FatherTo1

That is great no ADM. A poster on the Tesla forum just shared they were at a Toyota dealership asking about the bz4x and there is a $10K dealer markup (in or near Corona, CA).

TangoRed

Didn't take long for the first recall to surface. No remedy and they ask you to park your vehicle immediately: https://www.autoblog.com/2022/06/23/...-wheel-recall/

TangoRed

I guess you can LMAO at Toyota, those weren't my words:"No one should drive these vehicles until the remedy is performed," Toyota said. Dealers will offer complimentary loaner to customers who cannot drive their cars while the issue is being investigated and a fix put in place. At this time, there is no prescribed remedy.

"After low-mileage use, all of the hub bolts on the wheel can loosen to the point where the wheel can detach from the vehicle," Toyota's official statement said. "If a wheel detaches from the vehicle while driving, it could result in a loss of vehicle control, increasing the risk of a crash. The cause of the issue and the driving patterns under which this issue could occur are still under investigation."

EZZ

Maybe the bolts can't take a higher torque rating needed to keep the wheels on? Seems like a drastic recommendation to not drive the car at all vs. just re-torque to a higher number. New car growing pains...

LeX2K

Sounds like the problem is not improper torque but bad design that inherently allows the lugs to loosen. Meaning you can tighten them to spec and the problem will keep happening. Toyota will probably have to replace all the hubs or at least the lug bolts and nuts.

Or maybe they'll say nah we'll just torque them way over spec and hope for the best.

LeX2K

lol yea. How much ya wanna bet they are using their parts bin hubs and didn't think about the instant torque of the electric motors being a potential problem.

Striker223

This. The LS430 has this issue but it was never addressed, if you follow the stock directions and set it to 76lb/ft and run it up to 130 they will back off. All 4 that I have tested do this no matter the miles, you need to change it to 90-95 and really should replace the studs as well. The 460 has the same studs and it's spec is 103 for a reason.....

Still. This whole situation is odd since I can't imagine buying a new car and not checking tire PSI and wheel TQ and doing a brake test before going on the test drive. If you own it you are supposed to check TQ after 10 miles max whenever you take a rim off to made sure nothing changed so this should have been caught and I am SURE track and drift guys would have found this.

Striker223

That's not a factor at all. You get way more load into studs by having free spin (burnout) that all of the sudden gains traction back with high wheel velocity, if other cars with same bolt pattern and rims had no issues then it's likely an issue with vehicle weight when at speed and sideloading of the rims.

LeX2K

You think extra weight is a factor? Toyota has used the same lugs and nuts for decades in basically every vehicle they make. And they're really great (or were) you have to be a total caveman to break off a Toyota lug.

Striker223

They are not at all the same. This uses a RAV4 size lug and stud and nothing like a tundra setup.

Extra weight is absolutely a factor in wheel clamping force and consistency. It's why track cars have to adjust based on speed of that track if they are using different rims/tires. It's also why carbon fiber and forget wheels do better under load, they deflect less and have less distortion under high forces. It's why Porsche went to a center lug design, you get a better clamping force out of it so at speed the wheel remains more true to the hub.

You increase vehicle weight you increase deflection, a RAV4 class lug and stud at RAV4 level preload will not like an extra 1000lb. You need to increase preload or alter the hardware geometry

LeX2K

I'm talking light duty vehicles like the RAV.

LeX2K

Doug thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiis DeMuro reviews it

EZZ

Someone on a review called it the biz forx. I've been calling it biz forx ever since.

LeX2K

lol that's good. Forx for short.

EZZ

bz4x is the name. bz = biz. 4x = forx.

The Doug review at the end was funny. Its slower, less range, at about the same price and last in class in the Doug score. He basically says, don't get it