lexus vs bmw suvs
11-13-22, 02:56 PM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
After my latest experience with German Cars, I've sworn them off and just sold them both. Back to Lexus for me. Happy to have gotten one of the last 22 RX 350 Luxury. I love the naturally aspirated reliable V6, normal non lithium battery, tires that aren't high performance and easier to get. gated non electronic shifter, cd player (makes me old I know, but sounds amazing), full size spare, uses regular gas. It's so relaxing to drive. And our Lexus dealer offers pickup and delivery, has their own loaners available, and has their own roadside assistance to do things like change batteries onsite. That's luxury. Our local BMW and Porsche dealers don't have all of those things. My time is valuable, I have better things to do than deal with problems at my inconvenience. Especially to have both in for repair at the same time (one for 3 weeks) and be told no loaners available.
11-13-22, 03:08 PM
#17
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None of the other Luxury car dealers here offer all of those things in one of the largest metro areas in the United States, with the exception of maybe a Cadillac dealer. I wish my BMW's and Porsche's were as reliable as my Lexus, but they were not.
Last edited by Sodbuster1; 11-13-22 at 03:12 PM.
11-13-22, 03:20 PM
#18
Lexus Champion
I can pull most RWD cars engines out in under 6 hours, some in as little as 2.5. FWD usually takes longer or is far far more involved and usually requires a subframe drop.
11-13-22, 03:28 PM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
Long term your S class will start to have nagging issues. German cars are notorious for being unreliable out of warranty. They are also very expensive to service as well
11-13-22, 03:35 PM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Now that I know more about Mercedes and this car specifically, i wouldn't be concerned about keeping it. I think this vs an LS460 or an LS500, will be very similar.
Outside of this I know lots of people with other German cars that are older and they don't have issues either. Much of this "German cars are unreliable" stuff is not actually true.
11-13-22, 03:52 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
My brother is on his third German car. His BMW diesel with 100K has a constant nagging CEL. His rubber bushings needed replacement. Has a faulty tire pressure system so it no longer works. It’s 7 years old. His first gas MB had a failed engine, so he is now on his 2nd MB and it is diesel now but it is a GLE or whatever the model replaced that. I also have a friend who has an S class like your, her phone always has problems synching with the screens and she also hesitation issues when starting after stopping. Lastly, another friend of mine has a Golf R and has constant coolant burning or leaking issue where he always needs to add coolant. The VW is new. My brothers German cars are all used.
But, they all love their German branded car.
But, they all love their German branded car.
11-13-22, 04:05 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
My brother is on his third German car. His BMW diesel with 100K has a constant nagging CEL. His rubber bushings needed replacement. Has a faulty tire pressure system so it no longer works. It’s 7 years old. His first gas MB had a failed engine, so he is now on his 2nd MB and it is diesel now but it is a GLE or whatever the model replaced that. I also have a friend who has an S class like your, her phone always has problems synching with the screens and she also hesitation issues when starting after stopping. Lastly, another friend of mine has a Golf R and has constant coolant burning or leaking issue where he always needs to add coolant. The VW is new. My brothers German cars are all used.
But, they all love their German branded car.
But, they all love their German branded car.
Part of the reason why Toyotas are so reliable is they are so simple. When you look at something like an LS460, which begins to get more sophisticated like a German car you all of a sudden get brake actuator issues, hard wearing suspension bushings, oil burning at high mileage, coolant leaks into the engine V. When you look at something even more complex like an LS500, you see even more "German car problems". No doubt something like an RX350 with the 3.5 V6 is going to be way more reliable long term than say, an X5 or GLE, but its a much less sophisticated car. So, which do you want? I envy people who could be happy with a car like that and drive it for a decade, but thats not me. I want a better car than that.
The question will be as Toyotas get more complex, will they stay as reliable? I don't think they will.
11-13-22, 04:35 PM
#23
Lexus Champion
The other simple reality is that German cars are easier to work on than the few cars Lexus makes that I would consider on that same level. I would rather work on my D4 any day vs my 460
11-13-22, 04:48 PM
#24
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Nobody is going to say they are as reliable as a Toyota, but if you do research and find the right model, its really not that big a deal. Those issues with the S Class aren't typical, if they were we would hear about them on the forums. GLE and ML models though, not nearly as reliable. E Class, very reliable. GLC seems to be quite reliable, same with the C Class.
Part of the reason why Toyotas are so reliable is they are so simple. When you look at something like an LS460, which begins to get more sophisticated like a German car you all of a sudden get brake actuator issues, hard wearing suspension bushings, oil burning at high mileage, coolant leaks into the engine V. When you look at something even more complex like an LS500, you see even more "German car problems". No doubt something like an RX350 with the 3.5 V6 is going to be way more reliable long term than say, an X5 or GLE, but its a much less sophisticated car. So, which do you want? I envy people who could be happy with a car like that and drive it for a decade, but thats not me. I want a better car than that.
The question will be as Toyotas get more complex, will they stay as reliable? I don't think they will.
Part of the reason why Toyotas are so reliable is they are so simple. When you look at something like an LS460, which begins to get more sophisticated like a German car you all of a sudden get brake actuator issues, hard wearing suspension bushings, oil burning at high mileage, coolant leaks into the engine V. When you look at something even more complex like an LS500, you see even more "German car problems". No doubt something like an RX350 with the 3.5 V6 is going to be way more reliable long term than say, an X5 or GLE, but its a much less sophisticated car. So, which do you want? I envy people who could be happy with a car like that and drive it for a decade, but thats not me. I want a better car than that.
The question will be as Toyotas get more complex, will they stay as reliable? I don't think they will.
