Carmaker1

While looking up other models on USPTO and etc, I noticed Toyota as of Tuesday, has now formally filed a trademark with the United States Patent Trademark Offfice, for the next generation Lexus GX, on deck for the 2024 MY.

One of the new models at least, will be called GX 550 it seems. Powered by what exactly, is entirely another question?




Lexus has been hinting at a more niche, offroad focused utility vehicle in the near future. To some people, it wasn't known whether the LX or GX would take on this mantle. Or that the GX could outright be cancelled going forward, in favor of unibody TX once again, this time on TNGA-K.

Back in the early 2010s, prior to its first refresh in the Fall of 2013, the GX was due for death by 2017 and to be replaced by TX. Toyota allegedly reversed course by 2015 and focused on RX-L. For the past half decade, all new midsized utilities have been in development, in the form of a new Prado, 4Runner, and GX.

The main hurdle was, TNGA-F needed to launch first in new Land Cruiser 300, Tundra, Sequoia, and LX, before attacking the midsized range in 4Runner N350, Prado 180-Series, N400 Tacoma, and J180 GX. Like a domino effect, they all got delayed from the top-down. It is speculated that Hilux might join the fray on TNGA-F and abandon developing world IMV body-on-frame basis.

gor134

It's possible it will get the V35 and just be a typical Mercedes-style move where they up the numbers but leave the powertrain the same. And possible LC and LS move up to 550 as well. No clue ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

Good to see you back by the way, you always provide some interesting insight. Is there any news on future Lexus car lineup regarding potential next-gen IS/RC yet?

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

GX 550 has a nice ring to it. Hopefully it’ll be a full redesign 3rd gen model. Provided Lexus makes it capable, plush, evolving current design language, and with high levels of fit and finish, they’ll command a nice price and continue to elevate their status amongst other luxury Marques. Wishful thinking at least

Carmaker1

Thanks gor134, your theory makes great sense and diffuses the confusion.. All this marketing mumbo jumbo with displacement being thrown out the window, is driving me crazy and this time, I couldn't really compute it at all. I am excited to see this though! The next GX is no longer just rumor mill, it is 100% coming.

Come to think of it, how about the relationship between the IS 350 F Sport RWD and the IS 300 AWD? Same engine, different tune? LX 600 is V35A-FTS TTV6, so maybe dropping by 50 to 550, explains it all?


The 4Runner and Tacoma (essentially a downmarket, Toyota-badged GX pickup built in USDM/MX), for 2024 will for a fact be powered by hybrid inline-4, most likely connected to the new 2.4L in the NX. Kinda like the new V35A + hybrid setup in Tundra (and LX).


Sorry, but not that I can fully confirm it, but I do recall there is good news for the RC. IS and RC will be redesigned 2024. Back in 2019, per Lexus Europe product planning, the 4IS had scheduled to 2023 launch, which is why the revised 2021MY sufficed. Unfortunately they dropped it for Europe (for now), but other markets still have the IS. The RC will be sold through autumn 2023 and be retired from racing also in 2023. So basically, launched November 2014, facelifted in 2019, and end of production in 2023. 9 year life cycle like past Lexus 2drs.


Interestingly, the reason the IS 500 F Sport Perf. was approved in 2019, was because the Lexus exclusive "New N" platform (4GS launched it, used by IS & RC), cannot be configured with the bi-turbo V6 V35A-FTS engine. So IS 500, used the 2UR-GSE V8 instead and since it has its competitive limitations with lower torque (than TT I6s or C63 V8), it could not be justified as another IS-F and competitor to M3 and C63 (V8). They didn't want a repeat of the GS-F against TTV8 competition.


One thing I still have yet to fully be certain on, are sub-LS RWD vehicles adopting new RWD basis, powered by I6 at the top end.

Carmaker1

It's been a long wait, but finally it's coming. Full redesign inside out on GA-F modular architecture, like the large Land Cruiser 300 and upcoming LX. Hopefully not as underwhelming though, as I expected more after 14 years and since all the designs are done in Japan, we can only wait to see what they designed..

It terms of GX 550, it sounds like in order to not "disappoint" LS 460 and LX 570 customers, Toyota insisted on the 3.4L V35A-FTS TTV6 powered being called LS 500 and LX 600 and f---ed up their nomenclature. Infiniti messed up theirs, because the smaller displacement VR30 twin turbo V6 would have lower number. than the 3.7L G37. Ditto for new Z dropping the numbering as well.

