mikemu30

I tried my best 🙃

Huythai

not necessarily… If you look at the “new” Camry, it’s side profile is identical to that of its predecessor. Same doors, windows, greenhouse etc. which indicates that it is still the same Camry underneath albeit heavily refreshed. Based on what I’m seeing with the photo of the future Lexus lineup and comparing it to the current 7th gen, it would seem that the ES will receive similar treatments.

if you look at the side profile, you can see they both share similar window shapes, roofline, and the strong body crease starting at the base of the mirror and extending towards the rear of the car above the door handles.

my point here, is that considering this information optimistically, we can assume the “new” ES may arrive sooner considering the fact that it is still the same 7th gen ES albeit heavily refreshed. We already know based on my prior comment about the Direct4 E-Axle testing on the 7th gen ES that the 500h powertrain CAN fit currently with the Lexus ES format of the TNGA-K. Which makes it safe to assume the frame work of development was already done. Knowing Lexus considering this batch of new models like the NX, RX, TX, and soon GX, the ES will definitely receive all of the new tech found on those models like the 14” screen, digital gauge, electric latch doors etc etc. these parts bin items will inevitably accelerate the development of the upcoming ES, because essentially every ES up until this point has been parts bin.

in conclusion, it is both a yes and no. It is a different 7th gen ES, but not an entirely new from the ground up 8th gen ES. This is a little concerning however for ICE sedan enthusiasts like myself, as this shows that either Toyota is ramping down development of sedans across both Toyota and Lexus lineups through heavy refreshes instead of outright new models for the eventually of cutting them off entirely, OR they are ramping down development of ICE chassis like the TNGA-K platform for the eventually of replacing them with a brand new electric architecture. The future seems bleak for Toyota’s sedans when the flagship of the Toyota car lineup is a lifted Honda Crosstour/ the Toyota Crown.

Shaboom

Makes much sense that Lexus will not toss aside either the current model traditional sedan option or the loyal buyers, thereof. They’ll rather wring out one final Gen of ES 350 at lower cost by simply heavily refreshing the current model with a transitional model they’ll call Gen 8. Maybe even the V-6 will remain available. They still sell nicely.Then maybe 3-5 years later, when all the benefit is exhausted, they’ll pull the plug on this Gen 8 and the ES model as we know it and unveil a genuinely new generation of all hybrid and electric or whatever it is that the public will be preferring at that time. We live in transitional times. Car trends can be whimsical and buying public can be fickle. Who knows what the public will want five years from now.
So if that’s Lexus’ plan, I’ll buy a Gen 8 if the V--6 is included or keep my 2021 forever if it’s not.
For Lexus, I think it’s really smart. Keeps all their options open until this seemingly transformational car market settles down and the long term automotive future is more apparent.

ESh

I can guarantee you that V6 will not be present anymore. Also, I am not sure about 2.4T.
Hybrid only with around 250 hp.

pab12

>May just buy the last 7 Gen ES made and “drive it into the sunset…”
Yup, just did, new 2024 Luxury, ICE all the way

My opinion is that the Gen 8 will be a restyled Crown, just as the ES was always a restyled Avalon.
The platform is tanned, rested, and ready.
They won't design a completely new car.
===================================
Angle parked in a parallel universe

Shaboom

“The platform is tanned, rested, and ready.”
And it’ll be a winner, too, just like RMN!

Shaboom

Less change the better. Anxious to see the new one. Hope is just a heavy refresh but fewer substantive changes the better.

alextv

One thing that needs to come back on the massive 12.3 and 14 inch screens is split screen option and don't do it like the new RX with lack of manual buttons and multiple menu settings to get what you want.

LexFinally

Thread hijack, but it's maddening to me that VW still refuses to bother completing an othewise excellent engine by mounting a metal thermostat/water pump housing that won't spring leaks on cue every 35,000 miles. But it's evident they just don't care, which is why I'm attracted to Audis but driving a Lexus.

LexFinally

Shaboom, I think the trend away from V6's and V8's runs deeper than just fashion. The automakers are under ever-increasing pressure to meet a tightening web of smog and MPG regulations (and not to be a hypocrite, I believe human-induced climate change is real and dangerous, and I support them). It's why you're seeing not only electric cars, but a whole range of engineering changes that can wring out even a fraction of an MPG: low rolling resistance tires, cylinder deactivation, ultra-low viscosity motor oil, auto stop-start, tiny engines with big turbos, on and on. I love my big, durable, naturally aspirated V6 engine, and I bought it because I wanted a virgin example to pamper before they went away. You have one now. The very reason to buy a Lexus instead of the Germans is because you can keep it 20 years. Given that the next ES will be mostly similar to the last one except for the loss of the engine you like, why sell at all? Enjoy that the car you want is already in your hands and paid for.

LexFinally

I don't necessarily see it that way. TNGA may well be the last Toyota gas-engine big sedan architecture, but they kept its predecessor for 20 years. TNGA is a modern, adaptable architecture because it was designed to be, and it may be with us for a long time to come.

Huythai

[QUOTE=Shaboom;11683392]Makes much sense that Lexus will not toss aside either the current model traditional sedan option or the loyal buyers, thereof. They’ll rather wring out one final Gen of ES 350 at lower cost by simply heavily refreshing the current model with a transitional model they’ll call Gen 8. Maybe even the V-6 will remain available. They still sell nicely.Then maybe 3-5 years later, when all the benefit is exhausted, they’ll pull the plug on this Gen 8 and the ES model as we know it and unveil a genuinely new generation of all hybrid and electric or whatever it is that the public will be preferring at that time. We live in transitional times. Car trends can be whimsical and buying public can be fickle. Who knows what the public will want five years from now.
So if that’s Lexus’ plan, I’ll buy a Gen 8 if the V--6 is included or keep my 2021 forever if it’s not.
For Lexus, I think it’s really smart. Keeps all their options open until this seemingly transformational car market settles down and the long term automotive future is more apparent.[/QUOQUOTE

I sure hope that sedans will continue to exist with Lexus, because every single one of these IS, ES, and LS Lexus got so right. I am excited to see what the 8th gen will be like, considering I feel like they’ve left a lot on the bone for the 7th gen, which I’m surprised they didn’t fully hit the pedal to the metal with this platform when they axed the GS.

I assume the ES will move up market with this upcoming iteration so price will most definitely increase. What I’m also interested to see is what they’ll do to set the ES apart from the Crown, considering the Crown is filling the slot and price of what the ES is currently.

Huythai

I sure hope so, the whole premise of a global architecture is for it to be adaptable for future changes so I’m sure Toyota wanted to pursue the TNGA platform for the long term, I’m just not sure if they’ve planned entirely for the possible eventually of total electrification. They’ve mentioned when they tore down the Model Y that the TNGA platform isn’t up to par for electrification. Needless to say the industry has been changing very rapidly, so we shall see.

LexFinally

Oh, I agree that TNGA wasn't designed for full-on EV's. I was saying specifically that I think it still lhas a future for gas/electric hybrids.

LexFinally

[QUOTE=Huythai;11683736]I don't think the ES was central to Toyota's positioning of the Crown. Rather, I think the Crown's mission was to recapture the empty-nester Camry trade-up customers the Avalon was no longer captivating. It does encroach on ES price territory, but then again, as I understand (and as I predicted), it's not selling any better than the last Avalon did. I do think the Crown Signia crossover will easily outsell the frumpy, ill-fated Crown hunchback sedan, but every popular SUV already does.