onsknht

1. The 1K start is typical, in fact if I showed the tach it was up to 1700-1800 on initial start up. The reason for this is the rich mixture added to a cold engine by the injection system... Fuel maps are easy to understand, there really isn't much to them and cold starts are easily identified. The near 2K high idle lasts only a few seconds and then the 1K till warm routine takes over... I have noticed the initial 2K start RPM to vary between 1-2K depending on temperature, I've operated down to 23*.

2. If I let the car idle (settle) before proceding, the flair / spike does not occur... So far a minimal warm up time of 2 minutes is needed to stop the flair / spike, I'm watching this time as we get colder, I suspect a 0* cold soaked motor/trans may need a little more time... I'm also hoping that the super cold soaking will cause new symptoms/clues to arise.


My goal is to understand all shifting mechanisms and what conditions are present to make them operate, in that quest I'm sure the downshifting function will be evident. FWIW - I will offer based on what I know about gears in general... The 6 speed is a close ratio gearbox, there are more shift points than a traditional 4-speed auto and because of this I think the downshifting is just going to be more pronounced... Think of it this way, the 6 speed is great, nice and smooth, but I still count 5 gear changes everytime I go to 50MPH, in a 4-speed I only counted 3 gear changes. I'm willing to bet the finish ratio between 6 and 4-speed gearboxes is about the same, there's just more gears and therefore more options. My prior Toyota 4-speeds would downshift 4 to 3 and 3 to 2 although it seemed they took forever to do so, I noticed the 6-speed was fast and right away I felt the engine braking. I think a lot of our perceptions are being based on new experiences?

ES350Bob

Since I have a new car I'll keep an eye on the downshifting and let you know what I notice as to the slight slinging. My former started off without that slight slinging forward, and I mean slight, not what you would call being jerked, as miles progressed though it seemed to be more pronounced comparatively so time will tell if this one does that too.

wanderer99

If I warm my car up for 2 mins before I do anything with the trans it still occurs. If I drive out cold, it will happen as well - just maybe after the 2nd 3rd-4th change a few mins into driving. There is no black and white here, everything differs somewhat between our cars. Some have small issues that are minor, others have the same issue to a much larger degree.

ES350Bob

Mine also did not follow a warmed up or cold as standard, in fact the 3 to 4 when it happened I believe the car was plenty hot, though I seem to recall reading in the TSIB it says within the first ten minutes this can happen and that is more than long enough for any car to warm up, certainly in summer here.

terryes

onsknht, I agree. That is the way my ES works as does my neighbors. After comparing notes, neither one of us has seen any rpm jump above 1100 at startup.

So if I read you correctly, anyone with a flare "rpm jump" not associated with a cold start may have a possible tranny problem. Other than that it is probably ecu related.

ES350Bob

The TSIB clearly instructs the techs to COLD start the car to look for this trans issue.

Those of us that have it happen can tell you that the car can be warmed up, which may be why the TSIB also says WITHIN the first ten minutes.

My cold start RPM this am was near 2,000 then dropped down, other days 1400 then drops back.

twister

Maybe I miss something in all these posts, but can someone summarize ECU issue? I guess its related to their internal processor or something since you guys talking about firmware/reflashing.

terryes

esbob350, if your rpms hit 2k when idling --- get it to your service dept quickly

ES350Bob

You must have been talking about when in drive at a stop with your 1,100 though it seemed you were stating cold started.

As for when the trans flare is caught, it is instructed to look for it only after starting the car when cold so Lexus thinks it is related to a cold start.

terryes

esbob350

HUH???? Well, guess I'm back to football. Thought this forum was open to thought provoking ideas on this es350 auto. Sometimes your wrong.

Best regards to all, especially those experiencing problems. Hopefully your dealers are representative of the "lexus quality" we all expect. bye bye

ES350Bob

Terryes,

This is open to that, many of us have been debating this trans issue, engine noise, wind noise, vibration, rattles for months. Some of us coming up with wind noise remedies on our own and sharing them with each other.

ons came up with the idea of posting this video so people could actually see what we were all taking about, weeks before that we discussed to record under the hood. ons thinks it's software related, I do not, we debate it anyway.

I misunderstood you were talking about idle RPM when in drive cold engine, not when you first crank up the car is all.

ES350Bob

Yes twister that's it, the brains behind the brawn. Some think the flare can be related to that, as you can tell I do not because of all the transmissions replaced or gone into for TSIB and my own sound recordings under the hood when the flare happens and my belief if software were the culprit our poll would reflect 100 percent have the flare or near that as we all have the same software installed in our cars.

psp

Hi group,

My thanks to ONSKNHT for showing us what the transmission flare is and, what it sounds and looks like. I imagined something much less dramatic and wondered if mine was doing it too. Mine does not do that thankfully (build date 4/06).

Thanks again (even though you have a Camry ) your input is much appreciated.

PETER

Kaius88

Thanks Onsk, that was what we needed. Great video!

Now I dont know if i have this flare or not because i dont drive that aggressive on the pedal. My rpm is always around 2000 rpm when i drive high speeds. If I get it to 3000 rpm, it will shift back to lower rpm. I would like to test to see if i have the 3rd-4th flare. I just need a cold morning and a large stretch of straightway. The video shows it clearly and I can hear the slip as if you are pressing gas while gear is not engaged. I wonder how many drivers have it and dont realize it.

psp

And for what it's worth ...

I am one of those folks who uses the S mode when I drive. For example if I am driving around the suburban area where I live and work I set the shifter to S and leave it in "4". The car shifts but only to fourth gear and not to the higher gears. I usually do not exceed 40 in this mode. If I am in stop and go city or freeway traffic, I will set to S and limit the gearing to "3" so I can use the engine power at my discretion for quick lane changes etc. (I used to do the same thing in my Maxima with the overdrive on/off switch) I really do not like bogging the engine by running at too low an RPM in top gear. Yes, on the highway I use D (and R for "Race"). I also think that the tranny is set up for fuel economy rather than power efficiency. While the eprom in the tranny is "OK" I would really like to exercise more control over what it's doing and when -- after all the tranny is doing it in the dark.