cpo or not
12-09-17 | 11:58 AM
#1
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From: Indiana
cpo or not
i know the opinions are pretty split on this but would still like to here some arguments pro and con
would you buy a 2013 cpo es 350 with 60 miles or a used 2014 es 350 with about 45k on the clock for the same price both ?
(considered the used one has recommended maintenance records)
if used 2014 - the bumper to bumper warranty will expire very soon, if cpo 2013 it will have a 2 year unlimited miles warranty but is a year older and has roughly 15k more miles
resale value not a concern
would you buy a 2013 cpo es 350 with 60 miles or a used 2014 es 350 with about 45k on the clock for the same price both ?
(considered the used one has recommended maintenance records)
if used 2014 - the bumper to bumper warranty will expire very soon, if cpo 2013 it will have a 2 year unlimited miles warranty but is a year older and has roughly 15k more miles
resale value not a concern
12-09-17 | 02:01 PM
#2
Driver School Candidate
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 15
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From: Michigan
I just want to put in my two cents considering that I just purchased a one-owner CPO 2014 ES350 with 52K miles and Luxury Pkg/Nav for $21.5K before taxes for my aging parents. It also encompasses your other questions on the threads that I had been reading but have not responded to.
I personally think CPO Lexus is worth it especially since it also included two years of free maintenance starting at 60K and I got a good deal on it (it was originally listed at $26K but sitting for three months). However, I'm biased since I have a history of being ripped off by car repairmen and am willing to pay a little more for the peace of mind. My parents just drove it in the first major snowfall today and even with FWD and all-season tires, it was a pleasure to drive.
In your situation, I would pick the 2013 CPO which costs the dealership $1,395 to certify. Assuming the 2014 is also from the same dealership, not sure why they didn't decide to certify that one. If you have the link to the vehicles, I can maybe give you more advice in terms of pricing and comp, etc.
Or you could do it yourself. I recommend Edmunds and VMR for pricing comps and showing to the dealer when negotiating, not KBB or Nada. Depending on how long the car has been on the lot, you can probably get a good deal this month as they're trying to fulfill and compete for quotas and clearing the lots for new inventory.
Good luck!
I personally think CPO Lexus is worth it especially since it also included two years of free maintenance starting at 60K and I got a good deal on it (it was originally listed at $26K but sitting for three months). However, I'm biased since I have a history of being ripped off by car repairmen and am willing to pay a little more for the peace of mind. My parents just drove it in the first major snowfall today and even with FWD and all-season tires, it was a pleasure to drive.
In your situation, I would pick the 2013 CPO which costs the dealership $1,395 to certify. Assuming the 2014 is also from the same dealership, not sure why they didn't decide to certify that one. If you have the link to the vehicles, I can maybe give you more advice in terms of pricing and comp, etc.
Or you could do it yourself. I recommend Edmunds and VMR for pricing comps and showing to the dealer when negotiating, not KBB or Nada. Depending on how long the car has been on the lot, you can probably get a good deal this month as they're trying to fulfill and compete for quotas and clearing the lots for new inventory.
Good luck!
12-09-17 | 04:47 PM
#4
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From: Michigan
I would definitely go for the 14 even with higher mileage. It would've missed one Midwest winter and the value differential for one year newer is much higher than the mileage differential (in this case, about $1K). Also the 13 is the first year of the new 6th generation, so might be more kinks than the 14.
I can't copy the links, but here are Edmunds TMV comparisons with the mileage adjustments:
2013 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 16962 including +1123 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 18716 including mileage adjustment
CPO: 21203 including mileage adjustment
2014 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 18093 including -908 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 19802 including mileage adjustment
CPO 21984 including mileage adjustment
Like I said, I got mine 14 CPO 52K with luxury/nav packages (worth about $5K MSRP but probably worth half now) that's been sitting around for 3 months on the lot and going for auction in 10 days for $21.5K. Assuming your 14 model doesn't include any packages, I would shoot for $18-19K.
Hope this helps.
I can't copy the links, but here are Edmunds TMV comparisons with the mileage adjustments:
2013 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 16962 including +1123 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 18716 including mileage adjustment
CPO: 21203 including mileage adjustment
2014 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 18093 including -908 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 19802 including mileage adjustment
CPO 21984 including mileage adjustment
Like I said, I got mine 14 CPO 52K with luxury/nav packages (worth about $5K MSRP but probably worth half now) that's been sitting around for 3 months on the lot and going for auction in 10 days for $21.5K. Assuming your 14 model doesn't include any packages, I would shoot for $18-19K.
Hope this helps.
Last edited by wontonly; 12-09-17 at 04:50 PM.
12-10-17 | 09:04 AM
#5
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From: Indiana
I would definitely go for the 14 even with higher mileage. It would've missed one Midwest winter and the value differential for one year newer is much higher than the mileage differential (in this case, about $1K). Also the 13 is the first year of the new 6th generation, so might be more kinks than the 14.
