useshadri

I bought a used car from a Concord Lexus Dealer in California and found that the Lexus 2014 had a serious auto accident which was fixed internally and was not reported to me by the dealer. When I called the Lexus headquarters they told me that this was between the dealer and me. I bought the car trusting the Lexus warranty program and now I am wondering what my options are. I would appreciate your advise.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

Lexus CPO certification allows for accidents. What constitutes a minor or major accident? Open to interpretation. If the car isn't CPO warrantied then there's no obligation regarding damage. Did you check carfax and autochek before buying? It's a must do, but no guarantee. What kind of damage do you consider serious? If the dealer won't step up, your only recourse is an attorney or possibly small claims on your own. You have to be able prove that the damage happened and you still may not win because you have to prove you were financially damaged. Sorry to hear you're unhappy and best wishes for a good outcome. This would be unusual behavior for a Lexus dealer in my experience.

lesz

+1

I'm sorry to see that the OP is not happy with his/her purchase, but I would need to know a lot more details before I could decide whether the use of the word "cheated" is appropriate.

I'd need to know more details about the collision damage, and I'd need to know specifics about what the dealer had said about the car's history and how that information was presented. I would also want to know how, if at all, the information about the car's history was misrepresented.

If the OP was, in fact, "cheated", that would not be the first time that an automobile dealer had done so to a customer, but without a lot more information and without taking into consideration the fact that there may be another side to the story, I can't believe that it is justified for me or anyone else to come to the conclusion that the dealer has wronged the customer.

Most states have a consumer protection department that is usually a part of the office of the Attorney General of the state, and those consumer protection departments can be very effective in dealing with issues like this. My suggestion would be to contact the office in your state, but, in order to be successful in such efforts, the OP is going to need to provide much more specific evidence that the dealer did, in fact, act in an illegal and deceptive manner.

LexRuger

http://www.lemonlaw.com/carbuyingquiz-results.html

jda2000

Good information to know.

useshadri

The car was CPO . The accident report did not show up on CARFAX or any other internet service because the Lexus dealer fixed the car without reporting to the insurance. The dealer gave me CARFAX reports but failed to mention the car had been involved in the accident. There was extensive damage to the front left side of the car and I got a copy of the damage from the Lexus internal reporting system. I was confident that Lexus dealers would be open and honest with their customers. I am disappointed that both the Lexus headquarters and the dealer are not willing to acknowledge that they have not been honest with me. I believe that the dealer should give me an extended bumper to bumper warranty for hiding the history of the car. Am I out of line? I would appreciate your advice. Thanks.

lesz

My feelings about the situation could be quite different depending on the specifics of what you are describing as "extensive damage". If you are talking about sheet metal damage, replacing a bumper, replacing hardware, etc., I would not consider that to be extensive damage. On the other hand, if you are talking about frame damage, mechanical damage, etc., I would be more inclined to consider that to truly be extensive damage.

The point of my earlier post in this thread and of this post is that you may well have good reason to be upset; however, my concern is more related to the manner in which you are presenting your concern on a public forum. You are accusing the dealer of "cheating" you, and you are naming the dealer. I question whether it was appropriate to do so, and that is especially true since we are only hearing your description of what happened and your description of the damage.

Again, you might well have legitimate reason to be upset, but I don't believe that others can judge whether you are "out of line" after having heard only your version of the facts, and I don't feel that it is at all appropriate to publicly indict a specifically named dealer with only that one one version of the facts. I'm not sure how any of that can be productive.

As I said in my early post, if you truly feel that you were cheated and if you have the facts to back up that belief, I would suggest processing your concerns through the consumer protection office of you state's Attorney General. Also, I'll add that I'll bet that there are quite a few who have posted here who have bought even brand new vehicles that have had damage repaired and who were never aware of those repairs.

LexRuger

Sadly if you didn't ask, it didn't happen. And now your car will always be significantly worth less than similar cars with no body work.

rx11fan

I was in the same boat a couple of years ago. Nothing on carfax and lexus service report showed some repair. i called the body shop that did the work and they looked it up and found that its front bumper damage. the dealer priced it a couple of thousand below market which is why i bought it. Usually there is nothing to worry about if the repair is below 2K$ or so. I assume you got a pretty good price on it, at least a couple of K$ below market. no issues with warranty and it never shows up on carfax. Dealer usually claims loss of value from his insurance which is why they lower the price significantly.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

Glad you reposted. I understand why you're upset. Until you spend more time reading other's posts about Lexus, the vehicles issues and how to repair them without spending a bundle or making things worse, you're like me and everyone else. Assuming that CPO is "the ultimate" and that Lexus cars are like any other car you've had before. It's just not that way.
If the accident caused any frame or suspension damage, I could see some sort of warranty extension, but if it's sheet metal damage, no. It's possible the price of the car was lower than normal (a good deal) when you bought it. That makes up for "diminished value" from the repair, although if it's not reported anywhere, it may never be spotted by the next buyer. Maybe a $1500 service credit would be reasonable. Take this request to the sales manager and the general manager. Give yourself some time so you can do this in a calm, reasonable manner. Good luck.

chrisexv6

If you have a copy of the damage, can you summarize it in this thread?

As mentioned before, if you are talking a new bumper cover, new fender sheet metal, etc....not a huge deal.

But if you are looking at new radiator core support (indicating that the accident breeched a standard "bumper bump" accident), frame straightening, etc then I think you have a legitimate gripe.

Have you talked to the dealer about this? What did they say?

lesz

Several people have referred to the term "diminished value". Specific guidelines related to diminished value have been developed and are used by the insurance industry and the used car industry. Every repair that is made as the result of a collision does not necessarily create diminished value. When diminished value is created and it comes as the result of major repairs, such as repairs to the vehicle's frame, the actual calculated diminished value can be as high as 10% of the vehicle's value, but for most repairs, it turns out to be in the range of 1-2%, and, often, there is no diminished value at all. Also, most states now have laws that require body shops to submit repair information to a data base when the cost of repairs exceeds some specified amount. While that amount varies by state, it is often upwards of $5000. This link may be helpful to understanding the concept and calculation of diminished value.

http://kielichlawfirm.com/insurance-...-value-claims/

When you are talking about repairing sheet metal damage to a body panel, replacing a bumper cover, etc. and when there is no record of the repairs entered into the state's data base because the cost of the repairs did not reach the threshold for reporting, the concept of diminished value does not even come into play.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

I think that it's convenient to use the term diminished value in the place of "loss of value" or depreciation" which occurs every month. Any sign of esthetic repairs will prompt the used car appraiser to tell you it's worth less than non repaired vehicles. Really glad you pointed out the technical definition of diminished value. But I won't be surprised if people keep using the term. Most just aren't that precise.

bc6152

I'm thinking that if the dealer repaired the vehicle in house, that the damage to said vehicle might not have been extensive. I also believe that if the damage was severe and affected more than a fender, grille, etc., that the dealer would be inclined to make a report to one of the vehicle history databases. Further, if the dealer CPO'd the car they're not looking for problems later on. I'm not sure who is responsible for warranty repairs on a CPO vehicle - Toyota or the dealer. All that being said, I'm quite sure that almost everyone on this forum, given the choice, would choose to buy a non damaged car over a repaired car. Several previous posts referred to "frame damage".The Lexus ES bodies are welded unibody as opposed to a frame.

http://www.lexus.com/models/ES/specifications

swfla

iTrader: (1)

Give us another easy to use/understand term in place of frame damage. Maybe it'll catch on.