Mark Levinson Audio?
07-19-13, 07:09 AM
#496
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Update: The dealer was unable to get any corporate sponsorship for this effort.
The best offer the dealer is "able to make" is to work a trade based on the new vehicle's invoice and I would need to absorb the financial penalties for this. Based on "end of year" specials going on now, I probably get that deal with any other dealer, Lexus or nearly any other automaker (probably not Tesla - grin).
Cheers
The best offer the dealer is "able to make" is to work a trade based on the new vehicle's invoice and I would need to absorb the financial penalties for this. Based on "end of year" specials going on now, I probably get that deal with any other dealer, Lexus or nearly any other automaker (probably not Tesla - grin).
Cheers
In discussing this issue with the dealer, it was mentioned that there might be an opportunity to trade the vehicle (in my case leased) to get another car.
Options discussed were:
If this was the deal you were being presented with, would you go for it and test the heck out of it before signing, play it safe with a non ML, or wait for a fix if it really was only 2-3 months away at this point?
Cheers
Options discussed were:
- get a nearly identical 2013 UL packaged ES300h; nearly as I am not after a specific external color. We would test the audio to see if the defect manifested. Service has not mentioned if they know this defect can be traced to build date or serial number.
- get a almost identical 2013 packaged ES300h without the Mark Levinson but with the highest non UL package with the UL package oriented safety features I was after in the first place.
If this was the deal you were being presented with, would you go for it and test the heck out of it before signing, play it safe with a non ML, or wait for a fix if it really was only 2-3 months away at this point?
Cheers
07-19-13, 07:24 AM
#497
Lead Lap
Looks like there are some conflicting posts going on here. Some are getting corporate intervention - ML engineer flying out to assess the sub - and some getting the sub replaced with a prototype that appears to be improved. Now you are saying that your dealer knows nothing about Lexus' interest in getting this resolved and disavows any support by Lexus. Sounds to me like this dealer wants to sell you another car - at your expense...
I would wait and see if a fix transpires by all the complaints. Unfortunately, the fix may come in the 2014 model year vehicles - or beyond...
I would wait and see if a fix transpires by all the complaints. Unfortunately, the fix may come in the 2014 model year vehicles - or beyond...
07-19-13, 08:18 AM
#498
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7 Months and No Resolution
My Lexus dealer has advised me that third party posts of a "new fix" for this issue are not to be believed. Lexus has not informed them of any progress. On the other hand this is the same dealer who cannot work on this now for seven months...
Lexus Corporate (Amber) maintains an offer of a service credit and is told by "her engineers" that a fix "for the wiring" which is the root cause of this issue is due out in late summer so I should remain patient.
The general manager at the dealer made an odd comment or two that there was a communication asking dealers about feedback about the Mark Levinson option in the ES; implying that Lexus may be considering removing the option in this vehicle. This was followed by "that during launch, every UL had the ML option, and now, only a small fraction do". Maybe this was to make me feel better or maybe something else.
What a little over seven months has taught me is that Lexus loves to sell you a vehicle - at that point you are the most important - but afterwards get in line like everyone else and eat what we serve you.
Lastly, with other Lexus purchases I get a JD Powers survey. I haven't seen one for this one. Did other receive there survey or have they discontinued that practice?
Until the 8 month mark.
Lexus Corporate (Amber) maintains an offer of a service credit and is told by "her engineers" that a fix "for the wiring" which is the root cause of this issue is due out in late summer so I should remain patient.
The general manager at the dealer made an odd comment or two that there was a communication asking dealers about feedback about the Mark Levinson option in the ES; implying that Lexus may be considering removing the option in this vehicle. This was followed by "that during launch, every UL had the ML option, and now, only a small fraction do". Maybe this was to make me feel better or maybe something else.
What a little over seven months has taught me is that Lexus loves to sell you a vehicle - at that point you are the most important - but afterwards get in line like everyone else and eat what we serve you.
Lastly, with other Lexus purchases I get a JD Powers survey. I haven't seen one for this one. Did other receive there survey or have they discontinued that practice?
Until the 8 month mark.
Like others in this ES300h forum thread, I too have a audio distortion with the ML premium feature.
It sounds like the cross-over/amplifier is sending more than lower frequencies to the sub-woofer.
I can recreate the distortion on demand using a audio reference CD Bass 305 which I acquired when a audio retailer went out of business.
While parked, on a source with +/-0 Tre +/-0 Mid, +/- 0 Bass at >40 audio loudness, with ASL and DSP Enabled audio distortion occurs.
While drinving at highway speeds, with the same settings, bass audio distortion is present at >37 audio loudness. I imagine ASL to be the cause for the delta.
Disabling DSP seems to also alleviate the issue by 2-3 audio loudness ticks.
I have witnessed distortion via CD the most (I imagine the frequency range is better with this source), but FM/Sat and Pandora can also be distorted sources.
