jayplexus

I bought a 2021 ES300H back in July 2023 that was CPO and according to Carfax had no damage. Today I took the car to the dealer where I purchased it from to get the 20k maintenance done and the service manager could not find in the system that I am getting the free maintenance that comes with a CPO. So the service manager had me talk to a finance person so that they can verify that the car was sold to me as a CPO. Luckily, the finance guy was able to see on the paperwork that the car was sold to me as a CPO but for some reason it is not showing up in the service department database. I was told that I will have to leave the car the whole day so that they can recertify the car. Later in the day, the manager called me to let me know that the car was not passing the inspection to get certified because of an accident the car was in. I told him that I was never aware of the car being in an accident, but he told me that even if the car does not get certified he would still give me the two years free maintenance and extended warranty since I had bought the car from them. After I spoke with the manager, I went to the lexus website and added the es300h to my vehicles and there I see that the car was CERTIFIED PREOWNED PDI and also see that a few weeks before I bought the car the dealer added the damage: UPON INSPECTION FOUND FRONT BUMPER AND RIGHT SIDE FENDER, RIGHT SIDE FRONT DOOR AND REAR DOOR AND BUMPER REPAINTED BUT NO SIGN OF FRAME. What should I do now? I am really upset.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

This is an older post. It's possible that CPO standards have changed but minor accidents don't preclude a car from being CPO. https://www.clublexus.com/forums/mai...pre-owned.html I'd be upset too if I suddenly found out the car had been damaged. This damage does affect the resale value of the car to a degree. I suggest that you take a few days and then speak with the general manager of the dealership. Explain you concerns (not your feelings) and see what he proposes can be done to compensate you. That usually takes the form of extended free services for a few more years. I wouldn't expect a refund of several thousand dollars (what they should do) but you never know. Hang in there and let us know how it goes.

dezymond

Seems like fraud to me. Look over any documents you signed and make sure you don't see the prior accident listed in there. If it were me, I'd be speaking with the GM. 2 years of free maintenance and extended warranty doesn't fix the fact they withheld information from you.

grp52

In addition to dezymond's posting, for a Lexus CPO vehicle there's supposed to be a Lexus Certified Pre-Owned 161-POINT INSPECTION CHECKLIST filled out and it has a customer signature block which implies the customer should be given the form to review and acknowledge awareness of any pre-existing conditions that may be excluded from warranty coverage under the terms of the L/Certified Limited Warranty. The checklist does have a section where any collision damage and location is to be documented.

Also, if your profile is correct that you're a resident of California, there's a California Car Buyer’s Bill Of Rights which includes in part (see the "Prohibited “Certified” Used Vehicles" section about half way down the web page):

I don't know what recourse you may have available if the dealer failed to provide you with a complete inspection report but as a minimum the dealer hasn't complied with California law.

Deemack617

Personally I think you should get a lawyer and give the car back and get a proper CPO. They misleaded you and provided false information on the car wich they knew was in an accident. The value of the car will drop because NOW they have to report an accident. The minimum should be refunding you monies or ask them for lifetime free maintenance/service because you don't know what will happen in the future to the damage product they sold you. Do not let this slide!

lgb0250

Just because a vehicle has been damaged doesn’t necessarily mean it was of such magnitude that it needed to be disclosed. If it was a trade in or even run through the auction, in my home state it would not have been disclosed unless the damage was more than 25% of the value of the vehicle at time of damage. But, most used vehicle managers can tell just by checking the moldings for paint. Almost impossible to tape one off good enough to hide everything from trained eyes. Most of them carry a paint thickness gauge while appraising or bidding on the vehicle.

Deemack617

The problem is its a CPO and should have been inspected and I don't not believe cars that have been in accidents can be CPO

swfla

iTrader: (1)

The inspection form for CPO has a place for body damage. It's a common belief that CPO cars are perfect top to bottom. Not true. It's possible that CA does provide more protection to the consumer. Would you provide the city where purchased if not the dealer name. Hiring a lawyer often costs way more than any damages you may win. See what the general manager says first. They get threatened with lawsuits all too often. They know it's tough talk with no teeth and it doesn't phase them. Dealers have legal on retainer. I bought CPO two different times. One had a bad new battery and worn control arms(Orlando), the other had filthy engine air filter ( San Diego area). Both check list items. This and the reliability of Lexus has convinced me to not spend the extra $2k a CPO costs if I can find my liking in non CPO.

ATL350

Good luck with all of this. The Lexus CPO site does clearly indicate that one point (#7 under Exterior Appearance) is. "Body damage/dents,paint chips/scratches". However, no where in any of the info on line (https://www.lexus.com/lcertified/cer...#certification) does it say that everything is perfect like a new car, and while they ARE supposed to note paint or repainting, that does not appear to disqualify the car from sale as certified if the inspecting dealer is willing to say so. Though the finance guy said "the car was not passing the inspection to get certified because of an accident the car was in", I wonder if he was just saying that to smooth the situation. From what I see on line that is not precluded if the damage was not significant and was properly repaired according to Lexus standards. BUT they most certainly should be acknowledging it on the paperwork. The bottom line seems to be, with probably most CPO programs, is this used car mechanically sound and in good enough for then to warranty it for an extended period? It can pass inspection and still have cosmetic flaws that do not interfere with its function or safety.

I agree that hiring a lawyer for this, if a reputable one would even take it (i.e, not enough potential money for them), would probably be a waste of your money. Basically your "damages" would likely be the difference between what the car was sold for and reduced value, if any, had the repair been disclosed. I don't know how much you might additionally be entitled to under California law for the dealership not providing you with a copy of the inspection paperwork, but it probably isn't very much, or might result in a fine for the dealership (which would go to the state); again, the dollar amount wouldn't be a whole lot relative to the value involved and then the lawyers gets their money and/or cut.

If anything, when all is said and done you could report it to Lexus corporate to at least let them know that the CPO delivery did not meet their advertised standards, something they could take up with the dealer, but you would probably just get a "sorry for the inconvenience" sort of response, especially if the dealer is trying to give you the same warranty coverage had it all been done correctly to begin with.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

This í what I would call a reality based response.

E46CT

Not a big deal. Just try to get some freebies from the dealer out of it, equal to what you think the change in value is due to the repair. As long as the repairs are done right, you're good to go. It's just a car.

BBQapple

Agree with ATL350

They inspected the car for themselves, not for you. They didn’t market it to you as completely undamaged or free of accidents. They promised to give you the CPO warranty and service benefits. Nowhere does Lexus say a car will fail to be certified if any body or paint damage is found during their CPO inspection.

Also there’s no reason to assume this discovery will be included in future car fax reports. But even if it does happen (which would suck), the CPO program does not address carfax reports now or in the future.

Deemack617

I just bought a CPO a month ago and they included a car fax and I believe (not 100%) there's a section that comments on paint and imperfections in there 161 point inspections. I dont know but if they don't disclose isn't that fraud

wasjr

Someone may have already suggested this, but print the info from the website that documents the car was sold to you as a CPO and the accident was known. Will be helpful in your discussions with the dealer.

bnb2310

This is why I am still trying to get documentation that my recent 2021 ES350 purchase is indeed CPO. Car Fax says it was being sold CPO. Saleman says it was. After contacting Lexus, who must have contacted Pembroke, salesman finally texted me a copy of the 161 point inspection, telling me that his manager says that Lexus will be sending me CPO information. Its been 3 weeks, and nothing. Did ANY of you get anything in writing? There is not one mention of my paperwork saying CPO. Very frustrating. Advice to contact the dealer is worthless in this case. I am clear on the other side of Florida and will not rest until I get it in writing.