Thinking about Air Tools...need advice
05-20-12, 01:12 AM
#1
Thinking about Air Tools...need advice
So I'm going to need to replace my struts in the near future, and I'm thinking of doing it all myself, since it's pretty straight forward. I also considered the cost of paying a mechanic to do the install and it seems like a much better deal to just buy a used compressor with an an impact gun.
Looking around on craigslist, there is a lot of good deals to be had. There is just one problem, I don't know what I need.
What kind of specs should I look for, if I just want to remove 14 year old strut mounting bolts? If this goes as planned, I would also like to replace my driver side CV axle, so I need enough torque to remove the axle nut.
How many gallons, PSI, motor, etc? Anything I should be aware of?
Looking around on craigslist, there is a lot of good deals to be had. There is just one problem, I don't know what I need.
What kind of specs should I look for, if I just want to remove 14 year old strut mounting bolts? If this goes as planned, I would also like to replace my driver side CV axle, so I need enough torque to remove the axle nut.
How many gallons, PSI, motor, etc? Anything I should be aware of?
05-20-12, 10:05 AM
#2
Lead Lap
If you just want an impact tool at home, I'd think about the electric tools. Electric impact wrenches used to be a joke, but now there are a number of corded and cordless models that can get the job done, and if you factor in all the costs, you could by the best cordless impact for the price to set yourself up with the most basic air tools.
Air has benefits, very powerful tools and tons of attachments. Investing in air is nice if you want power wrenches, fill your tires, maybe get a sandblasting cabinet. Most home compressors are loud, really loud. Tank size almost doesn't matter because the compressor will be cycling on and off most of the time when you use it. Pay attention to flow not just psi, like buying a turbo. Good air tools use bigger fittings and need lots of air flow.
If you are looking at used stuff and serious about air, I would look for old industrial/shop grade compressors. A friend of mine has a shop and has picked up a couple of old compressors, one old shop two cylinder that is pretty quiet, and this scroll compressor industrial unit that you can't even hear. Meanwhile over at another friends place he has the typical tigthly wound single piston Craftsman, you want to leave the Garage when that thing cycles on and you feel bad for the neighborhood.
IMO if you don't want more than impact, go electric.
I've done a number of struts without impact, either you can hold the strut shaft with the built in hex, or get creative to hold the shaft while you break the top nut free. Never had an issue with the lower strut clevis bolts, my Craftsman super-long 1/2" breaker takes them right off. I have struts to go on my ES300 and I'll be doing them myself, no air tools. I am thinking about getting a Cordless impact though.
Air has benefits, very powerful tools and tons of attachments. Investing in air is nice if you want power wrenches, fill your tires, maybe get a sandblasting cabinet. Most home compressors are loud, really loud. Tank size almost doesn't matter because the compressor will be cycling on and off most of the time when you use it. Pay attention to flow not just psi, like buying a turbo. Good air tools use bigger fittings and need lots of air flow.
If you are looking at used stuff and serious about air, I would look for old industrial/shop grade compressors. A friend of mine has a shop and has picked up a couple of old compressors, one old shop two cylinder that is pretty quiet, and this scroll compressor industrial unit that you can't even hear. Meanwhile over at another friends place he has the typical tigthly wound single piston Craftsman, you want to leave the Garage when that thing cycles on and you feel bad for the neighborhood.
IMO if you don't want more than impact, go electric.
I've done a number of struts without impact, either you can hold the strut shaft with the built in hex, or get creative to hold the shaft while you break the top nut free. Never had an issue with the lower strut clevis bolts, my Craftsman super-long 1/2" breaker takes them right off. I have struts to go on my ES300 and I'll be doing them myself, no air tools. I am thinking about getting a Cordless impact though.
05-20-12, 07:02 PM
#3
If you just want an impact tool at home, I'd think about the electric tools. Electric impact wrenches used to be a joke, but now there are a number of corded and cordless models that can get the job done, and if you factor in all the costs, you could by the best cordless impact for the price to set yourself up with the most basic air tools.
Air has benefits, very powerful tools and tons of attachments. Investing in air is nice if you want power wrenches, fill your tires, maybe get a sandblasting cabinet. Most home compressors are loud, really loud. Tank size almost doesn't matter because the compressor will be cycling on and off most of the time when you use it. Pay attention to flow not just psi, like buying a turbo. Good air tools use bigger fittings and need lots of air flow.
If you are looking at used stuff and serious about air, I would look for old industrial/shop grade compressors. A friend of mine has a shop and has picked up a couple of old compressors, one old shop two cylinder that is pretty quiet, and this scroll compressor industrial unit that you can't even hear. Meanwhile over at another friends place he has the typical tigthly wound single piston Craftsman, you want to leave the Garage when that thing cycles on and you feel bad for the neighborhood.
IMO if you don't want more than impact, go electric.
