ratobuza

Hi guys

I have a 07 ES350 with UL package and ML sound. The ML sub just blew off, like many other people on the forums. Also I read that apparently there is no free air direct alternative sub replacement so I decided to buy a new ML sub (but not from the stealership).
However to my amazement I'm unable to find the OEM ML subwoofer for the ES350 anywhere online. I tried ebay, amazon, google search to no avail. I can find other ML subs on Ebay but not the ES350. I know this sound stupid but I'm really puzzled of the lack of links on ES350 ML subs

If anyone has a link to a factory ML sub for sale pls let me know. Or if you know of any another brand sub that will fit the mounting of the factory ML sub and have similar impedance that's even better

Thanks in advance

Claudiu

chbow

I don't know if this helps you (and I feel as if I'm becoming a Sewell salesman ) but I hope it does and the prices get better with the CL discount.
http://lexus.sewellparts.com/oem-cat...S350-2007.html

ratobuza

Thanks chbow - I removed my old sub from the trunk and got the part# from it in the meantime, with the part# which is 86160-0WF70 I was able to find some online stores with prices ranging from $250 to $490 including the one you sent me

Lot of dough for a sub which will most likely die again but it's the most simple solution

Cheers

jcat_350

why do you think there aren't any aftermarket IB replacements? What resistance are the voice coil(s)? there are a ton of subs that aren't IB subs, per se but are IB rated to be used as such.

Robert_J

Not only do you need to know that, you also need to know the sensitivity. I'd be happy to test any sub using Woofer Tester 3 as long as you pay shipping both ways.

xanderES

iTrader: (8)

Paying those prices for the quality of an ML replacement is not worth the money. There are multiple companies that make infinite baffle subwoofers. If you're spending even $200 on one of those you're going to recieve a much better built subwoofer than the ML. Just my 2cents.
Edit: heres a great subwoofer company that makes IB woofers and theyre made in america. whether it will fit, however, i have no clue.
FI Car Audio

Robert_J

Fi doesn't make an 8" sub of any type.

I'm sure Jacob at Sundown could custom build an IB on his 8" platform but it would require a different amp. And you think the back deck rattles now. A high excursion sub would be like a jackhammer back there.

jcat_350

correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure both the ML and non-ML systems use 10" subs...

In any case, there are plenty of both 8" and 10" IB rated subs:

http://www.crutchfield.com/g_520/Com...s%7cFFFree_Air

Kicker comp series (i can attest for these..they sound great) apline type R (excellent also) JL audio etc.

If memory serves, the factory ML sub is actually a triple 4 ohm coil = 12ohm total...and the Amp is super weak. I would simply rip/replace it with an aftermarket IB sub listed above, and then the appropriate amp.

FWIW, I usually find what I want on crutchfield, then search that model number on sonic electronix or ebay and find a better deal.

Robert_J

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/es3...50-non-ml.html
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/3237998-post65.html

I've only crawled in the trunk of an '07 with a non-ML system but I measured it as 8" and it matched up with the links above.


Any sub can be run as an IB - it's just a large, sealed box. But does the driver have enough excursion (xmax) and is the Qts high enough to provide the roll-off you want without being boomy?

I like the older Kicker stuff that was made by Credence Speakers (OEM manufacturer). JL makes great products but charge a premium price. Alpine subs are great. In fact, I have a pair of 12" Type-Rs (older model) that are blown and I'm rebuilding them.

It would be as simple to find out as climbing into the trunk, unplugging the sub from the amp and testing the resistance. That doesn't give you any other Theile/Small parameter but it's a start.

Me too unless I'm trying an unproven item. For example, the PAC adapter that I used in my ES-350 wasn't mentioned by PAC as working in our cars. Since Crutchfield did, they guaranteed to take it back if it did not work. It did. I posted that information here so others could find it at a cheaper site.

jcat_350

I agree...any sub can be run as IB. However, those particular ones I linked are IB Rated, which means their specs are best suited to be run IB. I had a Kicker comp 10c10 (one of the ones you see there...dual 2 ohm) in my E500 and it was incredible. That sub, combined with the factory Harmon/Kardon door speakers and factory amps was the perfect unit for the car.

