General Car Conversation
11-13-23, 09:47 AM
#8056
Super Moderator
the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is legendary for hard starting, overheating, and cracking heads due to that heat. The 6.5L that replaced it also has oiling issues. Oh yeah, the crankshafts like to split in half and the engine blocks crack too. All that for 130hp and 240lbft out of a 6.2L V8. You can increase those figures roughly 50% by adding a turbocharger, but then those things become even MORE frequent.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
11-13-23, 09:51 AM
#8057
Lexus Test Driver
Oh, BMW just can’t make a V8 period end of story and never could. At least, not ones that don’t turn into garbage at silly low mileage. From the Nikasil (sp?) issues in the beginning to the plastic timing chain guides to the valvetrains that turn into messes, hard pass on any BMW V8.
I pretty much meant most V8s in existence other than BMW, lol.
I pretty much meant most V8s in existence other than BMW, lol.
from a quick visit to the wikipedia article it seems like they went away from nikasil to alusil fairly early on, and guess what other V8 uses alusil? the M113
11-13-23, 10:12 AM
#8058
Lexus Champion
the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is legendary for hard starting, overheating, and cracking heads due to that heat. The 6.5L that replaced it also has oiling issues. Oh yeah, the crankshafts like to split in half and the engine blocks crack too. All that for 130hp and 240lbft out of a 6.2L V8. You can increase those figures roughly 50% by adding a turbocharger, but then those things become even MORE frequent.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
I said “most V8s” lol. There used to be so many proven V8s out there.
11-13-23, 10:15 AM
#8059
Lexus Champion
the M62/S62 used in the E39 is (i think lol) generally not too bad... i've driven a 1998 540i with 300k miles that was still running well!
from a quick visit to the wikipedia article it seems like they went away from nikasil to alusil fairly early on, and guess what other V8 uses alusil? the M113
from a quick visit to the wikipedia article it seems like they went away from nikasil to alusil fairly early on, and guess what other V8 uses alusil? the M113
M113 is proven and rock solid. I wouldn’t own the SL if it wasn’t. The last thing someone should would worry about with this car is engine trouble.
11-13-23, 10:30 AM
#8060
the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is legendary for hard starting, overheating, and cracking heads due to that heat. The 6.5L that replaced it also has oiling issues. Oh yeah, the crankshafts like to split in half and the engine blocks crack too. All that for 130hp and 240lbft out of a 6.2L V8. You can increase those figures roughly 50% by adding a turbocharger, but then those things become even MORE frequent.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
By contrast, my BMW diesel with less than half that displacement makes more than double those numbers, and is basically bulletproof.
But yes, generally they're pretty much best in class.
11-13-23, 12:20 PM
#8063
Super Moderator
I was responding to the "you lost me" when BrettJacks mentioned it.
11-13-23, 12:30 PM
#8064
Super Moderator
11-13-23, 01:18 PM
#8065
According to the owner, "it just stopped". They still haven't taken apart the transmission to see if perhaps something over there caused funny things - or suffered. It's an e53 x5 (i.e. ancient) with a not-so-discerning owner, so the possibilities are endless. Regardless, the crank was in two pieces. No other signs of wear, funnily enough - consistent hone on the cylinder walls, all combustion chambers looked alike and alright... go figure. Regardless, over here it's usually bad injectors that "suddenly" cook an M/N57 - or bearings and/or timing chain if not attended to on time.
11-13-23, 01:36 PM
#8066
Super Moderator
That's wild. And yes, the injectors can be problematic, unfortunately like most modern DI diesels. I get it, they have the unenviable job of atomizing oil, opening and closing, with 5000 psi (!!!) of fuel pressure behind them. I had 2 replaced that were out of spec (cylinder smoothness errors), and then about 18 months later another one went, so I had the remaining 4 originals replaced. Should be good for a while now.
At any rate, I agree with @AJT123 's thesis that "in general" V8s get to be lazy and are therefore typically more reliable than similarly-built smaller engines in the same use case.
At any rate, I agree with @AJT123 's thesis that "in general" V8s get to be lazy and are therefore typically more reliable than similarly-built smaller engines in the same use case.
11-13-23, 02:02 PM
#8067
Lexus Test Driver
At any rate, I agree with @AJT123 's thesis that "in general" V8s get to be lazy and are therefore typically more reliable than similarly-built smaller engines in the same use case.
as a former CVPI owner i think one of the best parts of that engine has to be that it makes so much noise and you basically go nowhere, so every merge out of an intersection is like firing up world's wildest police videos on spike TV but then you realize you still haven't even caught up to traffic lmao
11-13-23, 02:21 PM
#8068
Lexus Champion
At any rate, I agree with @AJT123 's thesis that "in general" V8s get to be lazy and are therefore typically more reliable than similarly-built smaller engines in the same use case.
I would argue it until blue in the face. "In general" for sure, of course there are exceptions and have been. 4100 and Northstar come to mind, engines that just came with fatal flaws. How come GM made legendary engines like the 3800 but put that disgrace of a 4100 in Cadillacs or in anything??? (rhetorical) We had an '87 Seville with it and it was PAINFULLLLLLY slow. Then Dad got a 1990 Seville with the 4.5 update which hauled *** pretty much, night and day difference doesn't even begin to describe it.
In trucks, Ecoboost is lottttts of fun (I miss that monster I had in CA as a loaner) but damn that Ecoboost engine is working a million times harder than the Denali's 6.2. So many more moving parts, heat, etc. Add in towing over 200k miles and 10-15 years? Ehhhhh.
The V8 in my SL is so understressed it's almost funny.
V8s just loafing along, how they do, also explains how I get 20-21 MPG on the interstate in an LX570 rated for 17 highway. 21 MPG in a truck designed when nobody cared about fuel economy, pretty impressive.
Last edited by AJT123; 11-13-23 at 02:28 PM.
11-13-23, 03:08 PM
#8070
Lexus Test Driver
At any rate, I agree with @AJT123 's thesis that "in general" V8s get to be lazy and are therefore typically more reliable than similarly-built smaller engines in the same use case.
If you look in the HD truck space, Ford and GM began reversing their trend of downsizing the gas V8's. Throughout the 2010's, Ford was using a SOHC 6.2 and GM was using an OHV 6.0. These were the sole gas engine options in these trucks.
Fast forward to this decade, GM replaced the 6.0 with a 6.6, while maintaining relative simplicity. Ford replaced the 6.2 with a choice of either a 6.8 or 7.3 OHV gas engine. Overbuilt, under stressed, and simple as a modern engine can be while meeting emissions requirements. I'd be shocked if those engines don't all go to 300k with very few issues.