I've done a number of struts without impact, either you can hold the strut shaft with the built in hex, or get creative to hold the shaft while you break the top nut free. Never had an issue with the lower strut clevis bolts, my Craftsman super-long 1/2" breaker takes them right off. I have struts to go on my ES300 and I'll be doing them myself, no air tools. I am thinking about getting a Cordless impact though.
Air has benefits, very powerful tools and tons of attachments. Investing in air is nice if you want power wrenches, fill your tires, maybe get a sandblasting cabinet. Most home compressors are loud, really loud. Tank size almost doesn't matter because the compressor will be cycling on and off most of the time when you use it. Pay attention to flow not just psi, like buying a turbo. Good air tools use bigger fittings and need lots of air flow.
If you are looking at used stuff and serious about air, I would look for old industrial/shop grade compressors. A friend of mine has a shop and has picked up a couple of old compressors, one old shop two cylinder that is pretty quiet, and this scroll compressor industrial unit that you can't even hear. Meanwhile over at another friends place he has the typical tigthly wound single piston Craftsman, you want to leave the Garage when that thing cycles on and you feel bad for the neighborhood.
IMO if you don't want more than impact, go electric.
I've done a number of struts without impact, either you can hold the strut shaft with the built in hex, or get creative to hold the shaft while you break the top nut free. Never had an issue with the lower strut clevis bolts, my Craftsman super-long 1/2" breaker takes them right off. I have struts to go on my ES300 and I'll be doing them myself, no air tools. I am thinking about getting a Cordless impact though.
Now there is also a Milwaukee Cordless Wrench with a whopping 450 ft. lbs. and a relatively compact size. It has stellar reviews and seems to be the tool of choice with mechanics. The only downside is its high price ($340 on Amazon).
One part of me wants to settle with the cheaper DeWALT, but the other one is telling me to "go big or go home". I feel like I'll appreciate the smaller size of the Milwaukee and its hassle-free cordless design.
05-20-12, 08:41 PM
#6
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If you are talking about the big bolt that holds the shock and spring on just get a breaker bar, I'm not sure where those numbers come from but they don't have much to do with what a bolt is torqued to. I have a 700 pound one that has a difficult time on my Tahoe on the wheel lugs. You would need to go to 3/4 inch to get more power. You definetely don't need one to remove the struts.
05-21-12, 07:07 AM
#7
Lead Lap
The hard part of a strut change is the top strut nut. Assuming you need to take the strut apart to re-use springs, seats etc. If you are swapping whole struts thats like an hour job lol.
You never know what is in store with the top nut, you almost always need some sort of pass through socket so you can hold the hex in the shaft to remove/install that top nut. Even then, most times you will round out the hex before you get enough torque to break the top nut free or torque it fully. This is where some careful techniques, like lifting up the dust boot and grabbing the strut shaft with thick rubber sheet and pliers can help, that is what I have done but not a technique for the newb, at least not on a new strut or one you want to re-use.
If you have an impact tool, the strut nuts are no big deal, so there is a use here albeit small. For me, having the tools that ensure no matter what happens I can finish the job is key. I hate to start something and have to put it back together with the old parts or leave the car for a week while I get a new tool.
The torque rating is of an impact gun is "instantaneous" torque for breaking a fastener free, which for a rusted lug nut originally torqued to 100ft-lbs could be quite high. Also just becuase the tools says 700 ft-lb doesn't mean the air compressor, lines, fittings etc that you are using are capable of flowing the air volume and pressure that such a tool takes to produce that torque.
You never know what is in store with the top nut, you almost always need some sort of pass through socket so you can hold the hex in the shaft to remove/install that top nut. Even then, most times you will round out the hex before you get enough torque to break the top nut free or torque it fully. This is where some careful techniques, like lifting up the dust boot and grabbing the strut shaft with thick rubber sheet and pliers can help, that is what I have done but not a technique for the newb, at least not on a new strut or one you want to re-use.
If you have an impact tool, the strut nuts are no big deal, so there is a use here albeit small. For me, having the tools that ensure no matter what happens I can finish the job is key. I hate to start something and have to put it back together with the old parts or leave the car for a week while I get a new tool.
The torque rating is of an impact gun is "instantaneous" torque for breaking a fastener free, which for a rusted lug nut originally torqued to 100ft-lbs could be quite high. Also just becuase the tools says 700 ft-lb doesn't mean the air compressor, lines, fittings etc that you are using are capable of flowing the air volume and pressure that such a tool takes to produce that torque.
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05-21-12, 09:43 AM
#8
If you are talking about the big bolt that holds the shock and spring on just get a breaker bar, I'm not sure where those numbers come from but they don't have much to do with what a bolt is torqued to. I have a 700 pound one that has a difficult time on my Tahoe on the wheel lugs. You would need to go to 3/4 inch to get more power. You definetely don't need one to remove the struts.
