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I don't think the origins from 2007 are what is to critique IMO. I think that bringing back the same the engine from the 2008 ISF is unusual. I don't think Toyota has ever done something like that in the past.
The 2IS had the same 3.5L V6 as the current 3IS. This new IS is still a gen 3 IS...it's just a refresh. Why not use the same V8 when the V6 is pretty much the same. I don't see a difference.
The 2IS had the same 3.5L V6 as the current 3IS. This new IS is still a gen 3 IS...it's just a refresh. Why not use the same V8 when the V6 is pretty much the same. I don't see a difference.
"Lexus Higherups go on record to confirm true F cars are coming"
^ absolutely not supported by anything stated in the video.
I used to follow Kirk's videos back when he worked as a Lexus dealer, but since then he's dropped down to the lowest common denominator with the pandering and cliclbait like so many other YouTubers.
What was interesting about the video though was how it was mentioned that the IS500 wasn't born out of Japan, it only existed because it was a suggestion from the American head of Lexus to corporate. That's pretty much the opposite of some confirmation of a massive V8 F sweep.
2008 ISF, 2015 GSF and the IS500 use a 2UR-GSE engine. Same engine
yea this is definately the same engine. An engine that makes 416 hp and 470 hp are definately the same engine
New or redesigned parts include:
Cylinder heads and cam covers
Crankshaft: crank pin diameter, connecting rod big-end bearing size and crank counter-weight size are all reduced, to reduce reciprocating weight
Crank main bearings and caps
High-strength forged connecting rods
Pistons and piston rings
Titanium inlet and exhaust valves
Intake manifold and throttle body
Redesigned Variable Valve Timing-intelligent Electric motor (VVT-iE)
Revised Lexus D-4S dual injection system
Four-into-one exhaust headers and heat insulators
Oil pan and baffle plate
Alternator clutch system
Engine and transmission oil coolers
Spark plugs
Digging Into the Metal
The new cylinder heads improve the 2UR-GSE engine’s breathing with improved porting and a high-flow/high tumble ratio. In addition, intake surge-tank capacity has been optimized, as have the intake manifold runner length and diameter.
The new oil pan baffle shape reduces agitation and hence friction, while new air-to-oil coolers for the engine oil and transmission fluid increase track suitability.
The Lexus D-4S dual-injection system has been redesigned, with higher injection pressure of 2,611 psi and improved fuel atomization.
The throttle diameter was increased by 10 percent, from 3 to 3.3 inches (84 mm).
A new intake camshaft profile increases valve lift and suits the Atkinson cycle, while improvements to the electronic VVT-iE system have expanded its range of operation for increased fuel economy and performance.
New four-into-two exhaust headers help reduce interference and hence further improve engine breathing. The larger-diameter exhaust system is designed to reduce backpressure and sound amazing, especially under acceleration. At the same time, the main muffler keeps things from getting too rowdy at lower speeds.
As a final touch, the new 2UR-GSE engine has a one-way clutch on the alternator pulley.
yea this is definately the same engine. An engine that makes 416 hp and 470 hp are definately the same engine
Its the same engine. You are wrong. The manual lists 2UR-GSE as the model number for the 08 ISF and the 15 GSF. It has new or updated parts. But at the end of the day, it’s still 2UR-GSE model engine
Its the same engine. You are wrong. The manual lists 2UR-GSE as the model number for the 08 ISF and the 15 GSF. It has new or updated parts. But at the end of the day, it’s still 2UR-GSE model engine
It's the same engine model designation, it's not the same engine. You are wrong.
As noted above and earlier in this thread
New or redesigned parts include:
Cylinder heads and cam covers
Crankshaft: crank pin diameter, connecting rod big-end bearing size and crank counter-weight size are all reduced, to reduce reciprocating weight
Crank main bearings and caps
High-strength forged connecting rods
Pistons and piston rings
Titanium inlet and exhaust valves
Intake manifold and throttle body
Redesigned Variable Valve Timing-intelligent Electric motor (VVT-iE)
Revised Lexus D-4S dual injection system
Four-into-one exhaust headers and heat insulators
Oil pan and baffle plate
Alternator clutch system
Engine and transmission oil coolers
Spark plugs
Digging Into the Metal
The new cylinder heads improve the 2UR-GSE engine’s breathing with improved porting and a high-flow/high tumble ratio. In addition, intake surge-tank capacity has been optimized, as have the intake manifold runner length and diameter.
The new oil pan baffle shape reduces agitation and hence friction, while new air-to-oil coolers for the engine oil and transmission fluid increase track suitability.
The Lexus D-4S dual-injection system has been redesigned, with higher injection pressure of 2,611 psi and improved fuel atomization.
The throttle diameter was increased by 10 percent, from 3 to 3.3 inches (84 mm).
A new intake camshaft profile increases valve lift and suits the Atkinson cycle, while improvements to the electronic VVT-iE system have expanded its range of operation for increased fuel economy and performance.
