2022 ES 350 ride question................
05-08-23, 01:15 PM
#31
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Check your early morning cold tire pressures? It could be too low, resulting in bottoming out?
Meanwhile, I'm not sure if cold temperatures cause coil and torsion springs to become stiffer?
Any engineers here?
Cold temperatures may cause the oil inside the shock absorbers to become more viscous for too much damping control - which results in a higher frequency of vertical oscillations - perceived as a tiring ride.
Normally, as temperatures rise, oils become thinner - resulting in floatier shock absorbers.
Also remember that the oil inside shock absorbers can contain some silicone which cleverly becomes more viscous as temperatures rise - and this is how Ferguson viscous couplings work.
If Koji Sato continues former President Akio's use of sports suspension across the range, with no luxury suspension option, then I have no choice but to go back to purchasing Mercedes-Benz - and put up with their much higher servicing and repair costs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with sports springs, sports roll bars and sports shock absorbers - just simultaneously make available a luxury set of springs, roll bars and shock absorbers - for a twin choice between luxury/sports...
Meanwhile, I'm not sure if cold temperatures cause coil and torsion springs to become stiffer?
Any engineers here?
Cold temperatures may cause the oil inside the shock absorbers to become more viscous for too much damping control - which results in a higher frequency of vertical oscillations - perceived as a tiring ride.
Normally, as temperatures rise, oils become thinner - resulting in floatier shock absorbers.
Also remember that the oil inside shock absorbers can contain some silicone which cleverly becomes more viscous as temperatures rise - and this is how Ferguson viscous couplings work.
If Koji Sato continues former President Akio's use of sports suspension across the range, with no luxury suspension option, then I have no choice but to go back to purchasing Mercedes-Benz - and put up with their much higher servicing and repair costs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with sports springs, sports roll bars and sports shock absorbers - just simultaneously make available a luxury set of springs, roll bars and shock absorbers - for a twin choice between luxury/sports...
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05-09-23, 08:05 AM
#32
Check your early morning cold tire pressures? It could be too low, resulting in bottoming out?
Meanwhile, I'm not sure if cold temperatures cause coil and torsion springs to become stiffer?
Any engineers here?
Cold temperatures may cause the oil inside the shock absorbers to become more viscous for too much damping control - which results in a higher frequency of vertical oscillations - perceived as a tiring ride.
Normally, as temperatures rise, oils become thinner - resulting in floatier shock absorbers.
Also remember that the oil inside shock absorbers can contain some silicone which cleverly becomes more viscous as temperatures rise - and this is how Ferguson viscous couplings work.
If Koji Sato continues former President Akio's use of sports suspension across the range, with no luxury suspension option, then I have no choice but to go back to purchasing Mercedes-Benz - and put up with their much higher servicing and repair costs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with sports springs, sports roll bars and sports shock absorbers - just simultaneously make available a luxury set of springs, roll bars and shock absorbers - for a twin choice between luxury/sports...
Meanwhile, I'm not sure if cold temperatures cause coil and torsion springs to become stiffer?
Any engineers here?
Cold temperatures may cause the oil inside the shock absorbers to become more viscous for too much damping control - which results in a higher frequency of vertical oscillations - perceived as a tiring ride.
Normally, as temperatures rise, oils become thinner - resulting in floatier shock absorbers.
Also remember that the oil inside shock absorbers can contain some silicone which cleverly becomes more viscous as temperatures rise - and this is how Ferguson viscous couplings work.
If Koji Sato continues former President Akio's use of sports suspension across the range, with no luxury suspension option, then I have no choice but to go back to purchasing Mercedes-Benz - and put up with their much higher servicing and repair costs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with sports springs, sports roll bars and sports shock absorbers - just simultaneously make available a luxury set of springs, roll bars and shock absorbers - for a twin choice between luxury/sports...
I totally agree, but you will have to convince the dealers and the public that they don't "need" the usually pseudo-sports packages in order to be safe or not be "boring". While it's true that, for example, a C or E class can ride quite comfortable on its standard set up, good luck finding one at a dealership, where almost every one comes with the added on AMG sports "upgrade" that includes stiffer spring rates. The E offers air suspension but at almost $2K more. That was what prompted me to ditch my MB E350 last year and return to the ES. While otherwise a luxury model it had the added on AMG "light', if you will, option that included larger tires and firmed suspension. It was comfortable on glass smooth pavement but anything worse, which is most streets, could be jarringly harsh and uncomfortable.
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FreddyG (05-10-23)
05-09-23, 09:05 AM
#33
I totally agree, but you will have to convince the dealers and the public that they don't "need" the usually pseudo-sports packages in order to be safe or not be "boring". While it's true that, for example, a C or E class can ride quite comfortable on its standard set up, good luck finding one at a dealership, where almost every one comes with the added on AMG sports "upgrade" that includes stiffer spring rates. The E offers air suspension but at almost $2K more. That was what prompted me to ditch my MB E350 last year and return to the ES. While otherwise a luxury model it had the added on AMG "light', if you will, option that included larger tires and firmed suspension. It was comfortable on glass smooth pavement but anything worse, which is most streets, could be jarringly harsh and uncomfortable.
ug\
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05-09-23, 12:16 PM
#34
I totally agree, but you will have to convince the dealers and the public that they don't "need" the usually pseudo-sports packages in order to be safe or not be "boring". While it's true that, for example, a C or E class can ride quite comfortable on its standard set up, good luck finding one at a dealership, where almost every one comes with the added on AMG sports "upgrade" that includes stiffer spring rates. The E offers air suspension but at almost $2K more. That was what prompted me to ditch my MB E350 last year and return to the ES. While otherwise a luxury model it had the added on AMG "light', if you will, option that included larger tires and firmed suspension. It was comfortable on glass smooth pavement but anything worse, which is most streets, could be jarringly harsh and uncomfortable.