Like the IS 300 AWD powered by a detuned 2GR 3.5L V6, maybe like gor134 said, it will be a detuned V35A-FTS and drops by 50 to designate a lower positioning in TTV6 hierarchy? (LX 600 -50 = 550 = GX 550; IS 350 - 50 = IS 300 AWD) Sane engine, lesser power.

Striker223

How disappointing Lexus decided a universal TTV6 is the way to go vs the Germans universal TTV8s......no reason at all to go with Lexus anymore.

Wrong number of cylinders for a "premium" product, might as well put a 4cyl into a Bentley so to speak.....

mmarshall

Why are you so surprised? We've known for years (and discussed it here) that we were going to have to get used to smaller engines.....yet, every time we actually see one, it's the same whining.

I myself don't necessarily like the pattern...especially on big luxury vehicles.....but that is simply the reality of today's world. Let's accept it like adults.

That's not a personal barb at you...I'm not trying to be rude, just dealing with reality. We went through this (smaller engines) in the 1970s, but, back then, with emission controls, technology could not make adequate powerplants of smaller displacement....or even similar displacements. Today, it can.

Striker223

Oh I'm not accepting it, I won't ever buy an engine so small and overstressed. I totally understand why/how things are going this way and all but I don't think it makes sense to not offer a 7/800 hp engine when all your competitors do. No one actually wants these new engines, that's why you see so many going German or domestic these days.

I NEVER thought I would get a German V8 but what was I supposed to get instead?

A TTV6 is not an aspirational engine like a large V8 or V10/12 is, never will be. Same reason a GTR is not in the same conversation as it's V10 and 12 contemporaries or hell even its V8 competitors that it outperformed badly on paper and in metrics. It is just a cheap old car now while the 430/458 are just going up in price due to the engine being a true experience.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

We don't know for sure this gx550 is ttv6 do we?

i was wondering if lexus has done a hybrid version of the v8 and considers the small power bump to call it the 550? And this would help a load with the bad fuel economy right now.

Carmaker1

I forgot to mention this tidbit about the next GX. Please take it with a grain of salt. 2024 GX is much more niche than it is today, a body on frame Defender competitor and G-Class like. Very Bronco like as well.

The inspiration was allegedly the original 70-Series Prado and flared out uniquely. Very special Lexus interface, using a code recognition system and incorporates your own personal preferences, which can transfer over to your loaner vehicle, when taken in for service.

Powered by the V35A-FTS and arrives in December 2023.

And the sad thing is Lexus actually cancelled the twin-turbo V8 and for good too. Anyone hoping for an Lexus LCF, should realize that when a company kills the unique trademark for an incoming product, it is very certain it will not be coming to market anymore.

They also killed the production LF-1 which would have used that engine and never invested in completing the LSF. It's so sad. With no model to use this engine, it means that it's over and nothing above the V6 is coming.

People like me notice these things and act accordingly in the flagship classes.

I was going to get an LS as my first big luxury sedan purchase, after the four door GTR for Infiniti (Q45 replacement) never came to fruition in the 2010s and Q60 was a disappointment (owned G35S then). I waited for years, saw the LS get another refresh for 2013 and waited another 4 years.

As I expected in 2016, I finally came into my own and could justify a V8 flagship and much more now. Between LF-FC Concept and LS 500 trademark, I was ecstatic to be expecting 2UR V8 in such a snazzy design.

I sadly quickly learned LC 500 and LS 500 were two different things and LS predated that concept in design work. Totally lost interest and was in disbelief, as I knew since 2014 that the twin turbo V6 was coming, but I never knew that it would be used to replace a V8 at the top end. Thought about LC 500 but I chose to remain stubborn and then decided I would just go up a little more.

I waited a bit longer and in the vein of my mother, got myself into my current M760i. Lexus could've had me with the 5th LS, which is why I signed up here in 2012. Just like Infiniti, they lost me as a young segment ascender (like SW20S) and I just upped my budget by 150% for a V12, my first and only. Ideally wanted an S600, but no longer being made and rest of V12 offerings passed my budget (an understatement).

I knew that BMW were going to drop the 12 by next gen and I wasn't too pleased about my favorite the previous W222 S Class, again NOT having a V12 outside of AMG, Maybach, or Guard. Or even in next W223 generation at all (still is there). Since I hated the incoming facelift 2020 7-Series' super-sized tacky grille, in the 11th hour, I made a hasty decision and snagged an unsold 2019 unit. If I had to choose a colour again, it wouldn't be the Mineral White I had to settle on.

