2001 Pinging = Carbon Buildup?
#1
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
2001 Pinging = Carbon Buildup?
I have a 2001 ES300 that has been making a clatter/pinging noise for the past 2 months or so. It currently has 185k miles. And here is a list of what’s been done recently to it:
-6 Denso Iridium Plugs - 173k
-Seafoam - 174k
-Oil changes every 5k with Mobil1 Full Synthetic
-Replaced A/F sensor near the radiator with Genuine Denso - 176k
-Cleaned throttle bodies and MAF - 178k
-Replaced both valve cover gaskets - 178k
-Replaced bank 1 vvt solenoid - 182k
I have been running 91/92/93 octane fuel in it regularly for the majority of the time since I bought it new. I have tried running 87 and 89 in it and it hasn’t changed the noise at all. After reading around I’ve heard that running premium can sometimes create excess carbon buildup in the engine over time. Here are a few things I’ve done/considered doing to try and fix this issue:
-Done multiple ECU resets by pulling battery cables and/or fuses = no change
-Throttle bodies and MAF are still clean
-As far as I know there are no vacuum leaks, no intake hoses have cracks in them
-I’ve thought about maybe running seafoam through it again, it did produce quite a bit of smoke when I did it back in October
-In the winter I ran Mobil1 0w-30 full synthetic oil and that’s what’s currently in it now, maybe this is too thin for the summer heat?
-The sound is mostly under harder acceleration but can be heard all the time as well regardless of incline
-With 87 octane the car seems to run really sluggish and every once in a while would knock loudly for 2-3 seconds so I switched back to premium
-Not sure when or if the timing belt has been changed, I know it’s risky and I’ll get around to replacing it, the water pump, and seals within the next month or two - maybe this noise could be timing belt related? - Belt didn’t look that bad when I pulled the timing cover off.
-No clue if any of the knock sensors have ever been touched by the previous owner
-Possible valve adjustment needed?
I have no CELs and haven’t ever had any since I’ve owned this car with the exception of the A/F sensor one. I’m not really sure what to try first to solve this problem, or if it’s even that big of a problem at all. I’ve thought about using fuel cleaners with PEA and seafoam but I’m not sure if this would help or not.
Here is a video of the symptoms, not sure if you can hear it on camera that well or not, it’s a ticking/pinging sound when accelerating -
I appreciate everyone’s help,
Zach
-6 Denso Iridium Plugs - 173k
-Seafoam - 174k
-Oil changes every 5k with Mobil1 Full Synthetic
-Replaced A/F sensor near the radiator with Genuine Denso - 176k
-Cleaned throttle bodies and MAF - 178k
-Replaced both valve cover gaskets - 178k
-Replaced bank 1 vvt solenoid - 182k
I have been running 91/92/93 octane fuel in it regularly for the majority of the time since I bought it new. I have tried running 87 and 89 in it and it hasn’t changed the noise at all. After reading around I’ve heard that running premium can sometimes create excess carbon buildup in the engine over time. Here are a few things I’ve done/considered doing to try and fix this issue:
-Done multiple ECU resets by pulling battery cables and/or fuses = no change
-Throttle bodies and MAF are still clean
-As far as I know there are no vacuum leaks, no intake hoses have cracks in them
-I’ve thought about maybe running seafoam through it again, it did produce quite a bit of smoke when I did it back in October
-In the winter I ran Mobil1 0w-30 full synthetic oil and that’s what’s currently in it now, maybe this is too thin for the summer heat?
-The sound is mostly under harder acceleration but can be heard all the time as well regardless of incline
-With 87 octane the car seems to run really sluggish and every once in a while would knock loudly for 2-3 seconds so I switched back to premium
-Not sure when or if the timing belt has been changed, I know it’s risky and I’ll get around to replacing it, the water pump, and seals within the next month or two - maybe this noise could be timing belt related? - Belt didn’t look that bad when I pulled the timing cover off.
-No clue if any of the knock sensors have ever been touched by the previous owner
-Possible valve adjustment needed?
I have no CELs and haven’t ever had any since I’ve owned this car with the exception of the A/F sensor one. I’m not really sure what to try first to solve this problem, or if it’s even that big of a problem at all. I’ve thought about using fuel cleaners with PEA and seafoam but I’m not sure if this would help or not.
Here is a video of the symptoms, not sure if you can hear it on camera that well or not, it’s a ticking/pinging sound when accelerating -
I appreciate everyone’s help,
Zach
#2
I have had great success with additives using PEA. Techron has it. I use Gumout Regane HM, it is $5 from Walmart or Amazon. Try two treatments in a row, then one every 5k or whatever it seems to need.
Your oil (the base oil before additives are blended in) is indeed thinner than you honestly need in KY, and has additives to get it up to the hot 30 weight spec you don’t need or want. I would (and do) run the Mobil 1 high mi. 10w-30 year round. I am from around Louisville and know the climate.
Your oil (the base oil before additives are blended in) is indeed thinner than you honestly need in KY, and has additives to get it up to the hot 30 weight spec you don’t need or want. I would (and do) run the Mobil 1 high mi. 10w-30 year round. I am from around Louisville and know the climate.
#3
Lexus Champion
I didn't hear pinging in your video. It does sound like you have an exhaust leak? Do you have a code reader? It would be nice to see some fuel trims. +1 on PEA it works.
#4
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I have had great success with additives using PEA. Techron has it. I use Gumout Regane HM, it is $5 from Walmart or Amazon. Try two treatments in a row, then one every 5k or whatever it seems to need.
Your oil (the base oil before additives are blended in) is indeed thinner than you honestly need in KY, and has additives to get it up to the hot 30 weight spec you don’t need or want. I would (and do) run the Mobil 1 high mi. 10w-30 year round. I am from around Louisville and know the climate.
