HOMER350

Jumped forums from the IS over here to ask you all for your input. Any us appreciated!

I'll skip most of the background but I currently have a 14 IS350 Obsidian, 105k miles runs perfect. Minus the rock chips up front very clean car, love it (but have come to hate the black).

My commute is going to grow substantially and my financial plans are calling for more savings where I can. So I'm considering trading down and/or for more economic vehicle. but would like to stay within the Toyota/Lexus lineup.

I may go all the way back to the 2000s on an ES or to a 2013 camry...or a CT, I'm all over the place (maybe a rav4? Lol) but the CT cleanliness and mpg has got me interested.

I have to admit I've not searched through your forums to fill my own answers YET.

1. Which years should I avoid? My 14 IS is fine but is the 1st model year of the 3rd gen and is more prone to "common" issues.
2. Is a 2012 as solid as a 2015? Same thing basically? I see the facelift.
3. Looking to spend $14-$16k. Realistic?
4. 70k miles too much to start with on this hybrid? I do 25k miles a year probably.
5. A cross member between CT and IS has called this the new 90s Carolla in terms of reliability. Do we mostly agree?
6. Can I expect +35 mpg doing 90% hwy?
7. This is the same engine as a prius correct? How would you compare this to a prius?
8. I prefer a basic no nav model (but bsm would be nice). Will I have a hard time finding one? Seems like I won't so far.

I'll follow up with more as they come but those are my immediate concerns..

sjw91

There are people on here that can be more explicit on the reasons, but the 2015+ cars are the best bet. There are potential issues that begin with the EGR cooler that can develop after 100k, and the revisions in 2014 and 2015 may improve that. You'll see similar comments on the Prius. But there are also lots of cars with well over 200k that had no issues.

There was a facelift/interior update in 2014, and I personally think the little changes are worth it. It's nicer than the earlier cars I drove. But the overall reliability is great on all of them.

I've averaged around 44mpg overal, which is mostly city. I don't think I've got much less than 40 doing just highway.

Opinions will vary, but I'd suggest a Camry Hybrid if you're doing 90% highway. Probably the same gas mileage, with a better/quieter ride, a larger interior and a stronger engine.

E46CT

See my past posts on this topic but 2014 saw mechanical revisions namely to piston, rings, intake manifold and a few other engine parts. 2014 also saw 94 engineering structural changes to improve noise and harshness. And 2015 saw additional structural safety enhancements.

2014 is the way to go, and 2015+ even better for safety.

35 mpg highway? hah. try 50. I'm able to get about 53mpg consistently if i do all highway. One time pegged 55. 50 without trying with ac on. easy.

The entire powertrain is the same as prius. the difference particularly for 2014+ models is toyota further revised the software control for the engine to be more refined.

16k is about what to expect for an F sport model 14+. Go for it. 70k is fine.. at 75-100k though i'd replace or service the EGR cooler, egr pipe, egr valve. not expensive.

HOMER350

Thanks for the input. Ha, I like the camry hybrid but I got a thing for Lexus refinement. I will be shopping both though! Never drove a hybrid and never worked on one so I'm pretty clueless.
There you are lol. I hear about your CT over on IS forums.

So I'm gonna narrow this down to 2015+ and see what kind of deal I can work. It kind of depends on how the sell goes with the IS350 as I don't want to trade it as I'd take a loss.

Been reading about the EGR and thst doesn't scare me. But to get updated piston/rings on 15+ (think I saw 14 was pistons and 15 was rings) thats a selling point for me. But I won't cross off 13 just yet if lower mileage.

Haha and yeah now that I think of it 35 is almost what I got in my 1.8L so I should expect much more here. Again, never drove or researched a hybrid. But I saw 42 combined is what they say so I figured real life may be lower. Im sure I'd be 90% acceleration everywhere I went though.

Thanks for your input ill probably bug you again if I decide on a CT

E46CT

Yeah if you saw 14 pistons, 15 rings, that was me. I researched and posted all changes here. specific changes. there's more. but those are the basics. The 15+ rings stuff...that's all but confirmed. just a strong hunch in terms of the separation between 14 and 15. i'd get the 15+ anyway just for the safety enhancements alone. then you're guaranteed to have the latest engine parts.

also if i'm not mistaken they changed one of the cam sprockets too improve harmonics. i think i posted about it before.

E46CT

Oh also consider 16 and up got the front bumper lower trim chromed out. 15 has painted plastic. i upgraded this piece for $280 lol. (i used to have as 16) i have a 15 now.

HOMER350

Check and check ✔ thanks.
Yeah I saw that upgrade lol.

Lexmex

For what it is worth, I listened to many of the same people above and their quality comments when I made the decision on getting my 2016. Thanks to all of you.

