Hriley

The number of posts and strong opinions on this topic show how hot the topic of tech is. And why Lexus is not selling well with millennials.

With exception of a few posts, I'm seeing most here echoing what the consumer reports and JD power surveys show, onboard navigation systems ARE useless and found most everyone will use their smartphone gps far over their brand new cars nav system.

The systems are not useless for Toyota Motor Corp who makes bank on selling 10+ year old tech at a premium. Most all other car manufacturers are a little more up to date. Dodge outsourced to Garmin, but still ads a 10x factor to price.

Last I checked, the electronics and development Toyota and Hondas system is outsourced around $100/unit, and it's a $2k option, unless you buy a $90K car, where you're probably paying $5k for one 'standard' (hidden in the cost). To include android or apple carplay costs the Toyota Motor Corp money up front AND lost opportunity for updates. And the latest ES will require latest map for all of the app and firmware updates in future, per Lexus.

Who would have thought a decade ago. BMW and Buick making softer and quieter riding cars with more up to date tech, and Lexus making stiffer and edgier cars with out of date tech and purposely increasing engine noise (GS). Lexus still wins hands down in reliability, but tech is easy to get up to date reliably if they're less greedy. I hope they advance in this area, and don't give up the ghost in sacrificing the ES ride/smoothness/quietness to attract millennial buyers.

lesz

I've been buying Toyota and Lexus vehicles for almost 20 years. During all of that period of time, Lexus and Toyota have never been at the leading edge with regard to technology.

Whether it has been with navigation systems, 4WD/AWD technology, collision avoidance systems, or even simple things like, years ago, heated seats or auto dimming mirrors, Lexus and Toyota vehicles have often lacked features and technology that you could have gotten on a much less expensive Chevy or Mazda.

The philosophy of Toyota and Lexus has seemed to be that they base the building of their vehicles on quality workmanship and reliability, and they have often included features and bells and whistles in their vehicles only long after the same features and technology have been commonplace in the vehicles from other manufacturers.

Hriley

Good points. I appreciate their reliability and workmanship hands down. They used to be a little closer to the median in tech, I remember their first GPS in cars were right in line with their competition (they've gotten a little lazy and greedy here if you ask me...happy to agree to disagree). They were first come with a few gizmos like auto park.

TechNut

I can't help but think many people also compare the car Nav to phone Nav products. The phone designers can move on new designs much faster than automotive designers. The phones also have Internet access for easy map updates. It doesn't seem like a fair comparison at all.

Perhaps some of the newer systems will allow for tighter integration to truly integrate the phones?

coolsaber

So we change the goal posts to make Lexus products seem competitive. Bad move. Car Navigation development and feature sets have already moved from the old 10 year lead time design to being more modular and frequent cycle update friendly. The european brands have gone into some amazing stuff with infotainment and constant design updates. And if you cant manage that, just add in a front end software setup like carplay, or android auto both available in lower tier VW models and Hyundai, Kia, and Honda. Toyota has however publicly stated it has no intentions of adding such, and wants infotainment to remain in house.

In car wifi, is not necessary by virtue of how toyota loads up entune/enform by a mobile data from your device. OTA updates are still confined to selection of brands.

Your point maybe have applied back in 08 when the iPhone was still in the early adoption phase, but now its just not. The tech exists, the capital and direction from toyota exists, its just seems toyota wants to chase new customer with radical new design ideas on the grille, but everything else should remain the good ole Toyota, since their is no disruptive reason they have been made aware of in terms of marketshare or profits.

TechNut

You may want to read my post. I never once mentioned any particular brand. I was making a generalization. You are welcome to disagree with my opinion(s), but if you are going to quote me, at least do so accurately.

You clearly have a bone to pick with Lexus regarding their Nav implementations. I understand your opinion even if I don't completely agree with it. We are not all going to think alike, or have the same requirements and/or expectations. There are many different brands out there. I hope you find one that comes with a Navigation system that meets your expectations as Lexus clearly does not.

coolsaber

Thanks, for letting me know? At the end of the day, i`m just expressing a viewpoint similar to yourself, i just prefer not being an apologist. I think Lexus makes great cars mechanically. But infotainment wise it drops the ball, and after living with smartphones for the greater part of the decade, would expect the world's largest automaker to pick up the pace and stop continuously going against grain in certain areas no one really cares considers top priority (predator grill) but then sticks itself like glue on other areas.

Sidenote:
Personally I think infotainment, technology and tech in the cabin has become a huge selling point of vehicles. We want the tech thats available in our hands available in our cars as we have grown accustom to the conveniences they bring and possibly offer. Not saying we need the bleeding edge of tech since those are where the tech is more a showpiece then functional, but at least some things need to come about. that even lower budget vehicles are privileged to. First hand experience dont make routing take longer then what I can already get in older Lexus Nav system.

Agree to Disagree of course so feel free

imrankh24

Hey all! Is there any way in the setting where I can select it to avoid toll roads? Any help will be appreciated

Mike728

Not sure what year ES you own, but there is a way on my 2013. Nav Manual page 101 and 102 explain the route preference options pretty well. LINK

TechNut

By and large, i agree with your sentiments coolsaber, and I'm not a fan of the new Darth Vader grills either, though I have come to accept this strange design quirk of the new Lexus models.

I don't think I'm being an apologist though. I have no doubt there are many factors that got us to this point in Nav systems. Some manufacturers have likely been more nimble than others in advancing new tech, and I agree that is likely becoming a greater part of the purchase decision. Perhaps part of my naivety comes from the fact that the only other brand of Nav system I have any real experience with (beyond rentals) is Toyota systems, which are not visibly different than the Lexus systems.

We all rate cars on our own subjective scales on many different factors. I would suggest that you put Nav and infotainment systems on a higher scale than I do. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, I'm just not as passionate about that one feature.

I agree the Nav has shortcomings though, and my biggest complaint is that there doesn't appear to be a way to apply preferences such as "fastest route" versus "most direct route" or "avoid toll roads" as imramnh24 has asked.

TechNut

That is very helpful! Thanks. However, when I used it for a destination within the city, it did not give me any alternate routes. Is there some preference setting that directs it to offer alternate route guidance? Clearly, I need to dive deeper into the manual.

imrankh24

A 2016, but I'll try that today thank you very much

ThomasGS4

iTrader: (19)

I personally use my navigation system merely to see what roads I am approaching...it is very helpful in that regard. Otherwise, it is easier to use my phone's navigation.


Is it possible that with the rise of distracted drivers on the road, Toyota/Lexus doesn't want to add to the cause by purposefully not including some technology other brands have to offer?

Marty54

I purchased my LS460 used Dec 2015. My 2008 LS460 Navigation has not been updated since the factory install. I use a Garmin as backup for everything, and running both Lexus Navigation and the Garmin at same time for 6 months now. Both work great, and the Lexus Navigation is extremely accurate for position and location. I estimate 99.99% of the highway system loaded in 2008 vehicles is still present and used today. My Garmin gave me confidence the outdated Lexus Nav system can be trusted as a stand alone system. But what a vehicle for reliability.

deltabravo

I have an iPhone 4. I think the 5 year old nav in my "new to me" GS350 is great!

Yes I am a bit behind the tech curve. But seriously I think the seamless integration of the built-in system with the rest of the car's tech gives it a leg up in the which-nav-to-use game. Luddite though I am, within the first day of ownership I was tapping a button on the steering wheel, speaking a few words, and getting directions to my desired destination. I can't do that with google maps on my iPhone.