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Here's the craziest thing about complaining the 2023 Accord is slow...it does 0-60 in 6.6 seconds. Thats similar to your LS430 @AJT123 . Buyers will be plenty happy with that acceleration.
From C&D:
Oh come on now, you KNOW that a 4 cyl is not the same as an 8 for driving feel even if when you wring it out it on paper gets close to the 0-60.
In general, yes I prefer newer models over older models, but there are exceptions. I never cared for the 3TL at all, never liked the looks of it inside or out. Last TL that did anything for me was the 2TL. I also much prefer the LS460 to the LS500...I also overall prefer my W222 S Class to the W223 S Class. I prefer the D4 A8 to the D5 A8...
The LS500 is just a screw up in general.
The W222 looks amazing.....one of THE best looking cars I've ever driven for sure.
The new D5 is very sterile IMO and the exterior is over-styled at the grill but it's a great car overall, the interface is not what I like but it's not bad due to the feedback system. The S8 drives insanely well as usual. I have a bais for D4s, they are one of those cars that just look "right" for me and have the perfect amount of styling vs plain areas.
Oh come on now, you KNOW that a 4 cyl is not the same as an 8 for driving feel even if when you wring it out it on paper gets close to the 0-60.
Oh of course, but let’s not pretend the outgoing 2.0T Accord felt anything like the 8 in the LS430 either. The 2023 Accord is plenty quick and will satisfy Accord buyers.
Oh of course, but let’s not pretend the outgoing 2.0T Accord felt anything like the 8 in the LS430 either. The 2023 Accord is plenty quick and will satisfy Accord buyers.
The outgoing one was at least better in the midrange than this one, I haven't driven the current one yet but I think I know what it will be like. It may surprise me but I think it will be exactly what I expect
The outgoing one was at least better in the midrange than this one, I haven't driven the current one yet but I think I know what it will be like. It may surprise me but I think it will be exactly what I expect
Why don’t you drive it first lol
Accord drivers don’t care about how the power is in the midrange.
Gas will never be as cheap as it was again, and people's perceptions are different now than they were. Whether or not gas is below $4 a gallon depends on where you live. I still pay over $4 a gallon. Gas prices were up before COVID, this is not a shift that has happened over just a couple years
National average is below $4 which you said would never happen again. In a couple years when things shift oil will get cheaper, gas will get cheap again.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Things that look sporty sell, they buy Accord Sports because they look better. The Sport doesnt have lower FE or more power. In any event, I bet if you looked at the stats they don't sell more Accord Sports. Most of the ones I see are not Sports.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
And they don't see us as brainless zombies, studies show fuel economy is the #1 factor for vehicle buyers, they are emphasizing what buyers say they want the most.
Are you as an enthusiast happy with all this, then?
Originally Posted by SW17LS
What makes you stubborn is your refusal to see things outside of your own perspective. In this case you can't put yourself in the shoes of an Accord buyer who doesn't see cars as anything other than an appliance.
Pot this is kettle, let's get cooking. If I'm stubborn you tell people what to do too much.
Perhaps....just perhaps that buyer knows the Accord's legacy of being a cheetah of a car under that boring sedan skin, but then finds out he's stuck with a weak hybrid for power. But the year before Accord, you could get an engine that would shame some sports cars from 20 years ago at lights with mid 5 second 0-60 times..
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Its not about thinking like I do, it’s about thinking like the target consumer for a vehicle does. I wouldn’t buy this Accord, I wouldn’t have bought the old one either.
I have accepted that automobiles have descended into suckdom. I would have bought the old one, and the V6 one before that. It had been brought up briefly in our house. No question if we were gonna buy a brand new sedan it would have been Accord.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
I would put premium in it because thats what Lexus says to put into it.
Lexus is only saying that to not look downmarket. It's an identical engine, identical to every other 5.7 including the Japan made one right along side the LC. Now, the new LX600 I would put premium in with the turbos and complexity of that engine.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
No, its more like maintaining a luxury property you rent the way it should be maintained. Painting or putting marble in it is an upgrade. I wouldn't use bleach to clean the nice hardwood floors in a house I rented. To do so would be classless, IMO.
If I leased a car I wouldn't feel much attachment to it, but that's just me... You just give it back.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Here's the craziest thing about complaining the 2023 Accord is slow...it does 0-60 in 6.6 seconds. Thats similar to your LS430 @AJT123 . Buyers will be plenty happy with that acceleration.
It's not the same thing and you know it, lol. Really? Line one up, I'll race it. Can we go from 85+?
