Advice needed on used Lexus sedan purchase
10-13-21, 10:23 PM
#1
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Advice needed on used Lexus sedan purchase
I am going to be buying a used Lexus sedan and need help deciding between the ES and GS models, both of which I like. Years will probably be between 2010-2012. I need advice from people who have driven these models. I like the GS for the AWD (MN winters) but hear the back seat is cramped and possibly head room issues? Is the AWD system reliable? The ES seems to be a safer choice as far as reliability from what I've read. Should I even consider looking at the GS hybrids of that time period? I've also seen highway gas mileage listed as both 25mpg and 30, which is more accurate?
On a side note, I've always admired a Lexus vehicles but never pulled the trigger, my sister bought a '06 GX470 and the quality impresses me even with a vehicle that old. I figure now is the time.
On a side note, I've always admired a Lexus vehicles but never pulled the trigger, my sister bought a '06 GX470 and the quality impresses me even with a vehicle that old. I figure now is the time.
10-14-21, 01:59 AM
#2
Lexus Test Driver
both great choices, but there's an easy question to narrow this down: do you actually like to drive your car? if yes the GS is the only choice
the ES is great too but in terms of actual driving feel and overall dynamics it's more or less a nice V6 camry... perfect for just getting around but that's kind of it
the ES is great too but in terms of actual driving feel and overall dynamics it's more or less a nice V6 camry... perfect for just getting around but that's kind of it
10-14-21, 07:52 AM
#3
Lexus Fanatic
The GS of that generation is very similar in size to the ES of that generation. Its after 2013 that the GS winds up being a good bit smaller than the ES. No issues with reliability with either, the GS is a better built nicer car. I had a 2010 ES, its a nice car but its not of the caliber of a GS.
10-14-21, 08:30 AM
#4
Lexus Champion
No bad choices. But for me, it's GS all the way.
Do note that, if you decide to pursue a hybrid GS, those are RWD only.
Do note that, if you decide to pursue a hybrid GS, those are RWD only.
10-14-21, 09:55 AM
#5
We love our 2013 GS350 F Sport. It is a wonderful car and a blast to drive. Sucks the gas, of course. The ES is the better family sedan; as others have posted, it is not nearly as much of a driver's car.
I imagine either is a 300K car with regular services. The GS service costs will be higher, due to performance suspension, tires, etc.
Good luck and welcome to the Lexus family!
I imagine either is a 300K car with regular services. The GS service costs will be higher, due to performance suspension, tires, etc.
Good luck and welcome to the Lexus family!
10-14-21, 09:58 AM
#6
Lexus Test Driver
I think the GS is a much better car overall. Sporty and luxurious and is the higher tier car in Lexus' portfolio. If they are the same price, definitely go for the GS.
10-14-21, 10:18 AM
#7
EV ftw!!!
Another vote for the GS! Bullet proof cars and sooo much more fun to drive. Plus it looks better than the snooze mobile ES. 😃
I had one for a very, very long time. Maintenance costs are not high as very little breaks.
I had one for a very, very long time. Maintenance costs are not high as very little breaks.
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10-14-21, 10:24 AM
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Wow! Very impressed by the quick responses, thank you very much. Seems pretty unanimous for the GS. I don't have a family to worry about, so I was leaning towards the GS. Thanks for your replies.
10-14-21, 10:45 AM
#9
EV ftw!!!
When I had mine , my 2 son's were growing up. Never had any issues regarding space
10-14-21, 10:46 AM
#10
Lexus Champion
10-14-21, 10:51 AM
#11
I honestly think it depends on which one you can find a better deal on. One word of warning though, watch out for the LCD screen on those. My extended-family owns three of that generation GS. The LCD screen in the center stack has failed on all three. Its a pretty important part since the Radio/Climate Control/Navigation all work through that screen. On the ES, you might be able to find one with no navigation, so you wouldn't have to worry about that issue.
10-14-21, 05:01 PM
#12
Do check the headroom on a GS. I'm 6-4 and that model couldn't work for me.
10-15-21, 03:03 PM
#13
Everyone here is turned on by the GS, but I believe the ES is better. It's not like the ES is a dog in the handling department. What, you need to do 80 around tight corners all the time? The ES is cheaper to operate, has more room, is quieter, smoother, and will overall last longer. The GS, as with all sports sedans, don't hold up if you rack up the miles. You'll be tempted to drive fast all the time, since the GS is set-up for speed and handling. It won't be nearly as comfortable as the ES.
