Sonnie

I could not tell a difference between the Surround On/Off as far as the sub issues, but have not tested the ASL. I don't think it comes into play when sitting still.

ICnothing

I have just purchased a 2013 Lexus es 300h, and the Mark Levinson system it is the worst I have ever heard. A system they claim 835 watts sucks big time. I would not recommend it to no one a thumping noise from the subwoofer and a rattle in the passenger side door speaker. If I new it was this bad an aftermarket system would be a much better investment. If anyone is looking on purchasing a Lexus es with a Mark Levinson listen to it before you spend the extra money because after you purchase the vehicle Lexus could not care less. I have been waiting 3weeks for a response and nothing from Lexus or the dealership. I had a gs with a Mark Levinson and it sounded 100% better in every way and the vehicle was 4 years old. I am very disappointed in Lexus customer service as well.

bobsobi

Seems like the sweet spot for ML in the ES is the 2010, by virtue of an absence of complaints about it. The 2009 missed largely due to high-resolution 5.1 LPCM being downmixed to stereo. At least I found out what fraction of the package price Lexus considered to be for the ML from the $1600 check they sent me.

ElliotB

"an aftermarket system would be a much better investment" Considering the radio is integrated into the car, there are really only two choices, the standard system (premium sound) or the ML. The speakers can be easily upgraded if desired with either system. Given a choice between the premium sound or the ML, the ML is the obvious choice.

LexRuger

You can keep the radio and add a sound processor that will sum up all the speaker outputs of the stock radio and turn all those outputs into a 2 channel full range signal to an aftermarket amp.

Sonnie

Exactly... Audison, Rockford, JBL, Zapco, AudioControl, and several others make processors that allow use of the factory unit with aftermarket amps and speakers. They also allow for better level matching of the speakers, active crossovers between the speakers (particularly for the front stage) and some of the units will auto equalize the system, although you might be better off finding a professional with good ears to tune it for you. Actually we are going to be taking our ES to one of two dealers that are 4-5 hours from us for a professional install. There are very few we would trust with it. These guys work on really high-end cars on a regular basis by appointment only.

DiabloNino

Robdog1515, do you have any specifics on who you talked to at ML? Did he give you a part number for the new amplifier? What dealership are you working with that I may be able to have my delaership contact.

I too experienced the extremely poor sound quality from the ML system. While I did not by the ES300h for the Stereo, I certainly would not have purchased it without the stereo and that was a major feature that I wanted in the vehicle.

The issue is most certainly with the amplifier. I ran a professional sound testing applcation on the sound system to validate exactly what frequencies the defect occurs at. Here is what I discovered.

Frequency Volume that failure occured
20hz 40
25hz 41
30hz 42
35hz 43
45hz 45
50hz 50
55hz 52
60hz 53
65hz 55
70hz 58
75hz 59
80hz 60(max)

This was just the frequencies that were failing to the subwoofer, by guess is that 100hz is the crossover cutoff.

I also noted that the noise continues past those frequencies and can be heard in the mid-bass speakers in the doors at the following:

90hz 37
100hz 41
110hz 28
120hz 23
130hz 19
140hz 26
150hz 38
etc...

I demonstrated this performance to the mechanics at my local delaership who said all they could do was send it to the Engineers in California. Those enignieers were able to duplicate the issue on the ML ES cars they had as well and came to the conclusion that they system is working as desginged since it is happening on all ES ML systems. What a joke!

I am continuing to escalate this with Lexus and will keep this community informed. Please let me know if anyone else has a case with Lexus that they are also pursuing. If Lexus does not resolve I will certainly pursue a "Lemon Law" claim.

ElliotB

DiabloNino, what resolution would you be looking for with a lemon law claim?

Sonnie

Those numbers look to be about what I experienced... in that neighborhood anyway. Most of what I have listened to is my reference music and it has been run through a spectrogram to see the lowest frequencies produced in the music... something I did a few years ago just for kicks. I thought some music was producing lower frequencies than it actually was and decided to test it to learn that particular music only reached to about 30Hz. Only a few songs reached 27Hz with any significant SPL. The majority of the SPL was above 30Hz... 35Hz and up.