Regardless of the resistance, I'd recommend replacing the ML amp anyway. IIRC, the sub uses a separate amp altogether. Or, you could leave it and pull signal from it for your new amp.

The alpines are great subs but don't take kindly to punishment. If you listen to moderate levels most times and only go loud now and then, you'll be fine. I had 2 JL 12w3v1s in multiple cars over the dead of the winter and summer heat, and I couldn't blow those up if I tried (with a rockford and a PG 350 and 400w amp respectively, each sub was only rated 150 RMS). I love JL stuff just for the quality aspect. I've heard that ZR800-CW that's on the second page. Pricey at $230, but it doesn't matter what kind of application (sealed, ported, BP or IB) it sounds just freakin awesome.

Robert_J

I know I'm nit-picking but who says those specs are best suited for IB? I like a the sound of a low Qtc sub but most IB subs have a Qts of .750 and higher. If I'm going to run an IB, I want to start with a Qtc of .500 or lower. My home theater subs have a final Q of about .500 but I had to start with a sub with a Qts of .308 - TC-3000. I know the IB "rating" is good for someone who doesn't know much about subs. On the other hand, it's extremely easy to overdrive an IB sub so I wouldn't recommend a DIY install IB to just anyone. That's why the drivers I recommend have extreme xmax and xmech parameters. If they go nuts, there's little chance of damaging a driver.

The non-ML system uses a single amp. Plus every ML amp I've seen on Ebay has looked the same. No mention of it being a high's amp or a sub amp. But yes, I recommend using a separate amp with any new sub. It doesn't have to be much. When using a 4ohm, 10" driver in the car, my Powerbass amp is only putting out 250 watts. It's more than enough sub for the average listener. My wife isn't average and that's why she prefers the 1 ohm, 12", Pink Star Industries sub getting the full 1,000 watts from the Powerbass.

I'm just playing around with the Alpines. I picked up blown ones from $40 and $43 respectively. It will be about $50 each for recone parts from Springfield Speaker Repair. I'll be getting dual 4 ohm recone kits so each sub will see about 500w each.

If the Alpines don't work out, I have a custom 15" sub made from a Konaki motor, TC Sounds basket, Sundown cone and PSI spiders and coil. It's built to work in a small, sealed box so it should pound in a car.

jcat_350

You keep saying that the specs are insufficient but I don't see you reference any of the actual specs of the subs I've linked to...which of those are you against in terms of specs? Like I said, and maybe i'm not quite the audiophile you are...but that kicker 10" in the rear deck of my e500 was awesome running off the factory amp at about 200w.

Robert_J

http://www.crutchfield.com/p_20610C1...11#details-tab The xmax is too small for for the average user. They see the 300 watt peak rating and don't understand that's when the glue melts off the voice coil not when the voice coil crashes into the back plate of the magnet. Without a box, it's way too easy to destroy a sub by bottoming it out.

At one point, I wouldn't buy a speaker without full Thiele/Small parameters. Understanding Loudspeaker Data But I bought testing hardware and software that I linked to above so that I can pull the T/S parameters to confirm what the manufacturer says as well as testing unknown speakers like these.

I'm not an audiophile. Those guys have the $100k speakers in their house and use $1,000 cables. I'm a budget guy that like quality sound. For example, my home sub cable is RG-6. That's the same cable that connects my satellite dish to the receiver. It doesn't look fancy but it is hundreds of times better than your cheap sub cables.

I also like the science behind the sound. That's why I choose equipment where I can learn a little from the guys designing them. Like Jacob from Sundown Audio and David from PSI. I've also followed these guys for years on the forums:
Dan Wiggins - http://www.acousticdev.com/cms/index...d=44&Itemid=55
John J. from AE Speakers - http://www.aespeakers.com/
Stephen Ponte - Tymphany, SVS, TC Sounds
Nick - Stereo Integrity, Obsidian Audio
Deon (aka Db) - Klipsch, TC Sounds, AE Speakers, Kicker
Scott - Fi Car Audio, Resonant Engineering, Destijl Engineering, FRC Soundworks

I've asked questions and read postings on the decisions behind the choices when creating different products. You get a great insight how the products are designed and how final price factors into everything.