The ES from 2010 on takes regular gas and if you do need replacing something you can get away with Toyota parts since underneath it's a V6 Camry. The GS is direct-injected (not what I want if I put big miles on my car and want top reliability), takes premium, will go through tires and brakes more often than the ES, isn't as smooth-riding, and is more cramped on the inside. The GS also is worse on gas and as I said, you must use premium. Years ago a .20 difference per gallon wasn't much of anything but at least here it's a good .50 to .60 per gallon difference. Certainly adds up.
AWD is overrated. The ES is FWD and that is plenty sufficient for winter driving. I've never once had issues in the snow in my cars and they've all been FWD. Unless you live in like Buffalo or Minnesota or something, but still. The ES is perfectly fine for winter.
Maybe you're one of those who drives a fraction of what I do (I put over 30k per year on my cars) and in that case, maybe the GS would be better for you. I don't know and we can't guess. Your best bet is to drive both. Find good, clean, low-mileage examples of each. Don't drive with the salesman because he'll run his mouth the whole time and you will be distracted from learning about the car you're testing. Don't make a decision for the GS just because some people on here say it's world's better. Spend adequate time with each car and give each one a fair chance. What I've said about the ES is fact: it is indeed a smoother, quieter, more comfortable car that has more room and is cheaper to not only purchase a good clean, low-mileage example but to operate as well. It is also more reliable long-term.
The GS is a good car but it's put up on a pedestal because it's a sports car and that's what everyone wants. Everyone wants to drive around like a maniac, do 20 over the speed limit, pass whenever they possibly can, see how fast they can drive a 1/4 mile, how fast they can brake, etc. Nobody wants an ES that is a really nice Camry, basically. Well, I guess a lot of people do but you won't find those people here. The people who buy an ES don't spend time on forums.
The ES from 2010 on takes regular gas and if you do need replacing something you can get away with Toyota parts since underneath it's a V6 Camry. The GS is direct-injected (not what I want if I put big miles on my car and want top reliability), takes premium, will go through tires and brakes more often than the ES, isn't as smooth-riding, and is more cramped on the inside. The GS also is worse on gas and as I said, you must use premium. Years ago a .20 difference per gallon wasn't much of anything but at least here it's a good .50 to .60 per gallon difference. Certainly adds up.
AWD is overrated. The ES is FWD and that is plenty sufficient for winter driving. I've never once had issues in the snow in my cars and they've all been FWD. Unless you live in like Buffalo or Minnesota or something, but still. The ES is perfectly fine for winter.
Maybe you're one of those who drives a fraction of what I do (I put over 30k per year on my cars) and in that case, maybe the GS would be better for you. I don't know and we can't guess. Your best bet is to drive both. Find good, clean, low-mileage examples of each. Don't drive with the salesman because he'll run his mouth the whole time and you will be distracted from learning about the car you're testing. Don't make a decision for the GS just because some people on here say it's world's better. Spend adequate time with each car and give each one a fair chance. What I've said about the ES is fact: it is indeed a smoother, quieter, more comfortable car that has more room and is cheaper to not only purchase a good clean, low-mileage example but to operate as well. It is also more reliable long-term.
The GS is a good car but it's put up on a pedestal because it's a sports car and that's what everyone wants. Everyone wants to drive around like a maniac, do 20 over the speed limit, pass whenever they possibly can, see how fast they can drive a 1/4 mile, how fast they can brake, etc. Nobody wants an ES that is a really nice Camry, basically. Well, I guess a lot of people do but you won't find those people here. The people who buy an ES don't spend time on forums.
10-15-21, 09:22 PM
#14
I got a 2010 GS 350 in February, And I love it. Only bad thing is the creaks and rattles particularly the sunroof. You should check out both the ES and GS and see which one you like better. The ES does have more room. Both had very beautiful high-quality cabins but at this age, many have deterioration issues as Lexus quality was iffy during the late 2000s. The 3GS is very tight for a Midsize sedan. I am 6'5 and have to sit with my seat reclined slightly and of course as low as possible but It is pretty comfortable, pre-2013 Lexus sedans are short on headroom. You might want to check out out the 2013 and up generations of the GS and ES as they have more room than each of their predecessors and are more modern to boot. And in the GS improved handling, Although my 2010 handles excellent, It does have a heavy luxury car feel when tossing it around corners. With the soft suspension, it rides amazingly well for a car with 40 series tires although larger bumps do pound through, I think the ES may ride smother on broken pavement. AWD GSs got 17-inch wheels with fatter tires too so they should ride smoother.