I can't copy the links, but here are Edmunds TMV comparisons with the mileage adjustments:
2013 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 16962 including +1123 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 18716 including mileage adjustment
CPO: 21203 including mileage adjustment
2014 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 18093 including -908 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 19802 including mileage adjustment
CPO 21984 including mileage adjustment
Like I said, I got mine 14 CPO 52K with luxury/nav packages (worth about $5K MSRP but probably worth half now) that's been sitting around for 3 months on the lot and going for auction in 10 days for $21.5K. Assuming your 14 model doesn't include any packages, I would shoot for $18-19K.
Hope this helps.
I can't copy the links, but here are Edmunds TMV comparisons with the mileage adjustments:
2013 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 16962 including +1123 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 18716 including mileage adjustment
CPO: 21203 including mileage adjustment
2014 Lexus ES 350 clean condition:
Private Party 18093 including -908 for mileage adjustment
Dealer Retail 19802 including mileage adjustment
CPO 21984 including mileage adjustment
Like I said, I got mine 14 CPO 52K with luxury/nav packages (worth about $5K MSRP but probably worth half now) that's been sitting around for 3 months on the lot and going for auction in 10 days for $21.5K. Assuming your 14 model doesn't include any packages, I would shoot for $18-19K.
Hope this helps.
12-10-17 | 09:21 AM
#6
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Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 208
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From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
I'm a newbie with respect to CPO, but other than the 131 point inspection (which they may or may not have done, one doesn't really know!) what good is it? Case in point: I just purchased a CPO 2014 IS 250 awd, with < 28k kms on the clock - they advertised it has having a 2 year 40k kms powertrain warranty because it was CPO. But the reality is that this car already has a factory powertrain warranty for 6 years and 110k kms.....so what good is the CPO warranty other than to "suck me in"? The bottom line is that when I drive it out of the dealership in 3 sleeps, I have no coverage for anything but the powertrain....e.g., if my nav craps out (or my heated seats, or whatever else that is not considered powertrain) after the first turn, I'm paying to fix it! Just about any car dealer provides AT LEAST a 90 day comprehensive warranty for any used car - CPO is not providing this for me......so, why would you have to consider CPO as part of your purchase decision? I must be missing something.
Last edited by RA051724; 12-10-17 at 09:25 AM.
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12-10-17 | 11:13 AM
#10
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 5,700
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From: NJ
+1, my CPO is bumper to bumper with a few exceptions per the below:
Originally Posted by http://www.lexus.com/lcertified/certification-warranty#warranty
UNDER WARRANTY
The L/Certified Limited Warranty* includes coverage for a complimentary loaner car,* Roadside Assistance* and Trip Interruption Service. Warranty is valid for a minimum of two years/unlimited mileage after the expiration of 4-year/50,000 mile new-vehicle Basic Warranty, or two years from your L/Certified purchase or lease date, whichever occurs later. Mileage is unlimited. There is no deductible: Repairs made under this warranty will be made at no cost to you. Except for excluded components (see below), this warranty covers any repair or replacement of components that fail under normal use due to a defect in materials or workmanship, such as: engine, transmission, steering, brakes (excluding rotors and pads), fuel system, cooling, A/C and heating systems, electrical, and restraint systems.
EXCLUDED COMPONENTS
The following component groups are excluded from coverage under the L/Certified Limited Warranty: standard upkeep items, wear and tear items, some parts of body and interior, accessories, and some other components. Please see the L/Certified Limited Warranty Supplement and Roadside Assistance Guide or your Lexus dealer for details.
The L/Certified Limited Warranty* includes coverage for a complimentary loaner car,* Roadside Assistance* and Trip Interruption Service. Warranty is valid for a minimum of two years/unlimited mileage after the expiration of 4-year/50,000 mile new-vehicle Basic Warranty, or two years from your L/Certified purchase or lease date, whichever occurs later. Mileage is unlimited. There is no deductible: Repairs made under this warranty will be made at no cost to you. Except for excluded components (see below), this warranty covers any repair or replacement of components that fail under normal use due to a defect in materials or workmanship, such as: engine, transmission, steering, brakes (excluding rotors and pads), fuel system, cooling, A/C and heating systems, electrical, and restraint systems.
EXCLUDED COMPONENTS
The following component groups are excluded from coverage under the L/Certified Limited Warranty: standard upkeep items, wear and tear items, some parts of body and interior, accessories, and some other components. Please see the L/Certified Limited Warranty Supplement and Roadside Assistance Guide or your Lexus dealer for details.
12-10-17 | 12:03 PM
#11
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,279
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From: Illinois
I believe that AWD4Mo is from Canada. Their CPO warranty coverage may not be the same as that for the US
These are the items that are not covered by the US CPO warranty.
