Seeing that they reversed course with the 2021 refresh and softened it back up that tells you how successful that was lol

You dont just take a successful established model and completely change its character. Like I said before, it would be like them taking the 4Runner and making it a unibody crossover (which I wouldnt put past Toyota!)

All of the longtime actual Lexus customers and enthusiasts on this thread are not wrong. Smart companies listen to what their customers want, not tell them what they want. Very few companies have a cult-like following enough to dictate to consumers successfully what they should want (Apple, Tesla). The 2021 refresh is Lexus listening to us as much as they can without developing an all new model (can't fix the space without a new body and layout)

 

Not me. I still think my 2010 LS460L was one of the most beautiful cars I've ever owned. The 500 looks like a barge, especially considering the lack of interior space. It does look more sleek and modern, but in a titanic kind of way.

 

But there a definitely LS500 members on this forum...maybe they are in this thread from time to time....so they are not wrong either for their purchase.

 

I like both, I think the LS460s are great looking (especially the LWB cars, I think the lines work better on the longer car) and I also like the looks of the 500.

The main issue with legroom in the 500 is the decision to go with a mid-front engine layout and put the engine all the way behind the front axle. Sure that benefits handling, but it was an answer to a question no one asked, and as you see with the S Class and 7 Series you can have a great handling large sedan without that layout. Then the low roofline killed headroom, and you have what is a very long car (its 7 inches longer than a SWB 460 and 2 inches longer than a LWB 460) that feels very small inside. Why buy a car thats so long with no payoff?!

 

Never knew it was longer than LWB LS460, it looks kinda small on the outside.

 

There are, but if you look at the 500 forums and their activity its clear there is nowhere near as much enthusiasm for that car, and there are a fair number of unhappy owners. Sales also tell the tale, the LS500 sells fewer cars than the LS460 did even at the end.

Its not that the 500 is a bad car, its a bad LS. And....Lexus agrees which is why they softened the car up a lot from what I can see for 2021. If I was someone who say, really loved the GS then going to an LS500 would be great. I had a GS, and I prefer the LS...its like they took the LS out of its segment and put it in a different segment, and buyers in its old segment (like all of us who are longtime LS buyers) don't appreciate that. They could have made a great looking dynamic LS500 that also had the characteristics the LS has always been known for. Hopefully they will next time.

 

Yep, LS460 is about 200 inches, LS460L is about 204 inches. LS500 is 206.1.

 

No doubt some of what you say may be true...but it still look good IMO. And I do like the direction took with it.

 

stupid thing won’t even fit in a garage

 

The people buying the new LS500 have bigger garages than the people buying previous LS models.

 

Oooohh, that stings but fair play, you’re probably right.

Back to the NX. The Lexus NX features a spindle grille and anti lock brakes.

 

My S560 is 206.5 inches and it just fits in my very small one car garage. So, the LS500 will fit in most garages. The length isnt the issue, its the lack of room inside given the length. The 7 Series and A8 are even longer.

That makes zero sense lol

You're not a buyer in that segment though, we are. At the end of the day what matters is how many people actually buy the car.

 

From what I've read, that mid-front engine layout on the LS500 was meant to accommodate a twin turbo V8. Of course, now that that engine is dead, it all amounted to nothing.

Basically, Lexus has a car that is only halfway through development that nobody asked for or wanted, and are doing their best to salvage it somwhat by at least giving it some semblance of the ride quality of prior softer LS's.

Had it reached its "true form", the LS would have been a legitimate competitor to this:

 

I couldn’t resist. Obviously it is absurd.

Don’t take it so seriously....I like the LS because it’s interesting and keeps my somewhat interested in the brand. I did like the 460 for it’s time as well...I also like your S class too....I don’t like the exterior of the new 21 S class.

 

ouch! Like that Cadillac Blackwing story?