I have not noticed any bottoming from the midbass speakers in the doors. All I can hear is the dash speakers, which sound like really cheap speakers. I had to listen close a few times just to know the door speakers were even playing. They certainly are not level matched in our ES. Those numbers for the door speakers show that I should have been hearing some issues with them on some of the songs I play, although the sounds from the sub may have been distracting me.

Robdog1515

To diablo. I live in California and I have my vehicle serviced at lexus of riverside. I have been dealing with a service consultant named frank. (951) 353-0903. I gave frank the contact I have for Harman (mark levinson) they contacted my person and is now dealing with the lexus rep for Harman. My direct contact begged me to keep his name and number off any forums b/c they don't have any customer support for lexus owners he didn't want to get overwelmed with calls. But please call frank and get him to give your dealership his reps number and any info he has.

I went to the dealwrship on Tuesday and showed the tech guy the distortion, he agreed it was bad and they called harman for confirmation and later that day they ordered a new amp. I am fairly confident this will resolve the issue since the harman guy was so confident. With that being said the fact that one forum subscriber reported the new amp did nothing to resolve the issue leads me to believe his dealership pulled from old stock. My dealership service people have gone home, tomorrow I will ask frank to verify the revision number on the new amp is greater(newer) than the one currently in the car so I will know for sure. The amp should be in tonight or tomorrow so I may have the car back as early as tomorrow. As soon as I get it and test it I will report back.


Diablo i am very impressed with your independent study. I will forward your results to the general harman support people which deal with home audio products and they will forward it to the appropriate people so they can review your results. Hopefully they call me and say "yes we concluded the same frequencies and the new amp will resolve this." I hope a prestigious company like harman would use a test track like you did to analyze the performance of the system not soley a music cd for someone in the company.

Here is the email address for the service people at harman, I encourage everyone to send them your results and concerns . They told me there is a long delay for receiving feedback from Lwxus from customers.

Csupport@harman.com

And their general support number which does not include automotive but the more calls the better is

(888) 691-4171 listen to the prompts for mark levinson support and state your issue with distortion in your lexus vehicle. When they say they don't have a branch for that for customers tell them to do you a favor and put you through with a tech guy that deals with the ML amps for lexus.

The amp part number is in one of my posts in a precious page on this thread, I lost the paper I wrote it on. Look at page 5 or 6 from me.

ICnothing

I have to agree the support has been a joke from the dealerships, at the end of the day it is a premium system and that is what we expect. I was curious and went to a Toyota dealership and tried the premium system on the Camry (JBL) sad to say it sounded better than my Mark Levinson in my es300. I e-mail Mark Levinson or (harman & united radio) last week and they not had the courtesy to e-mail as of yet. I think we should all have to contact Lexus and continue to stay on it until Lexus comes up with a resolution. To new buyer of an ES make sure you listen to it before buying because the runaround you get later is a pain.

ronscal

Bought this car 2 months ago from Tustin Lexus in California. Sound system on AM was horrible from day 1. Brought car in several times and they keep telling me there is nothing they can do. The talk radio stations on AM is horrible. The Tone moves around from bass to surround and back. There is NO crystal clear reception on this system. It is the worst I have heard. I was told at the dealership they would forward the problem to Lexus. I paid cash for a brand new car and feel like I should be refunded 100% since they have a problem and they have no solution. I am waiting for a response from Lexus Corporation. I will turn this over to a law firm if they can't resolve this immediately. Would like feedback from anyone with similar problems. Thanks.

ronscal

Bought this car 2 months ago from Tustin Lexus in California. Sound system on AM was horrible from day 1. Brought car in several times and they keep telling me there is nothing they can do. The talk radio stations on AM is horrible. The Tone moves around from bass to surround and back. There is NO crystal clear reception on this system. It is the worst I have heard. I was told at the dealership they would forward the problem to Lexus. I paid cash for a brand new car and feel like I should be refunded 100% since they have a problem and they have no solution. I am waiting for a response from Lexus Corporation. I will turn this over to a law firm if they can't resolve this immediately. Would like feedback from anyone with similar problems. Thanks.

Mike728

ronscal, have you tried it with surround mode off?

ElliotB

Roncal, is the problem with the radio or the signal strength of the stations are trying to listen to?

FWIW, the AM reception on my radio is excellent, even with one of my local stations which has a pretty weak signal.

Is the reception/sound good with FM and with XM?