Your oil (the base oil before additives are blended in) is indeed thinner than you honestly need in KY, and has additives to get it up to the hot 30 weight spec you don’t need or want. I would (and do) run the Mobil 1 high mi. 10w-30 year round. I am from around Louisville and know the climate.
#5
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Idle:
Bank 1 - 0.0%
Bank 2 - 0.8%
2500rpm:
Bank 1 - 0.8%
Bank 2 - 0.0%
Thanks,
Zach
Last edited by zachjones; 06-13-18 at 07:27 PM.
#7
I do understand why L2K says the engine sounds odd, BUT, I refrained from saying anything because phone microphones are really feeble things and can cut out lots of frequencies and over-accentuate others. to me, the engine sounds like it has a lot of valve noise and air leak. But I don't know if it sounds like that in person. If so, I'd try some additives and flush to clean up the engine and check for air leaks. If it doesn't sound that noise in the flesh, then don't get too concerned.
Trending Topics
#8
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I do understand why L2K says the engine sounds odd, BUT, I refrained from saying anything because phone microphones are really feeble things and can cut out lots of frequencies and over-accentuate others. to me, the engine sounds like it has a lot of valve noise and air leak. But I don't know if it sounds like that in person. If so, I'd try some additives and flush to clean up the engine and check for air leaks. If it doesn't sound that noise in the flesh, then don't get too concerned.
This sound still sounds like spark knock to me and it only occurs when accelerating. It does not do it when you rev the car in park. I’ll have to check for vacuum leaks and see if I can find anything. I’ll add the bottle of gumout to the tank in the next day or two when it’s time for a fill up. I wish there was an easy way to test the knock sensors because I’ve been wondering about those recently because I’m unsure if they’ve ever been replaced. I have no CELs still but I’d rather not spend $350 on two new knock sensors if I don’t have to. Or could it be the other VVT solenoid going bad? I only replaced one side’s. The screens for both solenoids were clean when I replaced the one.
Last edited by zachjones; 06-16-18 at 05:29 PM.
#9
Driver School Candidate
I had this same issue with my 01 es300.I changed the plugs,all filters,different grades of gas 87-93oct with gumout regane with P.E.A. for 3 consistent tank refills and nothing.It wasnt overheating,no engine lights etc...An older gentlemen that heard the car told me that it definitely was the timing.He told me that more than likely the timing belt teeth are worn down causing it to slip the tension on the gear teeth which will throw the timing out off.I ordered the timing belt/water pump kit and took it to the shop to get it installed.When I picked up the car and drove it home the pinging stopped and the power was very crisp as should be.Hopefully this will help you.
#10
He told me that more than likely the timing belt teeth are worn down causing it to slip the tension on the gear teeth which will throw the timing out off.I ordered the timing belt/water pump kit and took it to the shop to get it installed.When I picked up the car and drove it home the pinging stopped and the power was very crisp as should be.Hopefully this will help you.
#11
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Today I decided to pull the upper timing cover off and see what I could find inside. I was horrified when I saw that this car is on its original belt. I just assumed the previous owner (I purchased it at 172k) replaced the belt sometime within the 14 years he owned it. The belt has worn off Toyota part numbers stamped on it and I've seen no record of this job ever being done on the Lexus service history website. The belt also seems looser than I'd think it's supposed to be (I'm no expert at this). I found that the tensioner underneath seems to be leaking a bit. This pretty much confirmed my suspicion that this car is on it's original tb and water pump. Basically a ticking time bomb waiting to happen at 186k miles.
I've attached some photos of my findings. There also seems to be some rusty dust inside the timing covers, leaky water pump or bad bearing possibly?
On a side note, I also added that bottle of Gumout in the tank today when I filled up with 91 octane.
Thanks for everyone's help thus far, sometimes I guess the problem can be something as easily overlooked by myself as this,
Zach
#12
Lexus Champion
Belt should not be loose at all the tensioner will take up the slack until the belt breaks. The belt itself looks old and dried out but I've seen far worse. That looks like motor oil not hydraulic oil from the tensioner but you'll know when you remove it.
#13
Right, my experience is the belt is pretty tight when all is as designed.
I had one of these tensioners fail at 156k miles. In an Acura, but it was the exact same Aisin tensioner. This could be the real problem here. If the belt was ever changed, you can tell by looking at the cam bolts, no way to hide the marks on them from removing/reinstalling. I can't really tell from the photo.
Be prepared to use some creative torque to break the crank bolt, it can be stubborn. Impact, or very long extension to get enough torque applied. I think the installation spec. is ~200 ft/lbs, so possibly double that or more to remove after a decade+ of use.
I had one of these tensioners fail at 156k miles. In an Acura, but it was the exact same Aisin tensioner. This could be the real problem here. If the belt was ever changed, you can tell by looking at the cam bolts, no way to hide the marks on them from removing/reinstalling. I can't really tell from the photo.
Be prepared to use some creative torque to break the crank bolt, it can be stubborn. Impact, or very long extension to get enough torque applied. I think the installation spec. is ~200 ft/lbs, so possibly double that or more to remove after a decade+ of use.
#14
Lexus Champion
I also have a 2001 Krxus Es 300 that pings slightly under load. But only during high ambient temperatures. The Lexus owners manual states that pinging under certain conditions is perfectly normal, and that basically not to worry about it.
i doubt your timing belt is slipping, but if it’s past due than change it. When I changed my timing belt at the specified interval the pinging remained the same.
si as I said, it could be normal.
i doubt your timing belt is slipping, but if it’s past due than change it. When I changed my timing belt at the specified interval the pinging remained the same.
si as I said, it could be normal.
Last edited by PFB; 06-18-18 at 05:13 PM.