they will get $11.5K in tax credits. Now I'm intrigued also.
I really like AutoNation Arapahoe and they have 2 SE's in stock Of Course it says Call for Price but since they are a fixed price, no haggle, low pressure dealer would be worth a call to see.
I know some are anti-AutoNation and I haven't dealt with any other except this one and have always had good service. I have a 2008 Highlander and this dealer is close to where I work and have been going here for oil changes for years.

As far as the BMW, not sure if he / she is on FaceBook, but there are a few local BMW Groups, CO BMW owners group, Denver BMW's, e90's of CO etc. and of course FB Marketplace. May have a better chance of finding an enthusiast looking specifically for a 335Xi here.

pbm317

As @stasek noted, highly doubtful of any deals off MSRP even on the Primes. With just 5,000 or so for the entire country this model year, many dealers are even adding market adjustments due to demand, and due to customer ability to leverage federal tax rebates. Pretty unfortunate for what is on paper a very good PHEV from hybrid leader Toyota.

Carvana, Vroom and AutoNation have pretty good online appraisals (AutoNation has you bring the car in to their closest brick/mortar shop to finalize the deal.

Facebook listings seems to have grown since Craigslist started charging their nominal listing fee.

mmarshall

Might see what Car Max will offer you.....they buy used cars as well as sell them.

What did the BMW dealer offer him (or her?). He or she also has the option of donating it to an auto-related charity (like a auto-training academy) for a nice big tax-deduction come next spring. It's not necessarily the way to get the most money for a used car (depends on the circumstances), but an old Bimmer like that, with inevitable electrical problems, would be a perfect vehicle to donate to a place that trains future technicians in how to diagnose and repair electrical issues...although, of course, that's more than decade-old technology now.

bagwell

MM - thanks for the tips, I appreciate your help!!

that probably means OVER MSRP pricing

so upon further review, YES this vehicle is available in very low numbers right now, and in high demand - some dealers asking OVER MSRP (LOL).

I'm thinking MSRP is still a great deal because of the great tax incentives as mentioned above --- even if my friend pays $40K its essentially $28.5K which is a nice deal IMO.

coolsaber

Prime is basically the way Toyota moves everyone over to the one price model. Dealers are commanding over sticker on the prime at least for a couple years due to limited battery production.

LX5280

I agree, just doesn't seem to fit a Rav

Cars with ADM's

2021 Mustang GT500
2021 Corvette C8
2021 Challenger SuperStock
2021 RAV4 Prime

stasek

Add the Genesis GV80, Pallisade and Telluride to that list (at least in certain markets).

EZZ

You shouldn't buy a car that fails the moose test



https://www.autoblog.com/2020/12/03/...se-test-video/

Toyota RAV4 Prime fails the moose test in Sweden

Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV and Volvo XC40 Recharge also failed, not as spectacularly

Swedish publication Teknikens Värld has a reputation for calling out automakers who fail its proprietary moose test, in which a fully loaded vehicle is driven through an S-shaped obstacle-avoidance course at moderate speeds. The test is designed as a way to imitate a potential worst-case scenario, like when a large animal or a child darts into the street and forces a driver to take emergency evasive action.

Lots of vehicles pass the test without much drama, which requires completion of the course within the lines at a speed of at least 72 kilometers per hour (44.7 mph), but occasionally a vehicle performs poorly enough that Teknikens Värld confronts the automaker with the results. The latest vehicle to draw the ire of the publication is the Toyota RAV4 Prime.

During the publication's testing (see the video above), the RAV4 Prime skidded wildly at the initial test speed, crossing the painted lines of the course and barreling through the cones. The test was repeated until the plug-in hybrid crossover remained controllable, which it eventually did at a speed of 63 km/h (39.1 mph). The blame lies with the RAV4 Prime's stability control system, according to the publication, which fails to engage and keep the vehicle from skidding out of control.

This isn't the first time a RAV4 has failed the moose test. Teknikens Värld tested the non-plug-in version of Toyota's latest crossover in 2019, and it failed. To its credit, Toyota took the results seriously and developed an update for its vehicle stability control programming that resolved the issue and earned a passing grade in the moose test. That updated software was reportedly rolled out to all RAV4 models sold in Europe, which we would guess includes the plug-in Prime, but apparently there's enough difference — weight and weight distribution probably being chief differentiators — between models to cause the handling disparity.

It's worth noting that Teknikens Värld also tested the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV and Volvo XC40 Recharge, and neither was able to complete the course at 72 km/h. Says the magazine: "So… three cars fail. But only one of them is really bad. Scandalously bad, Toyota!"

In response, Toyota Motor Europe issued a statement saying it was able to reproduce the results of Teknikens Värld's moose test. "As a countermeasure, we will now take steps to ensure that RAV4 Plug-in Hybrid can pass Teknikens Värld’s Elk test," says Toyota. We're certain there will be an updated test once the stability control is reprogrammed.

coolsaber

AGAIN WTF?

But on a light note, I do appreciate Toyota engineers wanting owners to drift their FWD hybrids

LX5280

https://www.carscoops.com/wp-content/uploads/converted-mp4/2020/12/Dodge-Charger-crash.webm

https://www.reddit.com/r/IdiotsInCars/comments/k4dcsf/the_drift_scene_in_my_city_is_getting_bolder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

mmarshall

I suspect that, besides the stability-software, the RAV-4 Prime was also hampered by low-traction/low-rolling resistance tires, which, in the name of fuel-economy, don't help the vehicle's handling any. That's been an issue with a number of economy-oriented hybrids.

coolsaber

Toyota apparently has a SW update that works with low rolling resistance tires so its not a unsolveable problem. I`d wonder why TMC, whose been called out by the same company multiple times, on the same test, on the same generation of vehicle keeps needing a recalibration.

GFerg

Sheesh. Has a Toyota SUV ever passed this test successfully on the first try?