I'm complaining that for the second time, Honda ripped out a very potent engine out of the Accord. I don't like it, I'm sorry you want me to like it, but I don't.
National average is below $4 which you said would never happen again. In a couple years when things shift oil will get cheaper, gas will get cheap again.
Are you as an enthusiast happy with all this, then?
Pot this is kettle, let's get cooking. If I'm stubborn you tell people what to do too much.
Perhaps....just perhaps that buyer knows the Accord's legacy of being a cheetah of a car under that boring sedan skin, but then finds out he's stuck with a weak hybrid for power. But the year before Accord, you could get an engine that would shame some sports cars from 20 years ago at lights with mid 5 second 0-60 times..
I have accepted that automobiles have descended into suckdom. I would have bought the old one, and the V6 one before that. It had been brought up briefly in our house. No question if we were gonna buy a brand new sedan it would have been Accord.
Lexus is only saying that to not look downmarket. It's an identical engine, identical to every other 5.7 including the Japan made one right along side the LC. Now, the new LX600 I would put premium in with the turbos and complexity of that engine.
If I leased a car I wouldn't feel much attachment to it, but that's just me... You just give it back.
It's not the same thing and you know it, lol. Really? Line one up, I'll race it. Can we go from 85+?
I'm complaining that for the second time, Honda ripped out a very potent engine out of the Accord. I don't like it, I'm sorry you want me to like it, but I don't.
Hey, trust me I think this new engine sucks as someone who couldn't care less for emissions, mpg, and all that. Downsized, turbo engines are sterile, awful, don't sound good, will break much easier, and will be much more expensive to maintain.
I do see where he's coming from though. If I can, you can as well since we seem to disagree on practically everything on this website lol.
Honda (as is every other manufacturer) has their back against the wall as for meeting emissions standards. This new engine significantly helps them in meeting those goals.
Knowing he does enjoy NA V8 engines, those V6's he had earlier in his life, etc I don't think he enjoys it or expects you to but that's just how it is. At the end of the day, you don't have to either but he does bring up a good point: 99% of Accord buyers couldn't care less about 0-60, driving feel, etc. They want an appliance that's reliable (their reliability will be in the tank in a few years with all this complex turbo non-sense but that's another story), lots of room, etc. They'll get something else if they want a true drivers car.
Just be glad you still have your amazing LS430 over this Accord lol. While I do miss my 430, I'm happy with a FWD considering the awful weather we've had here in western WA the last couple weeks. Couldn't imagine driving anywhere in the 430.
Are you as an enthusiast happy with all this, then?
Of course not, but I understand it. Honestly, I couldn't care less about what engine they put in an Accord because I would never buy one.
Perhaps....just perhaps that buyer knows the Accord's legacy of being a cheetah of a car under that boring sedan skin, but then finds out he's stuck with a weak hybrid for power. But the year before Accord, you could get an engine that would shame some sports cars from 20 years ago at lights with mid 5 second 0-60 times..
That buyer exists I'm sure (like my barber), but they are few and far between. For every enthusiast buyer like that, there are 5 buyers who will be wowed by the fuel economy. What Honda is trying to achieve is to give people a reason to buy the Accord over an SUV, and the gas mileage is the hook.
As for the car "shaming some sports cars from 20 years ago", well this engine shames some luxury cars from 20 years ago. Thats not bad. 0-60 in 6.6 seconds is not slow.
Lexus is only saying that to not look downmarket. It's an identical engine, identical to every other 5.7 including the Japan made one right along side the LC. Now, the new LX600 I would put premium in with the turbos and complexity of that engine.
I maintain cars according to how the manufacturer says to maintain them.
If I leased a car I wouldn't feel much attachment to it, but that's just me... You just give it back.
You've never leased a car so you don't know how you would feel, but its not about attachment its about doing whats right. Anyways, I have never given a leased car back I always trade them in or sell them.
I'm complaining that for the second time, Honda ripped out a very potent engine out of the Accord. I don't like it, I'm sorry you want me to like it, but I don't.
I don't want you to like it, I'm trying to help you understand why they did it.
Originally Posted by xjokerz
I do see where he's coming from though. If I can, you can as well since we seem to disagree on practically everything on this website lol.
Haha exactly!
Knowing he does enjoy NA V8 engines, those V6's he had earlier in his life, etc I don't think he enjoys it or expects you to but that's just how it is. At the end of the day, you don't have to either but he does bring up a good point: 99% of Accord buyers couldn't care less about 0-60, driving feel, etc. They want an appliance that's reliable (their reliability will be in the tank in a few years with all this complex turbo non-sense but that's another story), lots of room, etc. They'll get something else if they want a true drivers car.