11-13-22, 05:11 PM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
The additional sophistication is not an opinion, its a fact. Whether that sophistication matters to you or not is an opinion.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
Something like an LS or a GS or an IS or an LC actually does have the same level of sophistication in its powertrain and suspension design that the Germans havem but the RX, ES, NX do not, they are essentially Camry/Avalons. Same is true of something like an Infiniti QX60, even an Acura MDX although the MDX is a little more sophisticated.
But, preferring a car that is less sophisticated and more reliable is a valid preference, its just not something I could ever do. As soon as I drive something like an RX or ES or Highlander or Camry or something like that I immediately miss the sophistication I'm used to.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
Something like an LS or a GS or an IS or an LC actually does have the same level of sophistication in its powertrain and suspension design that the Germans havem but the RX, ES, NX do not, they are essentially Camry/Avalons. Same is true of something like an Infiniti QX60, even an Acura MDX although the MDX is a little more sophisticated.
But, preferring a car that is less sophisticated and more reliable is a valid preference, its just not something I could ever do. As soon as I drive something like an RX or ES or Highlander or Camry or something like that I immediately miss the sophistication I'm used to.
11-13-22, 05:15 PM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
It depends. Ironically Lexus forced the Germans to become better about reliability, I would rank my D4 not too far behind my 460 if at all. The W222s also now have a great record and the trio of German 4.0TT engines are literally the best engines ever made pound for pound stock.
The other simple reality is that German cars are easier to work on than the few cars Lexus makes that I would consider on that same level. I would rather work on my D4 any day vs my 460
The other simple reality is that German cars are easier to work on than the few cars Lexus makes that I would consider on that same level. I would rather work on my D4 any day vs my 460
Nobody is going to say they are as reliable as a Toyota, but if you do research and find the right model, its really not that big a deal. Those issues with the S Class aren't typical, if they were we would hear about them on the forums. GLE and ML models though, not nearly as reliable. E Class, very reliable. GLC seems to be quite reliable, same with the C Class.
Part of the reason why Toyotas are so reliable is they are so simple. When you look at something like an LS460, which begins to get more sophisticated like a German car you all of a sudden get brake actuator issues, hard wearing suspension bushings, oil burning at high mileage, coolant leaks into the engine V. When you look at something even more complex like an LS500, you see even more "German car problems". No doubt something like an RX350 with the 3.5 V6 is going to be way more reliable long term than say, an X5 or GLE, but its a much less sophisticated car. So, which do you want? I envy people who could be happy with a car like that and drive it for a decade, but thats not me. I want a better car than that.
The question will be as Toyotas get more complex, will they stay as reliable? I don't think they will.
Part of the reason why Toyotas are so reliable is they are so simple. When you look at something like an LS460, which begins to get more sophisticated like a German car you all of a sudden get brake actuator issues, hard wearing suspension bushings, oil burning at high mileage, coolant leaks into the engine V. When you look at something even more complex like an LS500, you see even more "German car problems". No doubt something like an RX350 with the 3.5 V6 is going to be way more reliable long term than say, an X5 or GLE, but its a much less sophisticated car. So, which do you want? I envy people who could be happy with a car like that and drive it for a decade, but thats not me. I want a better car than that.
The question will be as Toyotas get more complex, will they stay as reliable? I don't think they will.
The additional sophistication is not an opinion, its a fact. Whether that sophistication matters to you or not is an opinion.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 11-13-22 at 05:18 PM.
11-13-22, 05:20 PM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
That doesn't change the differences between these specific models. Comparing an RX to an X5 is like comparing an ES to a 5 Series. They just aren't peers. RX is much better compared with the other asian competitors like the QX60, MDX, etc.
11-13-22, 05:22 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
What you mean? My guess is the powertrain of the new RX 500h with the electric axle, four wheel steering, turbo, AVs, 6 speed, hybrid and full time awd is a far more sophisticated than what the X5 offers.
‘I would never ever compare a RX to a X5.
‘I would never ever compare a RX to a X5.
11-13-22, 05:23 PM
#29
Lexus Fanatic
It will always be FWD and macpherson strut with all stamped steel and no advanced materials, its just built to a lower standard. Its not meant to compete with the X5. A hybrid turbo 4 cyl changes none of that.
11-13-22, 05:24 PM
#30
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The additional sophistication is not an opinion, its a fact. Whether that sophistication matters to you or not is an opinion.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
Something like an LS or a GS or an IS or an LC actually does have the same level of sophistication in its powertrain and suspension design that the Germans havem but the RX, ES, NX do not, they are essentially Camry/Avalons. Same is true of something like an Infiniti QX60, even an Acura MDX although the MDX is a little more sophisticated.
But, preferring a car that is less sophisticated and more reliable is a valid preference, its just not something I could ever do. As soon as I drive something like an RX or ES or Highlander or Camry or something like that I immediately miss the sophistication I'm used to.
Factually an RX350 is a much less sophisticated car than an X5. Its FWD transverse layout, BMW X5 is longitudinal RWD layout. RX has machpherson strut suspension like almost all other FWD cars, which is a rudimentary inexpensive suspension layout, BMW X5 has a multi-link suspension that delivers a much more dynamic driving experience. RX is all stamped steel, X5 has a lot of aluminum and other more expensive and lighter materials. That doesn't even get into the differences in sound deadening, material options inside, etc. The X5 is on another level from an RX.
Something like an LS or a GS or an IS or an LC actually does have the same level of sophistication in its powertrain and suspension design that the Germans havem but the RX, ES, NX do not, they are essentially Camry/Avalons. Same is true of something like an Infiniti QX60, even an Acura MDX although the MDX is a little more sophisticated.
But, preferring a car that is less sophisticated and more reliable is a valid preference, its just not something I could ever do. As soon as I drive something like an RX or ES or Highlander or Camry or something like that I immediately miss the sophistication I'm used to.