LexBob2

I've had 2 ES350's and both have had a soft brake pedal. I've read several reviews that have mentioned it too.

However, when needed, the brakes stop the car in a short distance.

garsarno

Ask them to show the specific Lexus certification rules regarding tires. One question though: did the vibration show up in your test ride?

feedmitten

Apparently the Lexus certification states that they need to have a particular tread depth - these are (and they have now admitted on paper) out of round and therefore just fine to sell. Yes, I noticed it on the brief test drive (where the salesman had the radio on and was telling me personal stories the whole time, probably to keep me from noticing). I mentioned this to him and he promised to my face multiple times that it would be fixed before I picked up the car. When I picked up the car, I was only able to go on a short test drive and when I asked him if I noticed the issue again he said to simply bring the car back and they would fix it, as 'This is Lexus' and they fix things like this. Stupidly, I admit, I believed that. Until the next day when I had time to drive it on the highway and noticed the same issue. I notified my salesperson who simply told me to 'drive it some more'. Then I brought it in a week later. They didn't fix it. Then I brought it in again. They didn't fix it and told that my tires are out of round but since that isn't covered by the warranty, I needed to buy new tires. I looked up my VIN in the Lexus owner's website and noticed that the previous owner had the same complaints. Ugh.

garsarno

Well, now we all know. No acceptance of the car until the problems promised are fixed. I remember when I picked my new '99 Town Car in 5/1999. There was a paint drip hanging on the tip of the front fender. They promised me that they would fix. When we went to pick up this car, the drip was still there along with mud on the tires. New car, 12 miles on it. I kicked the muddy tire on the car, acted pissed off which I was and got in our '97 Town Car and told the salesman that when he got it right to call me. They called a few hours later, paint drip was gone, touched up and all of the tires were clean and shiny.

feedmitten

Yeah, lesson learned, trust me. I'll update the thread after I go in tomorrow and see if new tires solves the issue.

Road Rage

CPO tire requirements are:

All tires must be same make and model, no sidewall damage, and at least 5/32" tread depth.

But, CPO's are supposed to be driven as part of the inspection and during this any vibration should've been rectified BEFORE the certified sticker was put on the car. Much less for sale on the lot.

Typical of one or more of the following:

Lazy Tech
Cheap Service Manager
Dealership not wanting to spend to bring it up to CPO standards.

I've seen all 3.

feedmitten

Newest update. Keep in mind I've had to bring this car back three times since buying it three weeks ago....

The replaced the tires with Nexum something-or-others the other day. IMMEDIATELY I could tell that the car ran much smoother on the road. I didn't have to do any highway driving until this morning. IMMEDITELY at 65mph I started to feel a wobble / shake, and it didn't go away during my 70 mile trip.

That said, the new tires went very far in fixing the issue. However, if they dealer would have taken it on the highway afterward (which they said they would do), they would have noticed this now-much-more-reduced shaking / wobbling at high speeds.

If you were Lexus, and you had just replaced all the tires, and the problem was mostly solved, any idea what else you would look at before giving up and just telling the customer to go pound sand? They said that they balanced the new ones. What other car parts cause this kind of feeling (other than a wheel / rim, which I assume would have been found when balancing?)

feedmitten

Yet another update....

I finally took the car to another Lexus dealer in a different state to have it looked over. They confirmed that I'm not, in fact, crazy and that the car doesn't drive anything close to right. They said that the tires that were put on by my dealer were the absolute cheapest things possible and wobble everywhere when put on a Road Force balancing machine.

They also said that the brake rotors (which were supposedly replaced by my dealer) were warped, and that all the break parts were cheap aftermarket things that were not of good quality. Also, the system hadn't been bled right (which I'd asked my dealer about but got the usual "everything is fine with them" answer).

Furthermore, they also confirmed for me that the car is out of alignment, which is what I'd thought, despite my dealer saying they had aligned it.