I have taken the vehicle back three times for this issue; I got the vehicle Dec 10th, 2012.
The first I wasn't prepared right, I let the service writer go to easily that it was bad source material.
The second time around Christmas, we tried the material in a different new Lexus with ML, and then in mine. The service writer and tech seemed to "get the issue" this time. They also understood how to recreate the issue on demand. They ordered a new sub. I was told that the replacement would require a half day as they had to remove the back seat to install this.
The third time, after the holidays, I dropped the car off and got a loaner. I was called after lunch that they were told by Lexus not to install the new speaker as it would not address the issue. I was not told much other than Lexus is investigating the issue. The dealer may hear something tomorrow or sometime in the unknown future.
This is my fourth Lexus, seventh Toyota/Lexus. It's the second time I have purchased/leased the premium radio option (the last time it was in a SC300 and by Nakamichi). I am regretting the purchasing decision due to this feature and also this issue. I am embarassed to take co-workers or friends in "the new car" due this issue.
I realise I am jaded as the car is really comfortable and quiet when I drive it. The audio system is what I hear 90% of the time when I am driving and I am not able to enjoy a premium vehicle due to this issue.
Cheers
It sounds like the cross-over/amplifier is sending more than lower frequencies to the sub-woofer.
I can recreate the distortion on demand using a audio reference CD Bass 305 which I acquired when a audio retailer went out of business.
While parked, on a source with +/-0 Tre +/-0 Mid, +/- 0 Bass at >40 audio loudness, with ASL and DSP Enabled audio distortion occurs.
While drinving at highway speeds, with the same settings, bass audio distortion is present at >37 audio loudness. I imagine ASL to be the cause for the delta.
Disabling DSP seems to also alleviate the issue by 2-3 audio loudness ticks.
I have witnessed distortion via CD the most (I imagine the frequency range is better with this source), but FM/Sat and Pandora can also be distorted sources.
I have taken the vehicle back three times for this issue; I got the vehicle Dec 10th, 2012.
The first I wasn't prepared right, I let the service writer go to easily that it was bad source material.
The second time around Christmas, we tried the material in a different new Lexus with ML, and then in mine. The service writer and tech seemed to "get the issue" this time. They also understood how to recreate the issue on demand. They ordered a new sub. I was told that the replacement would require a half day as they had to remove the back seat to install this.
The third time, after the holidays, I dropped the car off and got a loaner. I was called after lunch that they were told by Lexus not to install the new speaker as it would not address the issue. I was not told much other than Lexus is investigating the issue. The dealer may hear something tomorrow or sometime in the unknown future.
This is my fourth Lexus, seventh Toyota/Lexus. It's the second time I have purchased/leased the premium radio option (the last time it was in a SC300 and by Nakamichi). I am regretting the purchasing decision due to this feature and also this issue. I am embarassed to take co-workers or friends in "the new car" due this issue.
I realise I am jaded as the car is really comfortable and quiet when I drive it. The audio system is what I hear 90% of the time when I am driving and I am not able to enjoy a premium vehicle due to this issue.
Cheers
07-19-13, 10:33 AM
#499
Lead Lap
What a little over seven months has taught me is that Lexus loves to sell you a vehicle - at that point you are the most important - but afterwards get in line like everyone else and eat what we serve you.
.[/QUOTE]
I think that you hit the nail on the head with this statement...
.[/QUOTE]
I think that you hit the nail on the head with this statement...
07-19-13, 10:50 AM
#500
Pretty much sums up 99% of the auto industry. At least they still care enough to offer a nice place to sit while you wait for service, with more amenities than any other dealer I've been to.
07-19-13, 11:49 AM
#502
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Due to that malaise attitude of the automakers / dealers, I would expect to see more and more articles like:
http://www.autoblog.com/2013/07/16/p...-myford-touch/
Plus, "go to the dealership?" Isn't that the non-luxury approach or to get a car wash these days? I thought luxury dealerships valeted there customers vehicles these days. That is how my MB was. The BMW dealership across from MB does valet as well. Cadillac too. Tesla as well even though they are 40 miles away in Chicago. Oh wait, only the Lexus and Acura dealerships in my area haven't caught up to that idea in my corner of the state yet and rely on customers drop off and wait, or drop off and get a loaner if overnight.
http://www.autoblog.com/2013/07/16/p...-myford-touch/
Plus, "go to the dealership?" Isn't that the non-luxury approach or to get a car wash these days? I thought luxury dealerships valeted there customers vehicles these days. That is how my MB was. The BMW dealership across from MB does valet as well. Cadillac too. Tesla as well even though they are 40 miles away in Chicago. Oh wait, only the Lexus and Acura dealerships in my area haven't caught up to that idea in my corner of the state yet and rely on customers drop off and wait, or drop off and get a loaner if overnight.
