SW17LS

The vast majority of German sales were lower in their range vs higher in their range, they still are. To say the LS never competed with the German cars is just absurd, it absolutely did, the fact that it didn't have anything to compete with the really high end versions of those cars doesn't mean that it didn't compete where it mattered most. As I've illustrated the impact of that competition is seen in all three of those German brands even still today when Lexus is largely a non factor to them everywhere but the bottom of the market.

The most in line with your own lol.

SW17LS

I agree, except in a few areas. The LS430 did have leather dash options, just only in the lower dash, an alcantara headliner in the CL and UL packages, laminated side glass also.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Thank you, good to know about the laminated glass and alcantara headliner, now I like the LS430 even more, lol. The lower portion of the dash leather wrapping does not cut it compared to full leather dash of the competitors.

SW17LS

True, but it was very nice and a nice upgrade from the 400.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Ls430 also had soft close doors and trunk

Toys4RJill

Here is a nice article. The 430 is not quite up to the S500. wheelbase and length are telling. However, well engineer and competitive.

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/bmw/...-sport-sedans/

Och

iTrader: (3)

I agree, if we're going to go there then you could say that the S class did not compete with S class. Base S400, S420, S500 models were a lot closer in price and features to the LS400/430 models vs their S600 and AMG siblings.

Back the topic, it offends me when a popular automotive expert uses disingenuous arguments to prop his bias. Not saying he is the only one on youtube to do this, but his perspective normally carries a lot more credibility as he's not just an entertainer but clearly an expert tech.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Thank you, did not know that either.

Also, in the video car wizard complained about lack of headlight wipers on the LS430. Plastic headlights would get completely scratched up wipers, instead the LS430 was offered with headlight washer nozzles, at least in certain markets. I also don't think US spec W140 had headlight wipers.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Yep, headlight washers, front and rear cooled and heated seats, separate rear ac unit, rear cool box, motorized headrests front and rear, rear lighted vanity mirrors, rear side window curtains, rear recline seats, etc.

Och

iTrader: (3)

My parents had the W220 S500, and in many ways it was better than the LS430, particularly the LWB and reassuring driving dynamics at high speeds. However the LS430 easily trumps it in interior quality and feel, controls, reliability, and overall build quality. If I had to decide between similarly equipped LS430 vs S500, I'd pick the LS.

patgilm

You keep mentioning the lack of V12 but back in 07 when the LS600hL debuted they touted the hybrid powertrain as Lexus’ answer to a V12 (which clearly it wasn’t). I know many don’t like the LS460 but when it first came out I loved the styling. Sure it had its shortcomings but the 600hL is one of my favorite cars that I owned.

Toys4RJill

I know...the 600h was supposed to be the Lexus version of the V12

In your opinion, what was the best Lexus LS ever?

patgilm

I never owned any of the older LS models but my favorite is still the LS600hL from a tech standpoint and styling standpoint. They had the first LED headlights, all had rear seat entertainment that included a motorized screen from the ceiling, reclining rear seats, and I loved the torque of the hybrid motor. I say the same thing in my signature, one of the best cars I’ve owned.

Och

iTrader: (3)

The LS600 certainly wasn't a direct answer to the V12s, but it came out when the hybrids were all the rage, and it catered to all the green movement. Today hybrids are no longer trendy with Tesla and other full electrics stealing the hype, but that only makes the LS600h even that much more interesting. Along with its GS450h sibling, they were unique hybrids that actually geared towards performance improvement more than fuel economy improvement of a typical hybrid. I never had a chance to try out an LS600, but I drove the GS450h, and the instant torque and instant passing power were absolutely awesome at the time. And much like with $100k Teslas today, back then a rich ***** driving the LS600h got the perk to virtue signal about saving the planet.

SW17LS

Good point.

Remember too, those were the years the LS outsold the S Class in America. So again, not quite to the same level as the S Class (it never has been) but the right combination of size, features, quality and attributes that it really resonated with buyers in that segment. You can't say it outsold it because of price, because its always been cheaper and hasn't always outsold it.

And...it was in the comparison so its clearly a competitor.

Exactly.

He's not that type of "automotive expert". I do agree though he was too hard on the car.