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However, the local BMW dealership mainly stocks M Sport only, and they had to do a special order to obtain a 330i Non-M Sport for me to test drive.
05-10-23, 08:33 AM
#35
Intermediate
Thread Starter
I totally agree, but you will have to convince the dealers and the public that they don't "need" the usually pseudo-sports packages in order to be safe or not be "boring". While it's true that, for example, a C or E class can ride quite comfortable on its standard set up, good luck finding one at a dealership, where almost every one comes with the added on AMG sports "upgrade" that includes stiffer spring rates. The E offers air suspension but at almost $2K more. That was what prompted me to ditch my MB E350 last year and return to the ES. While otherwise a luxury model it had the added on AMG "light', if you will, option that included larger tires and firmed suspension. It was comfortable on glass smooth pavement but anything worse, which is most streets, could be jarringly harsh and uncomfortable.
ug\
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I agree with your first statement about the cars on the lots and their "Sports Packages" but if I were to look at a BMW, I'd look for one that had the M Sport package because if I'm buying "The Ultimate Driving Machine", then I'm getting the sportier M Sport version (not full blown M one because that's a bit too Sporty for me) besides, I like the looks of the M Sport the best. With the Benz, I'd get the AMG package that makes the car look sportier without being full blown AMG. If I'm looking for sporty, I'd expect the ride to be harsher but We bought an Ultra Luxury thinking the ride was more luxurious and are disappointed.
Just my thoughts.
05-10-23, 01:31 PM
#36
I'm sorry you're disappointed, and I understand it. I personally think that at these not-low prices, and given that you're not also unreasonably expecting sporty handling to go with it, the level of ride comfort you want is a reasonable expectation. If I were you, I'd check out the G80 (although Edmunds criticizes the ride quality of that car's optional adaptive suspension, so go for the base suspension without the option of the larger wheels).
Last edited by LexFinally; 05-10-23 at 01:57 PM.
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FreddyG (05-11-23)
05-10-23, 02:46 PM
#37
I'm sorry you're disappointed, and I understand it. I personally think that at these not-low prices, and given that you're not also unreasonably expecting sporty handling to go with it, the level of ride comfort you want is a reasonable expectation. If I were you, I'd check out the G80 (although Edmunds criticizes the ride quality of that car's optional adaptive suspension, so go for the base suspension without the option of the larger wheels).
It had a stylish front and side profile, was spacious, even oversized, powerful, very smooth and quiet and well equipped.
However, it had a bland tail and bland interior, and it was not as well built with a faulty plastic molded rear right window sunshade making its way into the showroom, and as a result of being oversized and overweight - it had compromized performance, braking, fuel economy, and handling.
Nowadays in 2023, much the same story with the new G80.
The styling is questionable, and another oversized and overweight vehicle compromizing performance, economy, and handling.
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LexFinally (05-11-23)
05-22-23, 12:45 PM
#39
05-23-23, 08:42 AM
#40
Not surprising at all. Even auto reviewers have commented on the rather flinty ride of the more stiffly sprung F-Sport. The noise reducing wheels and acoustic glass help as well.
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LexFinally (05-23-23)
05-23-23, 11:59 AM
#42
Everything is relative
I just bought a 2023 ES UL. I think the ride is softer than my 2016 ES was. However the nicest comfy ride was my 2006 ES.
for sure compared to the 2009 Lexus LS460 , you will find the ES 2022 a stiffer ride
go take a test drive in a tesla model 3. Then you will find comparatively the ES is a soft cush ride!
I just bought a 2023 ES UL. I think the ride is softer than my 2016 ES was. However the nicest comfy ride was my 2006 ES.
for sure compared to the 2009 Lexus LS460 , you will find the ES 2022 a stiffer ride
go take a test drive in a tesla model 3. Then you will find comparatively the ES is a soft cush ride!
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FreddyG (05-24-23)
05-23-23, 01:08 PM
#43
Perhaps fun1170 is only noticing the improvement in both ride and quietness from using 18" rims with touring-type tires?
05-23-23, 04:45 PM
#44
So it sounds like one poster claims that Non-F Sport is softer than F Sport, but many posters says that F Sport and Non-F Sport share the same suspension - except for the Handling Package's AVS electronic shock absorbers, and the 19" rims with sports tires.
Perhaps fun1170 is only noticing the improvement in both ride and quietness from using 18" rims with touring-type tires?
Perhaps fun1170 is only noticing the improvement in both ride and quietness from using 18" rims with touring-type tires?
05-23-23, 05:41 PM
#45
The F Sport is available with two different suspensions: the stock suspension, and the "handling" setup with the AVS adjustable shocks. Multiple reviewers have concluded that the adjustable shocks are significantly stiffer than stock even when on their softest setting, and the shorter sidewalls of the 19" wheels stiffen the ride further.