LexBob2

I like the looks and what I've read about the ATS. 3 engine choices and RWD or AWD..

SW17LS

Only issue with he ATS is its small...

Could look at an XTS, but its gonna be more optioned up.

Sonnie

Yeah... it would get on up to around $55K with everything we would want, but we did look at Cadillacs. She was not fond of them though. She is a pretty tough one to please, no doubt. She love the look of the Escalade exterior, but that's about it.

She liked the C-Class Benz looks all around, but it was too small. Of course she just flat fell in love with the S-Class until she looked at the sticker. GULP!

SW17LS

Yeah a guy who works for me has a new C300, its really sharp and classy but very small. That's one of the nice things about the ES, unlike the C, A4 and 3 series you get a grown up size car.

The XTS ain't worth $55k either.

Are you willing to look at used? She could get a 3 year old certified S Class for about what a loaded ES costs.

Sonnie

While they are nice, they are gas hogs and would never work for her.

SW17LS

They are definitely gas hogs...

amphipri0n

You had a good experience with your 5 series, what was the reason for selling? The F10 still gets you the 30mpg highway you're looking for in both 525 and the 535 and is great while under warranty. While I think leasing is generally a bad idea and prefer all cash for car purchases, it can make sense with the two German brands if you're planning on dumping them every few years anyway, or can roll it into your business.

I would suggest the Audi a6 but I think i already know how you feel about it based on your take on the new Avalons front end (which I like :P )

SW17LS

I think his issue with the 5 series is expense. That would be the same issue with the A6, once you start adding options.

Agree, if you are leasing you'd be surprised how close the payments can be on a 5 series or GS to an ES. Audi doesn't have good leases.

I'm paying about $40 a month more than I would have paid for a UL ES for my GS...and the GS is $60k vs $47k for the ES.

Sonnie

The A6 front end is not too bad... not nearly as wide and catfish mouth looking. More like a sucker fish. lol. The main issue with it was the 4 cylinder to get the better gas mileage. Plus we did not like the nav screen popping up out of the dash and sticking up like a sore thumb. It was distracting. But overall a very nice car.

Selling the BMW is a hindsight mistake. We only owed $40K on it when we sold it. At the time, I needed a larger truck for my business and we were over book on the Kia Optima, so we felt like it would be easier to sell the 528i... which we got a ridiculous price for it from a very wealthy Arabian family. I wish we had it back, but we don't. It got every bit of 30 MPG combined!!! That same car list for over $60K though and we need to stay around that $45K mark. We did consider used, but we could find ZERO in the color and options we wanted within 300 miles of us. Very few were ordered with everything we had on ours.


We will drive this car for 5+ years at least... probably longer. At this point we have a $40,000 PenFed Payment Saver Loan at 1.99% 60 x $454 with a $15K balloon at the end. We will pay the difference down ($6,500 on the ES350). We save about $3,000 over all this way, if we compare it to buying out the lease at the end of 36 months.

mrBillFL

consider a CPO - off lease LS? or GS

I would not own a BMW or Audi past 100k miles, due to maintenance costs. But a high mile Lexus, I would not worry about.

then again might not have the MPG you want either....

amphipri0n

Based on what I've read about what you're looking for it does sound like the ES350 is a good fit. As I and others have mentioned the most commonly mentioned complaints are:

1) Hard plastics used near contact areas (bottom areas of door/dash and near the center stack). However, if you were happy with the interior of the 5 which had and still has its share of hard plastics on the lower doors I don't think you'll mind. (what I do mind and have a personal complaint over is with a minor creak with the pleather panel above the door armrest which I am looking to have the dealer fix at @ 5k miles)

2) Harsher ride - you've covered this pretty well regarding the tire/rim choice etc... I think the a good way to address this concern is to go on an extended test drive... OR the best way would be to borrow one and drive it through your daily commute!

Nice noise charts btw.

SW17LS

Yeah you never want to lease and then buy it out, if you're going to lease...lease and trade in, if you are going to buy...buy from the onset.

The LS would be great, but the ES will get better mileage.

To be fair, materials in the 5 are much better than those in the ES. Obviously the 5 is more expensive. BMW doesn't use that sort of hard, coarse plastic that I have an issue with in the ES.

Sonnie

Well... it is a done deal. Our dealer found us a UL Silver/Light Gray in Tampa, FL and they are having it trucked up to Alabama. Should be here by Monday or so.

I appreciate all the options thrown at us. It really did make us think more about some of the ones we had passed on... and even think about a couple we had not thought of. In the end though, I think we will be happy and no doubt this will be nicer than the Kia, especially on those longer road trips... and overall it will be much nicer too. Chances are we'll end up swapping out the stock tires for softer tires with a little more sidewall, but we will give the stock tires a spin first.

I suppose you all will have to put up with me hanging around a little more often... here and there. I own a fairly nice size forum myself, so I appreciate members who are willing to spend time helping others.

Arty101

Congrats. Good choice. It should be a lot nicer than a Kia so enjoy.

amphipri0n

I would agree that of course the overall material quality is better in the 5 than the ES. However, next time you get a chance to hop into one, check out the hard, coarse plastics that are still present in the lower half of door panels. Basic grade plastics are an easy way to save money and finding places to skimp is part of cost engineering to stay competitive for all mass-production car manufacturers like Lexus and BMW. I brought up this specific example because the OP is a previous owner and can have a quick frame of reference.

The German marques are a lot better now about using soft touch surfaces, but this was one of the points that always went to Lexus when it came to interior refinement. Now, it's less noticeable.