These are the items that are not covered by the US CPO warranty.
"Accessory Drive Belts; Batteries; Body Panels; Brake Linings, Pads andShoes, Rotors and Drums; Bumpers; Carpet; Chrome; Clutch Friction Discand Pressure Plate; Dash Cover and Pad; Door Fabric; Door Trim; Filters;Fluids; Glass (including Windshields); Headliner; Heating Hoses, Linesand Tubes; Hoses; Hybrid Vehicle Battery Pack; Hybrid Vehicle BatteryPlug Assembly; Hybrid Vehicle Relay Assembly; Hybrid Vehicle SupplyBattery Assembly; Interior and Exterior Trim and Moldings (including butnot limited to: Ashtrays, Covers, Cup Holders, and Vents); Lamps, LightAssemblies/Housings, and Light Bulbs; Nuts, Bolts, Clips, Retainers, andFasteners; Paint; Rust and Corrosion Damage; Seat Covers; Sheet Metals;Shiny Metals; Spark Plugs; Structural Framework and Welds; Tires; VacuumHoses, Lines and Tubes; Weather Stripping; Wheels and Rims; WindshieldWiper Blades (Rubber component); All interior and exterior cloth, leather,and stitching including convertible tops and/or vinyl tops including but notlimited to: any vibration, deterioration, discoloration, disfigurement, warping,fading, staining, stretching, ripping, punctures, tearing, and/or scratches."
Note that, when buying a CPO vehicle, it is important to look carefully at the CPO inspection checklist and to pay particular attention to the condition of wear and tear items. A car can, for example, pass CPO inspection with as little as about 1/3 of its useful tire tread left and as little as 1/3 of its useful brake pad life left, which could mean spending $1500 or more to replace tires and brake pads within 1 year of buying the car.
Also note that the 161 point CPO inspection is not nearly as impressive as it, a first, seems like it would be. Most of the 161 items checked are things that you or I could check for ourselves in less than 30 minutes. The list mainly includes things like making sure the car starts, checking to see if the power windows work, checking to see if all the lights work, etc. The full list of items checked can be found here.
https://www.lexus.com/documents/broc...t-brochure.pdf
It might also make sense, before buying a CPO vehicle, to have it checked out by a qualified independent mechanic. Periodically, there are threads on the Club Lexus boards started by people who bought what they thought was going to be an "almost new" CPO vehicle and who later found that there were serious problems with the car, and that includes some who bought CPO vehicles and who subsequently found that the car had previously had major collision damage.
Note that, when buying a CPO vehicle, it is important to look carefully at the CPO inspection checklist and to pay particular attention to the condition of wear and tear items. A car can, for example, pass CPO inspection with as little as about 1/3 of its useful tire tread left and as little as 1/3 of its useful brake pad life left, which could mean spending $1500 or more to replace tires and brake pads within 1 year of buying the car.
Also note that the 161 point CPO inspection is not nearly as impressive as it, a first, seems like it would be. Most of the 161 items checked are things that you or I could check for ourselves in less than 30 minutes. The list mainly includes things like making sure the car starts, checking to see if the power windows work, checking to see if all the lights work, etc. The full list of items checked can be found here.
https://www.lexus.com/documents/broc...t-brochure.pdf
It might also make sense, before buying a CPO vehicle, to have it checked out by a qualified independent mechanic. Periodically, there are threads on the Club Lexus boards started by people who bought what they thought was going to be an "almost new" CPO vehicle and who later found that there were serious problems with the car, and that includes some who bought CPO vehicles and who subsequently found that the car had previously had major collision damage.
12-10-17 | 12:42 PM
#12
Driver
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 107
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From: CA
A cpo is a great choice and the vast majority turn out to be fine if you do your homework right. The tires and brake wear are not very critical items in decision making as long as vehicle is fine under the hood. I was able to negotiate all new 4 tires as part of the deal. I suggest to focus on vehicle history, get checked by independent mechanic or do the check yourself, and then negotiate for a fair price. As part of that deal, include any items that you want dealer through in like tires and brakes. On a 2 to 3 year old CPO, you will save a bundle compared to a new car.
12-10-17 | 01:06 PM
#14
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Posts: 208
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From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Yes, I live in Canada. And yes, the CPO is very likely different here - it seems that we rate as second class citizens!! This happens with colours too - we get a lot fewer colours. But then again our total population is smaller than some US States!!
12-10-17 | 07:45 PM
#15
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Posts: 15
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From: Michigan
That's a bit pricey even next to Edmunds CPO valuations. I wonder if it has luxury/nav/premium packages. On the webpage for the car I got, the packages were listed under Featured Equipment. You might have to ask the dealer. I don't think you can find this info with a VIN search.
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