None of this information came with any prompting from me, just a simple: 'It doesn't seem to drive right at high speeds and feels a little weird braking' statement. I didn't want to influence the tests they performed or things they suggested. They said they would never sold that car CPO with those crappy parts on it. Total estimate on the proper tires, proper brake parts, alignment, brake system bleed: over $2,300. Just to test they had me drive one of their CPO 2007 ES350s with 10,000 more miles than mine and it drove absolutely fine compared to the sub-par ride I get.


So now I'm looking at either spending an ADDITIONAL $2,300 above what I just paid for the stupid car, or losing a good $6k on a trade-in. I'm thinking of trading in as my local dealer is the ONLY Lexus dealer within ~75 miles and I dread having to drive it to different city each and every time I need service, as it's been in to the dealer six or seven times now.

jcat_350

even having a certified Lexus dealer give you that evaluation of your car wouldn't be enough for them to cover the work? If I were you, I'd contact Lexus HQ about that. If it were me, I'd have a complaint filed against the dealer you bought it from and wouldn't stop until all that work was corrected on the bubble.

feedmitten

I had to complain to Lexus Corporate after the dealer told me to go pound sand after the first round of stuff, and then they changed out the tires to the junk that's on there now. They were still an issue after that and had to go back and be re-balanced once. At that visit I mentioned the alignment yet again as well as the weird braking yet again and they told me that the car is perfectly fine and there is nothing wrong with it. I guess I can go back to Corporate with the information gained from the other Lexus dealer, but I assume the response is going to be 'It passes all CPO Lexus requirements so go away.'

jcat_350

I'd think not, especially since corporate up to this point has only been going off what the original dealer said. A second opinion from another one of their dealers saying basically 'yeah...that's f'ed up' should certainly give them a dose of reality and should pique their interest.

I say stick with it. Having another of their dealers on YOUR side will help.

SW17LS

Did this other dealer tell you what was "substandard" about the brakes? I find it hard to believe the vehicle needs new brakes...I also find it hard to believe the selling dealer would have used non-OEM brake components...since the OEM parts are sold to them at cost and aren't really expensive. I wouldn't even think a Lexus dealer would stock aftermarket parts. More likely the previous owner replaced brake components with aftermarket parts, and the selling dealer just turned the rotors. How does the new dealer know the brakes weren't bled properly?

You have to bear in mind that although the other dealership told you more of what you wanted to hear...they also tried to sell you $2,300 worth of service.

This is the thing about the CPO program. Its not a "brand new" car, its a 5, going on 6 year old car. They don't guarantee a vehicle with all new components, they don't guarantee a specific tire brand. They wouldn't replace brake components that the previous owner installed just because they are off brand. Did the dealer try road force balancing the new tires?

I've never had a set of tires put on a Lexus that I didn't have to have rebalanced at least one to get them shimmy-free. These cars are very susceptible to tires being out of balance.

As for service, I would find a good independent mechanic to service your car instead of the dealer. I'd take it somewhere else and just have the new tires road force balanced, might cost you $100, but I bet it fixes the shimmy...

jcat_350

there's actually quite an easy way to avoid that...request that they use hammer-in weights instead of stick-ons. They rarely clean the barrel of the wheel enough to ensure perfect adhesion. They're a bit uglier, but you won't have to go back as often after pressure washers, heavy rains, snow/ice, etc.

sford52

This is the best piece of advice you'll get.

I'm lucky enough to have found a great local mechanic who does it right, always has, for a fair price. He doesn't have donuts or a big screen TV, but I do, so he doesn't have to. They are tough to find (and it's getting tougher) but ask your neighbors and someone will help you out.

Hope you get the troubles resolved and can get on and enjoy your car.

flowrider

iTrader: (9)

NO-NO you don't want to do that

1. The wheels don't have the proper lip to hold on hammer on weights.

2. You really screw up the wheels appearance with such weights.

Stick-ons if properly applied work just fine.

As far as Nexen tires go, I have seen mixed reviews. I was under the impression that a Lexus dealer had to use OEM tires on a CPO vehicle. The CPO vehicle comes with a 100K mileage. 3 year warranty. Your car was not up to the standards of a CPO vehicle right off the bat. Lexus corporate should contact the second dealer for verification of the issues, and have them corrected under the terms of the warranty.

Lou