The hard part of a strut change is the top strut nut. Assuming you need to take the strut apart to re-use springs, seats etc. If you are swapping whole struts thats like an hour job lol.
You never know what is in store with the top nut, you almost always need some sort of pass through socket so you can hold the hex in the shaft to remove/install that top nut. Even then, most times you will round out the hex before you get enough torque to break the top nut free or torque it fully. This is where some careful techniques, like lifting up the dust boot and grabbing the strut shaft with thick rubber sheet and pliers can help, that is what I have done but not a technique for the newb, at least not on a new strut or one you want to re-use.
If you have an impact tool, the strut nuts are no big deal, so there is a use here albeit small. For me, having the tools that ensure no matter what happens I can finish the job is key. I hate to start something and have to put it back together with the old parts or leave the car for a week while I get a new tool.
The torque rating is of an impact gun is "instantaneous" torque for breaking a fastener free, which for a rusted lug nut originally torqued to 100ft-lbs could be quite high. Also just becuase the tools says 700 ft-lb doesn't mean the air compressor, lines, fittings etc that you are using are capable of flowing the air volume and pressure that such a tool takes to produce that torque.
You never know what is in store with the top nut, you almost always need some sort of pass through socket so you can hold the hex in the shaft to remove/install that top nut. Even then, most times you will round out the hex before you get enough torque to break the top nut free or torque it fully. This is where some careful techniques, like lifting up the dust boot and grabbing the strut shaft with thick rubber sheet and pliers can help, that is what I have done but not a technique for the newb, at least not on a new strut or one you want to re-use.
If you have an impact tool, the strut nuts are no big deal, so there is a use here albeit small. For me, having the tools that ensure no matter what happens I can finish the job is key. I hate to start something and have to put it back together with the old parts or leave the car for a week while I get a new tool.
The torque rating is of an impact gun is "instantaneous" torque for breaking a fastener free, which for a rusted lug nut originally torqued to 100ft-lbs could be quite high. Also just becuase the tools says 700 ft-lb doesn't mean the air compressor, lines, fittings etc that you are using are capable of flowing the air volume and pressure that such a tool takes to produce that torque.
Oh and I'm planning on building my struts piece by piece. KYB struts with H&R springs and KYB or Toyota mounts/rubber insulators.
05-21-12, 09:34 PM
#9
The Dewalt impact is pretty weak. The rocker switch is really annoying, plus it's BIG and BULKY for the little power it puts out. If you ever have the chance to drop by Home Depot, you can get a feel for it. While you're there, play with the Milwaukee M18 cordless impact (450ftlbs). Yes it cost more than the Dewalt, but it's more powerful, lighter, and more compact. Plus the warranty is great! This is one of those times where you get what you pay for. The Milwaukee impact is an outstanding gun and WILL remove axle nuts. On the bad side, you might end up wanting to buy more Milwaukee M18 products to use with your battery 
Of course a breaker bar will suffice, but I can when you're dealing with 20 lug nuts for a tire rotation, air/cordless tools speed things up quite a bit!
As for air vs cordless, it's all personal preference. I use both, but have been using my cordless a lot more just because I rather not fire up my compressor and have an air hose get in the way.
Of course a breaker bar will suffice, but I can when you're dealing with 20 lug nuts for a tire rotation, air/cordless tools speed things up quite a bit!
As for air vs cordless, it's all personal preference. I use both, but have been using my cordless a lot more just because I rather not fire up my compressor and have an air hose get in the way.
05-21-12, 10:54 PM
#11
I thought about this more and realized that I most likely won't need an impact gun for the struts.
I will be replacing every component, so I can get the struts assembled prior to the installation. This way, I won't have to deal with the top nut and swapping the units should be a breeze.
I will be replacing every component, so I can get the struts assembled prior to the installation. This way, I won't have to deal with the top nut and swapping the units should be a breeze.
05-23-12, 03:15 PM
#12
Probably need an impact to get the top nut on if you are building your own strut assembly. I would consider Quick struts or some other fully assembled strut assembly. I replaced my fronts with Monroe Quick struts. It made the job a breeze.
05-23-12, 03:38 PM
#13
Lead Lap
^^Maybe he's like me I'm too specific to toss on some fully assembled strut. I want the KYB mounts, Tokico struts, and keep the OEM springs, there is no telling what spring rate or quaility they use on a quick strut.
But that is just my over enthusiastic part taking over, like it really matters in this old boat. Though it does irk me the "fully assembled" struts don't use some known quantity like the Monroe quick strut is *not* a sens-a-trac as if even that is too expensive for the price point, so I do wonder what sort of ball and twine valving they are stuffing inside that strut...
But that is just my over enthusiastic part taking over, like it really matters in this old boat. Though it does irk me the "fully assembled" struts don't use some known quantity like the Monroe quick strut is *not* a sens-a-trac as if even that is too expensive for the price point, so I do wonder what sort of ball and twine valving they are stuffing inside that strut...