I can't speak for driving the ES as I have never driven one. I didn't even consider it. After driving an RX 350 for 6 years I did not want another FWD Lexus. The GS has 303 hp vs 270 hp in the 2GR FE. It has dual injection (port AND direct injection), Dual exhaust, Double wishbone suspension vs cheaper Mcpherson struts, Larger brakes, Wider tires. It feels like a more expensive higher caliber car than my RX. It is much quieter too. RWD is better at handling the engine power. FWD ES and RX spin the tires out while making turns into traffic, especially in the rain. Please note the 5ES had problems with sticky dashboards although I think this is only 2007 - 2009. Those years also had peeling steering wheel buttons. 2010 - 2012 ES is much nicer.
The speaker above makes a good point about AWD is going to be more maintenance VS simple RWD or FWD. About the Hybrid 450h. I test drove a few and they were amazing. Very fast seamless power. Unfortunately, I couldn't find any in good condition and they are very rare. So I gave up and got the GS 350 and now I don't have to worry about the hybrid battery issues.
I average about 21 Mpg in mixed driving.
Good luck on your search!
I can't speak for driving the ES as I have never driven one. I didn't even consider it. After driving an RX 350 for 6 years I did not want another FWD Lexus. The GS has 303 hp vs 270 hp in the 2GR FE. It has dual injection (port AND direct injection), Dual exhaust, Double wishbone suspension vs cheaper Mcpherson struts, Larger brakes, Wider tires. It feels like a more expensive higher caliber car than my RX. It is much quieter too. RWD is better at handling the engine power. FWD ES and RX spin the tires out while making turns into traffic, especially in the rain. Please note the 5ES had problems with sticky dashboards although I think this is only 2007 - 2009. Those years also had peeling steering wheel buttons. 2010 - 2012 ES is much nicer.
The speaker above makes a good point about AWD is going to be more maintenance VS simple RWD or FWD. About the Hybrid 450h. I test drove a few and they were amazing. Very fast seamless power. Unfortunately, I couldn't find any in good condition and they are very rare. So I gave up and got the GS 350 and now I don't have to worry about the hybrid battery issues.
I average about 21 Mpg in mixed driving. Good luck on your search!
10-15-21, 10:43 PM
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I appreciate everyone replies, and the last two posts by Xjokerz and Carfan especially had a lot of valuable info I was unware of. I need to do more research into the reliability of the GS vs the ES as far as their fuel injection. I have a limited budget, and honestly I like the earlier model's styling better than the later ones, which is why I am not considering the newer models. This has turned into more of a conundrum than I expected! I kept going back and forth and I will list the reasons:
For the GS:
1. I DO live in Minnesota and AWD is a huge plus. Though with no warranty, maybe I should avoid the added complexity of the AWD system? 2. I like the styling a bit better on the GS, especially the front 3. I don't care about the cost of premium gas, I have a work car and truck so it won't get a ton of miles, this will be my "nice" car 4. I like the sporty image better, maybe I am having a midlife crisis.
For the ES:
1. I'm 51 and after some honest reflection, comfort is more important to me than handling 2. I didn't know about the engine differences, reliability is a big consideration. 3. bigger trunk and backseat 4. MUCH more available for sale, which is also a bit of a negative since there is no exclusivity. I still see so many of these on the road 5. I am 5'11 but often wear tall hats, so roof height is a concern. Also not a fan of sunroofs in general, I could probably find an ES without one.
I could go either way and be happy. Realistically it will come down to the car with the best combo of price, condition, and mileage, like it always does. Thanks guys.
For the GS:
1. I DO live in Minnesota and AWD is a huge plus. Though with no warranty, maybe I should avoid the added complexity of the AWD system? 2. I like the styling a bit better on the GS, especially the front 3. I don't care about the cost of premium gas, I have a work car and truck so it won't get a ton of miles, this will be my "nice" car 4. I like the sporty image better, maybe I am having a midlife crisis.
For the ES:
1. I'm 51 and after some honest reflection, comfort is more important to me than handling 2. I didn't know about the engine differences, reliability is a big consideration. 3. bigger trunk and backseat 4. MUCH more available for sale, which is also a bit of a negative since there is no exclusivity. I still see so many of these on the road 5. I am 5'11 but often wear tall hats, so roof height is a concern. Also not a fan of sunroofs in general, I could probably find an ES without one.
I could go either way and be happy. Realistically it will come down to the car with the best combo of price, condition, and mileage, like it always does. Thanks guys.