I use the car a lot more than I anticipated and next to my 2019 Raptor, it is more of a daily driver than anything else I own. Other than the V12, I find it more boring than the S-Class I wanted in the first place. My 2022 Bronco on order will likely join/ take on that DD task, since BMW lease has ended and I didn't return it.

From what I am hearing, this new GX is ridiculously awesome and more exciting than LX. It is extremely likely that this GX 550, if my insight pans out to be true, I will definitely be buying it.

No and no. The 1UR V8 is dead. This is a devil's advocate theory, which is honest thinking, but quite contradictory.

Truthfully, if you sneak around regarding some Lexus developments, you'd find why your theory is untrue as well. The UR V8 is being phased out and definitely not being hybridized again. Only the high performance 2UR-GSE is being retained briefly on unibody vehicles, but nothing else uses UR going forward.

Off-topic: There is a DUMB running rumor LX 570 will carryover into the next generation and that is also inaccurate, because the named vehicle in question per the source, listed model codes for LX 570 Sport that unironically correspond with the 200-Series. URJ200 is not a next generation LX.

On another Lexus forum, they have that misbegotten theory and I hope they wake up, as it's wrong and LX 600 replaces LX 570. I digress.

As I already mentioned somewhere, the LX 600 is a twin turbo V6 and none other than the V35A-FTS. LX 600 has the chassis code VJA310. So if the LX 600 uses that V6, why would the GX 550 be a hybrid V8?

Some mention that Toyota has a mild hybrid coming, that might warrant the boost in naming to 600. Problem with that is, h is the de facto suffix for ALL hybridized Lexus vehicles.

Thus GX550 is not what you claim at all. No offense intended here, because I favor all of us remaining on the same page. It's a V6.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

i didn't 'claim' anything, i asked a question.

and when i also asked if we know the GX550 will be ttv6 you replied no, so i guess you meant yes?

just trying to remain on the same page!

Striker223

Thats almost exactly where I ended up as well, I didn't fully give up though and I'm still hoping against logic they will do something. I opted for what in my opinion was the most easily repairable and powerful V8 flagship I could easily acquire in the form of a D4 A8 4.0, still would prefer a LSF or even just a real LS500 but I would be lying if I said I wasn't impressed with the speed. It's very fun to feel the Gs and watch the HUD snap up over 15-20mph intervals to 80.

I also considered the Mercedes V12s and Bentley but the parts are just too difficult to buy if needed and too many procedures rely on full engine drops. I don't want to have to bring the car to a lift to be able to work on it, but that's just me I guess. I vastly prefer whatever my daily is to be able to be worked on at my house with relative ease so there is no back and forth to the shop.

However whenever I'm not really driving the car hard I honestly am not as impressed by the overall feel/quality/build vs my old Lexus. Not nearly as good to be stuck in traffic with

Carmaker1

Oh okay, I admit I am not good at reading people through text.

This vehicle is really going to be something else. This is out of the Las Vegas event Lexus held this year BTW.

Think this.


May 1993 to April 1996 Land Cruiser Prado 78-Series 5-Door

1994MY Prado 78

2022MY Land Cruiser J76 70th Anniversary

2022MY 70th Anniv

Land Cruiser 70-Series 5dr





I take back my LC F claim too, because per Vegas, they might have cancelled the trademark, but something is coming...Maybe LC 500 F-Sport Performance? The LC in question is powered by the U4XA-FTS TTV8 engine and showcased on display.

Was it to show what could've been? Or simply what's coming, in another form? Take the new engine and make an F Sport Performance version out of it for MY 2023? I believe that's when LC was due for its MMC.

Carmaker1

And to update myself here:

GX 550 and LX 600, are TTV6s equipped with mild hybrid systems, similar to 48V setup by Mercedes-Benz in some applications and not apples to apples with the V35A-FTS putting out 409 hp in the 300-Series Land Cruiser. This explains the crazy jump in nomenclature, but take it with a grain of salt.

So GX 550, could be a lower tune of that application applications easily even just the same exact engine app as 300-Series. LX 600 might be the sole hybrid boosted version. End of 2023 for that, whereas the first GA-F SUVs will be 2023 Sequoia next February. Like the 2023 RX and TX, Toyota is desperately keeping it under wraps.

TX has allowed the GX move from being a family people hauler to a niche product as I suspected 1 or 2 years ago.

Striker223

At least this means all the V6 cars will have the same power, I'm estimating 500 across the board with pump gas.