2023 Toyota bZ3 EV sedan
#31
Lexus Fanatic
Toyota's hybrids don't quality for subsidies in China that's why they threw together this car. To be fair this car is riding on the e-TNGA unibody I'm not sure if Toyota ships bodies to China or is made in China.
Yep, Toyota is putting in 50% cash into this specific venture.
Yep, Toyota is putting in 50% cash into this specific venture.
#32
Lexus Fanatic
#33
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Toyota's hybrids don't quality for subsidies in China that's why they threw together this car. To be fair this car is riding on the e-TNGA unibody I'm not sure if Toyota ships bodies to China or is made in China.
Yep, Toyota is putting in 50% cash into this specific venture.
Yep, Toyota is putting in 50% cash into this specific venture.
#34
Lexus Fanatic
This is not correct and what people are pointing out. Toyota is sharing 50% cost in this newly formed company.
I read it somewhere, gain of salt may not be true.
I read it somewhere, gain of salt may not be true.
#35
Lexus Fanatic
#36
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
#37
Lexus Fanatic
That is exactly what I have been saying. You claim Toyota has nothing to do with this, but you are completely wrong. Toyota and BYD own a company they has developed all of this together, this is not BYD slapping a Toyota badge on this. This is how it works in China if Toyota wants to sell there.
If you want to say that I claim that Toyota has a 50% ownership in BYD, then claim it. You are just being pedantic if you do.
The BMW Toyota Supra partnership is different than this. The building of the Supra is not even build by BMW or Toyota. It’s outsourced to a 3rd party.
If you want to say that I claim that Toyota has a 50% ownership in BYD, then claim it. You are just being pedantic if you do.
The BMW Toyota Supra partnership is different than this. The building of the Supra is not even build by BMW or Toyota. It’s outsourced to a 3rd party.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 08-27-22 at 12:11 PM.
#38
Lexus Fanatic
This is not a Toyota it's BYD batteries, motors, software. If Toyota had all the needed hardware they would not be partnering with anyone.
#39
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
That is exactly what I have been saying. You claim Toyota has nothing to do with this, but you are completely wrong. Toyota and BYD own a company they has developed all of this together, this is not BYD slapping a Toyota badge on this. This is how it works in China if Toyota wants to sell there.
So no, Toyota did not develop the major components of this vehicle. It is a badge-engineered BYD.
#40
Lexus Fanatic
Toyota has all the tech. They have the most EV patents. Highest R & D. The point of partnering is to share the cost and make it far cheaper to enter the Chinese market. Toyota also ties themselves up with an established EV or car builder which gives them an enormous competitive advantage in China
#41
Lexus Fanatic
Patents are not products. Toyota's global EV production numbers proves this beyond any doubt.
Is it working?
Toyota's margins are far below the industry leader. What competitive advantage are you talking about specifically? Why would Toyota have a greater advantage than for example BYD.
Highest R & D.
The point of partnering is to share the cost and make it far cheaper to enter the Chinese market. Toyota also ties themselves up with an established EV or car builder which gives them an enormous competitive advantage
#42
Lexus Fanatic
#43
Lexus Fanatic
Except it isn't, from one of the very first responses I gave you:
Once again, read the article. The components are derived entirely from BYD. Not the BYD-Toyota joint venture, these components are used across all of BYD's EV's and existed well before the venture. The venture only exists to package these components into a Toyota-badged product.
So no, Toyota did not develop the major components of this vehicle. It is a badge-engineered BYD.
Once again, read the article. The components are derived entirely from BYD. Not the BYD-Toyota joint venture, these components are used across all of BYD's EV's and existed well before the venture. The venture only exists to package these components into a Toyota-badged product.
So no, Toyota did not develop the major components of this vehicle. It is a badge-engineered BYD.
We really should wait for the Toyota press release
Patents are not products. Toyota's global EV production numbers proves this beyond any doubt.
Is it working?
Toyota's margins are far below the industry leader. What competitive advantage are you talking about specifically? Why would Toyota have a greater advantage than for example BYD.
Is it working?
Toyota's margins are far below the industry leader. What competitive advantage are you talking about specifically? Why would Toyota have a greater advantage than for example BYD.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 08-27-22 at 12:36 PM.
#44
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Maybe Toyota is using the E-TNGA chassis or did all the body design but nothing on the motor design
Last edited by Motorola; 08-27-22 at 12:44 PM.
#45
Lexus Fanatic
The only thing I'm certain Toyota did was the body design since we saw the concept, which is the same as what they did for the Supra. Perhaps some suspension tuning and NVH. But mechanically, it's a BYD underneath. And like I said to Lex, I doubt this is E-TNGA because that was developed exclusively for use between Toyota and Subaru, not BYD, and may not even be compatible with BYD's powertrains.
Why wouldn’t you wait for the official press release?
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 08-27-22 at 12:49 PM.