AJT123

It does, you're not wrong. It's just the "cush" comes from fluid, not air. LX570 fully hydraulic.

Hydraulic is also much more robust than air, as also noted. I fully expect 300k+ out of mine with regular fluid changes. I would be a little weary buying a used car on air.

SW17LS

There's not really a "cush" that comes from fluid VS air. Normal shock absorbers are suspended by fluid. The reason hydraulic systems exist has nothing to do with comfort over air, it has everything to do with how quickly changes can be made to the struts.

And hydraulic systems have just as many potential drawbacks as air. Mercedes air suspensions for instance are WAY more reliable than their hydraulic suspensions.

swajames

This is untrue.

TangoRed

E-ABC is a bit of a different animal. It overlays the air suspension with some hydraulic components. All e-ABC vehicles have air suspension and adaptive dampers. The fun part is that it adds an electrohydraulic pump to each damper along with a system of valves that control fluid above and below the piston in the damper. e-ABC lifts the body by putting more pressure in the damper's lower chamber and lowers it by putting more pressure in the damper's upper chamber. It does this continuously at each corner to counteract body motion. It can effectively control the damper and spring rates individually at each wheel.

AJT123

Didn't know that.

That may be, but I'm not worried in the slightest about a hydraulic suspension in an LX. I am aware that at least older Mercedes hydraulic systems were disastrous, the ABC. However the old OLD 600 Pullman had hydraulics that operated EVERYTHING including the windows and I believe that was pretty robust if kept up. That was in the 1960s FWIW.

Lexus told Motor Trend their AHC is the most advanced in the world, at least at the time of the article published. Sorta hearsay-ish, but still. That whole article basically showcases how overbuilt the 200LX was.

Lexus claims the self-leveling hydraulic suspension is the most sophisticated on Earth. I don't know about the "on Earth" part, but the LX 570's ride is quite plush, and the 6,109-pound monster is more than happy to attack a corner. Climb underneath and you can see two green hydraulic spheres (just like a Citroën!) protected by what looks like two anti-roll bars with the end links cut off. The hydraulic dampers — assisted by steel springs — are the major point of departure between the Toyota Land Cruiser and the Lexus.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...70-first-test/

SW17LS

The hydraulic suspensions in the LX do fail...

And those old 600s, talk to some people that have restored them lol, those hydraulic systems are a NIGHTMARE. Jay Leno did a video about his 600 and restoring it, you should watch it.

They are full of it. The "most sophisticated on earth"? Read Tango Red's description of e-ABC above lol. Its actually quite rudimentary.

SW17LS

A quick search of the LX570 forums returned multiple threads of failures, the most recent one was quoted from Lexus $29,000 to repair lol.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/lx-...to-repair.html

Unlike an air suspension failure, a hydraulic failure also spills all the fluid out which ruins your garage floor or driveway.

The bottom line is, both air and hydraulic suspensions are less reliable than standard coil suspensions and have a MUCH more dramatic cost to repair.

Toys4RJill

Here is the LX570 info. Hydraulic pressure and fluid absolutely have a roll in the ride, cornering and firmness of the suspension.


AJT123

Of course some have failed, just like any other vehicle sometimes things fail, but it's not a "common issue". I could pull up what you did for basically any vehicle. You picking the $29,000 repair is quite an egregious example. But AHC in general is known to be very reliable and durable. I could direct you to tons of links on IH8MUD that suggest the opposite, endless. Change the fluid every 60k. Many times problems arise from it when people work on it who don't know what they're doing.

I wouldn't want to RESTORE a 600 but at the time, the hydraulics were revolutionary and durable from what I remember.

I don't ever anticipate having any suspension problems for the life of this vehicle (will report if I do), so I'm not sold the suspension is markedly "less reliable"....but the bolded part of your sentence I absolutely agree with.

Edit: Here is a link that lays it all out for any 200/AHC fan but you need to scroll down a dozen posts or so. Diagrams and everything.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/ahc...#post-12565137

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Yet again…..

SW17LS

Assuming the system on the 600 is the same, this describes exactly what I was describing. The hydraulic system absolutely does impact pressure and can be adapted quickly to counteract body roll, lean and pitch and dive when braking. Thats why the system is hydraulic vs air. The air suspension cant change the pressure in the struts fast enough to accomplish that.

BUT, when you select between comfort, normal and sport the hydraulic suspension is not softening the pressure in the struts, its the dampers that are firming up or loosening up. From the article:Just driving along, a hydraulic suspension is not going to be "cushier" than an air suspension...thats not the point.
Its just never going to be as foolproof and reliable as ordinary struts. Air or hydraulic, if you want long term reliability and ease of repair, best to avoid both air and hydraulic suspensions. Thats one of the reasons why you don't see that system on the Land Cruisers that are sold in the Middle East and other harsh locations.

With that said, I have told people over and over again the air suspension is worth the risk...I would say the same about the AHC but it absolutely does increase risk of a costly repair. You gotta pay to play.

spwolf

i think it would greatly improve this thread if someone would sit and drive this vehicle, and report back to us.

SW17LS

I would love to do so but its impossible right now, there aren't any to sit in or drive. I saw it in person at the DC car show but it was locked.

To add, the grille is not overpowering in person

Toys4RJill

You actually could get Land Cruisers with adaptive variable suspension like in the LX in overseas markets. New one as well has it. The Land Cruisers everywhere had hydraulic KDSS which could disconnect based on fluids….but that had their own can of worms as well. Outgoing Sequoai used hydraulics as well. And 2006-2007 Land Cruiser used the same suspension as the LX470. You’re right though long term,..best to avoid but I would never repair the system at year 10 or 15, I would just put in a regular system. The new Land Cruisers have gone to an electric KDSS system today.

AJT123

Yes, AHC is every bit as tough as anything on the LC. All of it, every LX/LC component goes through the same backbreaking, ridiculous reliability testing that other Toyotas don't get. If you just leave it alone and change the fluid, it'll last a very long time.

It does place modders at a potential disadvantage, though, because when you jack an LX up with lifts and change wheel sizes etc. the AHC can get complicated with sensor lifts and what not (which changes the OEM-engineered pump operation among other things...gets tricky). So that's one reason the hard core off roaders choose LC. That said, I've seen absolutely RIDICULOUS obstacles LXs chew up and spit out.

I wish they kept is as standard on this new LX. I still like it but wish it had a little more exciting engine and didn't lose some of the other standard features that it had. I do look forward to a nice comparo test soon. How awesome would it be if Toyota didn't cancel V8 development? What a shame.