Thats exactly my point. I don't like it, at all, but I understand it. This is market driven, people are overwhelmingly in support of the CAFE standards, consumers indicate on surveys that fuel economy is their #1 concern when buying a new vehicle, and it makes total sense that Honda would design a car like the Accord to maximize what consumers want, especially when that lines up with what benefits them under the CAFE standards.
Just be glad you still have your amazing LS430 over this Accord lol. While I do miss my 430, I'm happy with a FWD considering the awful weather we've had here in western WA the last couple weeks. Couldn't imagine driving anywhere in the 430.
Hey, trust me I think this new engine sucks as someone who couldn't care less for emissions, mpg, and all that. Downsized, turbo engines are sterile, awful, don't sound good, will break much easier, and will be much more expensive to maintain.
I do see where he's coming from though. If I can, you can as well since we seem to disagree on practically everything on this website lol.
Honda (as is every other manufacturer) has their back against the wall as for meeting emissions standards. This new engine significantly helps them in meeting those goals.
Of course I see, 50mpg is very impressive.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Of course not, but I understand it. Honestly, I couldn't care less about what engine they put in an Accord because I would never buy one.
I possibly might have, but we never did. Now I never would.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
That buyer exists I'm sure (like my barber), but they are few and far between. For every enthusiast buyer like that, there are 5 buyers who will be wowed by the fuel economy. What Honda is trying to achieve is to give people a reason to buy the Accord over an SUV, and the gas mileage is the hook.
As for the car "shaming some sports cars from 20 years ago", well this engine shames some luxury cars from 20 years ago. Thats not bad. 0-60 in 6.6 seconds is not slow.
Yeah but it still sucks they ripped the fastest one away that was plennnnty efficient.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
I maintain cars according to how the manufacturer says to maintain them.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
You've never leased a car so you don't know how you would feel, but its not about attachment its about doing whats right. Anyways, I have never given a leased car back I always trade them in or sell them.
What? Right and wrong now? Nobody is saying that. Why does it bother you so much that I voice my disdain?
Originally Posted by SW17LS
I don't want you to like it, I'm trying to help you understand why they did it.
Of course I understand it. I just don't like it and think it was unnecessary. I'd say they're already meeting CAFE standards. It's not 99%, guys. That's what I'm trying to make you see. Sure, most people don't care but car enthusiasts aren't 1 in 1000. I sit and talk cars for an hour while my dentist sees me, he hates all this too.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Thats exactly my point. I don't like it, at all, but I understand it. This is market driven, people are overwhelmingly in support of the CAFE standards, consumers indicate on surveys that fuel economy is their #1 concern when buying a new vehicle, and it makes total sense that Honda would design a car like the Accord to maximize what consumers want, especially when that lines up with what benefits them under the CAFE standards.
I understand it too. But again I ask why ever give us anything good at all if we really don't care? Why could you get that 5.5 NA V8 in an E-Class, not even an upgrade to AMG just as a stand alone option? I see plenty of old E550s out so people clearly chose the better engine, though granted those are luxury cars.
What? Right and wrong now? Nobody is saying that. Why does it bother you so much that I voice my disdain?
Doesn’t bother me at all, but it’s a discussion forum. I’m just offering my opinion same as you.
And yeah, I believe in right and wrong. When you sign a lease you agree to maintain the car per the manufacturers recommendations and that’s what I do.
Of course I understand it. I just don't like it and think it was unnecessary. I'd say they're already meeting CAFE standards. It's not 99%, guys. That's what I'm trying to make you see. Sure, most people don't care but car enthusiasts aren't 1 in 1000. I sit and talk cars for an hour while my dentist sees me, he hates all this too.
CAFE standards will get even stricter. They are preparing for that.
And I absolutely believe that enthusiasts are 1 in 1,000, or less.
I understand it too. But again I ask why ever give us anything good at all if we really don't care? Why could you get that 5.5 NA V8 in an E-Class, not even an upgrade to AMG just as a stand alone option? I see plenty of old E550s out so people clearly chose the better engine, though granted those are luxury cars.
Those are luxury cars designed for enthusiasts. If you want to see what buyers want today, look at all the GLE350s running around. Almost every GLE is a 350…
I can’t recall the last time I saw a short bed with the teeny cab loaded out nice with options. I bet that is fun to drive, and quick.
Those are the trucks I much prefer seeing on the road. This is a much more attractive vehicle than the 4-door variety although no truck design can ever beat this:
02-26-23, 07:16 PM