My CT is non-nav and got it for about 17K total price with 32K mileage. Although I tested a 2014 nav version F-sport, I could save money and get 2 years newer, lower mileage.

I could not be happier with this vehicle and have taken a few trips around Florida with it and virtually always 40+ mpg with it and just an oil change thus far.

I had considered some other Lexus models, but what sold me was the more simple nature of the maintenance and the engine design over some of the other vehicles I looked at. My old RX300 had a tough time at the end before I put it out to pasture despite all the efforts I put into it, but given I am driving longer distances now and I do not live with what I used to in Mexico, this was a real no brainer. I wish they would keep selling this vehicle in the US as opposed to the rest of the world, but I am certain by the time I ever give up on this vehicle, the technology will be amazing as I had my RX300 for 18 years and so much changed over that time.

HOMER350

I would of made the same choice on 14 vs 16 you did, and thst looks like a great price otd of 32k miles, based on what I'm finding.

Think its awesome you drove the RX for 18 years! Those are great cars, at least as far as reliability. How many miles did it have on it?
I was shopping for one but got a CPO Hyundai SUV too good a deal.

My idea with the IS was to keep it forever, and I'm sure it'd last. Fun to drive too enjoy it everyday. I just am piling the miles on it and its not as fast as I'd like anyways...so I think why not save a few bucks and put the miles on something that takes less gas. Do my fun car later.
kind of looks like itd be an even trade though for a CT for me...I still owe on it about what a CT would cost, but with less mileage.

I now know at least if I do a CT i want 15+. This may all rest on what offers i get on the IS private party. A dilemma im not liking. Especially because its got several mods i would prefer not to remove lol.

Lexmex

My RX300 got up to 198K and I wanted to keep that RX for as long as I could but the ultimate decision came down to replacing the engine internals and/or the engine with regard to what needed to be done, but when I realized I was going to be driving more here (and Miami-Dade County is a car town), I parted with it. As time has gone by, I do realize I did the right thing and that wonderful RX300 had a long and colorful life (you need only click on the link in my signature and see all the photos to know why) as it was a very important part of my life and did help teach me a lot of things, not just mechanics.

The 2016 CT I bought was the best I could find within the area at the time (basically Miami-Dade and Broward) and there were actually 2015 CTs around the same price and mileage, but went with the best I could find. In the months since January, turns out that it was a very good deal.

Khaotic

I was under the same dilemma that you are now when I purchased my 2014 F-Sport in Ultra Sonic Mica Blue. I wanted that specific color with all options, including the optional LED headlight package, and I wanted it to be 2015 or newer. I new straight away I wanted no part of the 2013 and earlier models as well. I searched for months on end trying to find a unicorn. I finally gave up on the Adaptive Cruise option when I found my 2014 with all options minus Adaptive Cruise. At the time dealers wanted 26k-32k for 2015 or newer low mileage CT200H F-Sports with less options than my current 2014 F-Sport model.

During Christmas week of 2018 I made a cash offer of $18500, down from the $21500 they were asking. Only option missing was Adaptive Cruise and it had 28k miles with a flawless Lexus service history. Took them the better part of the day, but they ended up accepting my offer and I had it shipped to my house (1800 miles away lol) after a Facetime walk around and test drive.The dealership even tossed in a brand new set of tires. In my mind the only thing that I am really missing from being in a 2014 is the piston ring upgrade. The ultimate deciding factor for me was the options, but the second deciding factor was that if the motor was to implode I am literally able to drop a factory new 2015+ Lexus drive train in and still come out with cash in my pocket. I wasn't as concerned with the small safety upgrades, as the CT200H already feels like a tank compared to my previous 2000 Insight, and from my understanding still holds no known crash fatality rating. To me it just all made sense to go 2014, but you might find it makes more sense for you to go 2015+.

HOMER350

Your 14 FS looks awesome, always loved that blue. The black contrast on the front looks great.
I like the touches on the F-Sport but its not a necessity. Besides really hard to find and the couple I did find were as much as $2k more...thats steep.
I did need the LEDs on the IS but I'm thinking I can do an aftermarket LED upgrade on the CT and be happy with it.

Im thinking so much about the CT last few days and I still have not yet driven one.
I sure hope they're comfortable! I'm 5'10", and seats look like they have the same maneuverability as I'm used to. Hopefully the bottom cushion isn't smaller than the IS though.

I'm shopping 15-16 CTs, open to a 14 if it were a killer deal.

Contacted 2 dealers. Both 2016s, about 45k miles low 15000s.
Asking them earlier this evening to do appraisals on my car before making the trip up there as they're both about 90 miles from me.