Last edited by calm; 07-19-13 at 11:57 AM.
07-19-13, 12:36 PM
#503
I thought luxury dealerships valeted there customers vehicles these days. That is how my MB was. The BMW dealership across from MB does valet as well. Cadillac too. Tesla as well even though they are 40 miles away in Chicago. Oh wait, only the Lexus and Acura dealerships in my area haven't caught up to that idea in my corner of the state yet and rely on customers drop off and wait, or drop off and get a loaner if overnight.
I've only been back to my dealer once (for my 5k service) and they appeared more professional than any other dealer service department I've ever been in. I've been to places in the past, where they had me drive the car onto the lift for them.
07-19-13, 01:39 PM
#504
Lead Lap
I guess it's up to the individual dealer on how they handle this. My dealer will actually drop off a loaner at your home the night before and take your car in, if you so wish. At least according to a letter they sent me.
I've only been back to my dealer once (for my 5k service) and they appeared more professional than any other dealer service department I've ever been in. I've been to places in the past, where they had me drive the car onto the lift for them.
I've only been back to my dealer once (for my 5k service) and they appeared more professional than any other dealer service department I've ever been in. I've been to places in the past, where they had me drive the car onto the lift for them.
I would check again with your dealer to see if they do this.
07-19-13, 07:47 PM
#505
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My former and current dealers of McGrath Lexus and Lexus of Orland Park / Merrilville (two dealers with two locations in Chicagoland/NWI) as well as Lexus Corporate in Torrance behave like the first phase of the Kübler-Ross model is the only one to practice if there is an issue like the ML presents.
Cheers
Last edited by calm; 07-19-13 at 07:51 PM.
07-21-13, 07:18 AM
#506
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I have finally purchased another vehicle, as I am moving to Florida. My decision was the Telsa with the upgrade system with the performance S package, and yes I did listen th the system with all my music at full blast and test drove it for a while, i was extremely impressed. Like this I have one vehicle that does nothing but drink gasoline and the other no gas. I cannot say this vehicle will be trouble free, but at least I know that. I wish everyone luck on getting the ML system fixed, and hope all the complaints have helped. Cheers to all and have a great summer.
Regards
Jason
Regards
Jason
07-21-13, 07:55 AM
#507
Pole Position
I have finally purchased another vehicle, as I am moving to Florida. My decision was the Telsa with the upgrade system with the performance S package, and yes I did listen th the system with all my music at full blast and test drove it for a while, i was extremely impressed. Like this I have one vehicle that does nothing but drink gasoline and the other no gas. I cannot say this vehicle will be trouble free, but at least I know that. I wish everyone luck on getting the ML system fixed, and hope all the complaints have helped. Cheers to all and have a great summer.
Regards
Jason
Regards
Jason
07-21-13, 10:42 AM
#508
Lead Lap
I have finally purchased another vehicle, as I am moving to Florida. My decision was the Telsa with the upgrade system with the performance S package, and yes I did listen th the system with all my music at full blast and test drove it for a while, i was extremely impressed. Like this I have one vehicle that does nothing but drink gasoline and the other no gas. I cannot say this vehicle will be trouble free, but at least I know that. I wish everyone luck on getting the ML system fixed, and hope all the complaints have helped. Cheers to all and have a great summer.
Regards
Jason
Regards
Jason
07-22-13, 07:48 AM
#509
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you all need to trust me, there is a fix. I have it installed in my car. I was the one who filed a lemon law case and ML flew out engineers to install the new amp. If you want confirmation call Robert in Service at Riverside Lexus in California. He can back up my claim, and he can confirm people flew out and installed a new amp and that I was (am) very very happy. Now the reason why I got it before anyone else is because of the Lemon Law case. That is the only reason. Have any of you tried contacting ML and ask when it might be released? make sure you are overly nice in the email. I always got responses to emails that were overly considerate and polite.
If any dealer out there tells you anything other than, its the Amp, and a new one will be available soon. Don't believe them. The amp made all the difference. I now have to turn down the bass, it can get too loud, and my rear view mirror vibrates so much now!!! its awesome!!
If any dealer out there tells you anything other than, its the Amp, and a new one will be available soon. Don't believe them. The amp made all the difference. I now have to turn down the bass, it can get too loud, and my rear view mirror vibrates so much now!!! its awesome!!
07-25-13, 12:34 PM
#510
I just came back from my local Lexus dealer, JM Lexus. They are an exceptional dealership in every way.
They listened to my radio and confirmed they will order the improved 'new' amplifier. (I was previously going to replace the sub but have put that on hold for now...
I will post results once it is installed.
They listened to my radio and confirmed they will order the improved 'new' amplifier. (I was previously going to replace the sub but have put that on hold for now...
I will post results once it is installed.
Last edited by ElliotB; 07-25-13 at 05:18 PM.