jetman

It seems to me that Lexus Enform and Toyota Entune are essentially the same. However, Toyota gives Entune owners 3 years of complimentary apps and data services, while Lexus owners only get one year free. After paying over 45K for a new ES, I think that at the very least we should get the same trial period as someone who buys a much less expensive Toyota. Anyone else think we're getting ripped off?

Toys4RJill

Its simple, Lexus know people who have a Lexus will pay. Just like how Lexus service costs more.

jetman

But if I have service in my Lexus, even an oil change, my dealer will give me a "free" loaner. Sure, I know the cost of the loaner is built into the price of the oil change, but at least I can see where I'm getting a little something extra for my money. I'm not getting anything extra with Enform except a different name and a little different placement of the icons on the screen. Just because I'm fortunate enough to have the means to buy a Lexus does not make it right for Toyota to take advantage of me like that. It's not the money, it's the principle...

Toys4RJill

So I guess you will not like to know that Toyota has a complimentary maintenance plne for the first two years for any new Toyota?

LexBob2

I have a friend who bought a 2011 Avalon with the maintenance plan as well as an attractive finance rate/plan. Lucky guy.

I'm sure that Toyota is interested in a farily high retention rate when new Entune customers come up for renewal, as that is when they'll make their money. Hence the longer complimentary period to get customers familar with and using Enturne frequently. GM struggled early on with On Star low renewal rates. Not sure how they are now but probably higher than in the past.

If the renewal rate is low Lexus can always extend the complimentary period quickly.

Toys4RJill

The Toyota Entune is not competing the Lexus Enform, it competes with the Ford My Touch Sync which is three years comp.

I get what you are saying that the Lexus customer should not pay for three years, but it is the other way arround. Lexus is almost higher in almost everything that are indentical such as oil changes, major service, parts, and yes Enform cost. Lexus when compared to Toyota is not about value.

jetman

I was already aware of Toyota's two year complimentary maintenance. Much as I would like to have it, I think the additional 1 year/12000 mile bumper-to-bumper warranty is a better value. As reliable as Lexus vehicle are, there's still a chance that something major could go wrong in that 4th year and I'm glad to have the coverage...

jetman

But it is about perceived value. Here's my point: if I go to my Lexus dealer I'm greeted immediately by a service advisor. I'm given a complimentary loaner vehicle, even for an oil change. If I bring my car in the morning, there is someone there to cook me a free omelet. Should I choose to wait, the waiting area is much nicer than at the Toyota dealer. Sure, I could drive down the street to Denny's and buy my own omelet, but my Lexus dealer makes me feel special and that my business is important to them. I don't get the same feeling at an ordinary dealer. I still feel I am getting value at my Lexus dealership, even though I know I'm paying a premium for it. The dealership experience was the thing I missed most when I traded in my old IS 250 for a Buick LaCrosse, and it's why I was anxious to get back into another Lexus.

But, back to the subject at hand: Lexus Enform gives me no extra value, perceived or otherwise, over Toyota Entune. The two services are virtually identical, except a Toyota owner gets two additional years free. It's not a deal-breaker, but I can't help but think that Toyota is taking advantage of me simply because I bought a premium vehicle.

Toys4RJill

I don't see any value in having a free egg or a loaner car for an oil change. I would rather have the eggs as "a la carte" and have a much cheaper oil change. As for the loaner, I also would rather have an express 30 minute oil change or your money back for a Lexus vehicle.

Now, if they offered the eggs and loaner car for the same price oil change as a Toyota, they I see value. Preceived or not.

Now I love my CT and we loved our LX470 but when the price for the exact same service as a Toyota car is much higher, than I see that as rip off.

I was appalled that my CT cost an $100 to deliver compared to a Prius which came off the same transport boat from Japan.


In my opinion, I don't see ANY value in owning a Lexus as it is premium vehicle. I do like the 4 year warranty though.

I lived with it and I do take my CT to Lexus for the change.

I will say, the 2 year Toyota serice is pretty nice and I do remember when Toyota roadside assistance was not standard like it is today.

Back to the topic of Enform, Toyota is only offering the three years because GM, Ford both do for the same similar services they offer.

photoguy

I think you're right its about the competition. Lexus is not going to lose a lot of customers to Toyota so the benchmark is what other luxury brands are offering.

It's also not specific to Lexus. Of course they will try to extract as much profit overall for both lines, but the strategy varies on different items.

Regarding the eggs, you may want them, but it's not about saving you every last dollar, like the OP said they are trying to create an experience to make you feel special. If the eggs don't work they'll do something else in the long run.

jetman

While I totally respect your opinion, I would venture to say that the dealership experience is a big part of owning a Lexus, and there is a perceived value in the extra pampering you get being a Lexus owner. If the dealership experience were not important, why wouldn't be all be buying Avalons instead of ESes? The Avalon is a fine car (the new 2013 model looks especially nice). Build quality is excellent, it has features even the ES doesn't (cooled - not ventilated - seats, for one), and it costs a few thousand less. But it doesn't come with the Lexus ownership experience.

Value isn't just about money. It's about time and convenience, and a whole lot of other things. Value sometimes costs you extra money. Why doesn't the average Lexus owner go to the Jiffy Lube for the 30 minute oil change? One thing, the pampering, of course. But for me, it's knowing that my car is going to be serviced by a real mechanic (one of the best in the area), not some grease monkey who might not have finished high school - someone who may see a problem developing and not just try to upsell me on a radiator flush. And when my car comes back it will be freshly washed. So I get a free breakfast, I'm not inconvenienced by having the "courtesy shuttle" take me to work (and I don't have to call them to pick me up again) because I have a Lexus loaner (not a Yaris), and my car is nice and clean when I pick it up. This represents value to me. Have I paid extra for it? Yes. Is it worth it? To me, yes.

Let me share a little story about dealership experience: After owning two Lexus vehicles, I traded in for a 2010 Buick LaCrosse. It's a nice car with some features I wish the ES had, but is definitely less reliable. When I took it to the dealer for my first service, I was shown the waiting area. It was a small harshly-lit room with about 10 dirty chairs, a few magazines laying around, a 19 inch tube TV set sitting on a crappy old table, and a pot of stale coffee My first thought was "What have I gotten myself into?" This is the best they can do when I just paid 40 grand for my car? How important or special do you think I felt at that dealership? I really couldn't wait to get back into a Lexus! If there's one thing Lexus excels at, it's the ownership experience. Yes, I value that.

Sorry I've strayed so far from my original topic. Back to Enform vs Entune. What Lexus should do is make some useful Lexus-specific apps for the Enform system which won't be available on the Toyota models. Then at least they could justify the reduced free trial period by telling us we're getting more than just a different name. Sorry for the long post.

LexVince

I'm picking up my third new ES on Monday and have been reading the various posts regarding Enform. Not having this feature in the past, I'm not sure of it's real value and was wondering if anyone knew the cost after the first year?

LexBob2

On the Lexus web site under Owners Resources they have subscription costs for the various Enform/Destination Assist packages for 2010-2012 models. Maybe they've added the cost for 2013's.

jetman

Here's the link: https://secure.drivers.lexus.com/lex...bscriptions.do

LexVince

Thanks for the feedback and link. I can't be sure if the annual cost of Enform is excessive, but I can confirm that the monthly fee for XM/Sirus is ($173.88 yearly). I have a home and auto subscription to XM/Sirus and both are under $80/yr. Perhaps Lexus is providing "directional" cost which is negotiable?