Khaotic

Thanks for the compliment! Its the color that really had me drawn to the car. I personally went with the F-Sport model just because I thought the paint(has to be F-Sport to get the Ultra Sonic Mica Blue color) aero options, and rims really set it off. The LED package on the CT200H has the auto-leveling feature and a couple other smaller things that comes with it. If you can find one with it I do recommend, but it may indeed cost you a little bit more.

It's funny you should mention the IS350. I get those all the times for loaner vehicles when I go in for an oil change (every 5k miles). The first time that I planted my **** in those seats I was in disbelief at how narrow the seats were. I'm 6'2 and 200lbs, in basketball shape mind you, and I felt like a whale who couldn't squeeze into the pool. The CT200H seat is much nicer to me in that area, and I have plenty of head room at my height with the seat in the position that I like. These things really have quite a bit of space also with the seats down. I like to think of it a s a tiny SUV in some ways.

Overall the IS350 is a different driving experience. After having the CT200H for nearly a year and a half now, I would not want to switch to the IS350. From my understanding the tires cannot be rotated due to the different sizing, which is just not ideal for my commute mileage and the price of tires these days. The IS350 does have a few options that I wish the CT200H came with, like air condition seats and the bigger displays, but I can't stand the transmission in the IS350. I believe the smoothness of the CT200H on the interstate is what makes the vehicle so great for me. With the IS350 it feels like it's constantly hunting for a gear. Just not my cup of tea, and I typically like sportier cars. I'd say build quality is roughly the same, but the IS350 feels more edgy, and perhaps slightly eclipses the CT200H in material quality.

As for mileage, I live in hilly terrain in east Tennessee. but I wouldn't quite call it mountains. It's basically an up and down roller-coaster of roads. I typically average around 39.5 mpg - 41..5 mpg throughout different season of the year, while driving at roughly 80mph on this terrain. The only time I get less than 39.5 mpg is if I am exceeding 90mph over a long trip or if it is brutally cold outside, say 10 degrees on a February morning with heavy air. My highest total over a tank was 46 mpg, but I can't stand to travel at speeds that slow all the time. If your commute is a two lane highway with a 55mph speed limit you will exceed 40 mpg easily if you have any type of throttle control abilities whatsoever. Having come from one of the the most fuel efficient platform ever offered in the Gen 1 Insight, I had already learned throttle control in an effort to keep the Insight in lean burn at highways speeds. After having that car for so long I pretty much drive every car the same way now.

As for a Prius, I say go with the CT200H all the way. Very similar mechanically, and really not a massive difference in price. Definitely a more refined vehicle in my eyes. I haven't priced a CT200H since I was shopping for mine, but if you have cash be aggressive. Take control of the conversation early and don't be afraid to walk. I would offer a minimum 15% less than asking price, possibly more if you were interested. Always be prepared to walk. The end of the month is a great time as dealers are eager to move inventory. If they can make money on a vehicle and move it they will, especially right now when interest really is down. I wouldn't consider a CT200H a highly searched for vehicle, as most people have no clue these things even exist honestly. Most CT's will linger on a lot for a local lot for quite a while, so don't be afraid to put the dealer in a realistic pricing corner and try to beat'em up a little. If they know your a definitive buyer and are ready to purchase most dealers will drop the games and come to terms with what they can and can't do really quick.

phillymac

Color certainly makes all the difference in such a car. I have the 2016 Special Edition F-Sport with red/black interior. I have had it just about a year and love it even more every day. Mine has the Lexus Enform system so I can remote start from my phone and a few other settings. I do have to pay monthly/yearly for the feature but living in the Northeast(cold winters), its worth it to me. These cars really are bargains when you think about a Lexus and Hybrid for around 20k!

E46CT

The seats are decent.. not on the level of our 3IS F Sports (as you recall I had a 2016 IS F Sport). I wish the lower thigh cushion was longer or extenddable since I'm 6', but overall it's comfortable and i've done long trips in it. The drivers door where you'd rest your knee is hard plastic so on long trips it can become uncomfortable in that particular spot. I remedied this short term by buying some padded seatbelt covers and cut it to shape and used velcro to stick it on. It fit well and did the job giving my knee a soft place to wrest but it looked out of place. I'm still trying to come up with a nice solution.

It's no luxury car but it's decently nice and certain a step up from a Prius. (which i've also owned)

Sure I could go out and lease a 2020 ES300h (what I really want) but for now I just want to have a "cheap" car pay it off and be done with it

Also after driving your 3IS, the first immediate thought you'll have is hmm this car feels top heavy.. feels like you're sitting on top of a couch on wheels.. but that feeling goes away pretty quickly. Then the car feels like it handles well (a compliment coming from me after having hand built track ready BMWs)