New four-into-two exhaust headers help reduce interference and hence further improve engine breathing. The larger-diameter exhaust system is designed to reduce backpressure and sound amazing, especially under acceleration. At the same time, the main muffler keeps things from getting too rowdy at lower speeds.
As a final touch, the new 2UR-GSE engine has a one-way clutch on the alternator pulley.
General block design might be the same, but there is a TON different with the latest iteration of the motor. To keep claiming it's the exact same motor given the known details isn't really productive and picking at nits.
General block design might be the same, but there is a TON different with the latest iteration of the motor. To keep claiming it's the exact same motor given the known details isn't really productive and picking at nits.
I guess I just see it as same engine design with new/redesigned parts...nothing of the overall design has changed. . My 2UZ-FE 2004 is the same engine as 05 MY even when you add VVTi, and change from metal to aluminum parts. Toyota significantly updated the 1GR in 2010 but I still see it as the same engine. Just weird that the model designation never changed where it does for Lexus 3.5. I see where someone can says it’s a different motor from a different point of view....I guess it’s like that glass is 1/2 full vs 1/2 empty....it’s either/or. Why does the model designation stay the same? But not for other motors.
I see where FSE and GSE qualify for a different motor
I see where my 21 1GR is the same as a 03 1GR even though one has dual VTTi where the other doesn’t.
From its introduction in 2008, the venerable 2UR-GSE has gone on to power the Lexus RC F and GS F models, as well as the flagship LC 500 coupe. During that decade it has been subject to further refinements that have resulted in a headline output of 471bhp at 7,100rpm and the ability to switch between Otto and Atkinsoncombustion cycles to optimise efficiency at cruising speeds.
Its the same engine. You are wrong. The manual lists 2UR-GSE as the model number for the 08 ISF and the 15 GSF. It has new or updated parts. But at the end of the day, it’s still 2UR-GSE model engine
I see it as same car. Just different parts. The Buick 3800 is the same engine for like 50 years....just adds or deletes some things....A B52 military plane is the same plane in then 1950s as it is today...just different updated parts.
I'd say the 2UR-GSEs are so much the same that I'd seriously consider buying a wrecked IS500 for the drivetrain/computers/wiring so I could upgrade my '08 IS F to current spec. I have both engines under the roof here. The engine in the GS F is superior to the engine in the '08 IS F - significantly superior. Saying it's the same engine is no different than saying the V-8 Chevy smallblock from 1955 is the same as a current generation small block Chevy. Sure, they have 8 cylinders, single underhead cam, and two valves per cylinder, but that's about it. I and many others do not think of them as the same in any real way.
The changes to the 2UR-GSE are not possible to incorporate on the earlier block. Can't even fit the crankshaft. So, these are different beasts with the same model designation. You can see my used oil reports from both of these engines posted here on CL (for their entire lives, I send samples at every oil change), and the late model stands head and shoulders above the previous model in all the wear metals Blackstone measures. The maintenance requirements are different, and they don't even use the same sparkplugs. The only common maintenance items are oil filters and air filters. I'd probably be pretty happy with an IS500, but I already have an IS F and a GS F in the garage next to my '93 Supra. I have no desire to add another car, and even if I won the lottery tonight I wouldn't be looking at one.
something i find unflattering about this photo... the hood looks high, the overhangs too long, the wheels too small.
it's a neat car though!
Originally Posted by GFerg
I'm biased, but best color on a car ever!!
This looks so good! Love it!
and yeah, the 'cement' color is kind of a love/hate thing... my new santa fe has it, i kinda like it, something different.
Originally Posted by charley95
Opinions vary but I think the cement gray is absolutely hideous.
LOL
Originally Posted by gengar
"Lexus Higherups go on record to confirm true F cars are coming"
^ absolutely not supported by anything stated in the video.
Kirk Kreifels makes terrible clickbait, content-free videos.
Originally Posted by Motorola
What was interesting about the video though was how it was mentioned that the IS500 wasn't born out of Japan, it only existed because it was a suggestion from the American head of Lexus to corporate. That's pretty much the opposite of some confirmation of a massive V8 F sweep.
makes sense it was u.s. driven. it's all but impossible to sell v8s in many other countries which tax them to death and tax gas to death too.
Originally Posted by lobuxracer
I'd say the 2UR-GSEs are so much the same that I'd seriously consider buying a wrecked IS500 for the drivetrain/computers/wiring so I could upgrade my '08 IS F to current spec. I have both engines under the roof here. The engine in the GS F is superior to the engine in the '08 IS F - significantly superior.
...
The changes to the 2UR-GSE are not possible to incorporate on the earlier block. Can't even fit the crankshaft. So, these are different beasts with the same model designation.
so besides all the listed changes and your better oil reports, how do you find them different, owning them both? obviously i have a new one in my '21 lc500. it seems to work well.
03-20-21, 03:28 PM
it seems to work well. 