All-new 2019 Lexus ES to debut at Beijing Motorshow
#616
Racer
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Why would you get an LS if the ES looks that good for half the price?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=28&v=LOEcuObuUmY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=28&v=LOEcuObuUmY
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This is "Car Chat"
Last edited by signdetres; 04-26-18 at 11:57 AM.
#617
Lexus Fanatic
#619
Lexus Fanatic
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Just my thoughts on this, but often times things that made for one market are not the same for other markets, comprises are sometimes made.
#620
drives cars
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I kinda-sorta disagree. I think the IS has room to grow, as it is nowhere near large in its class, and it would need to fill the sport-sedan gap left by the GS. The IS is a strange car in terms of pricing and features compared to its competition. The 3-series and C-class have very broad price ranges with lots of features available at the upper end of the spectrum, whereas the IS seems to be deliberately capped out in the low-$50k range by having the F Sport and Luxury versions separated. However, if the IS was made to be a little more premium, it could easily have both the F Sport and luxury features and have a higher "fully-loaded" price - if it was a hair larger it could prove to be palatable for what would have been GS prospective customers. Just a theory. However I think the most likely is that Lexus will stay consistent with the segment and introduce only an incremental size increase.
#621
Lexus Champion
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Leased a new GS (from Lexus, not Craigslist) and was hoping the next version would be my next ride.
#622
Lexus Test Driver
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Funny thing is that the IS starts lower than the ES but a fully optioned up IS at the highest trim levels exceeds that of the ES (not to mention the prior ISF prices). I'm hoping the trend holds true and the nex gen IS will have moved up a class to compete better with the 340 and S4. That will make it mid $60k fully loaded which will easily exceed the ES. Of course the bread and butter 2L turbo will be priced in the low $40k for the masses.
Most definitely. The IS300 will likely keep the same AR Turbo with the same HP/TQ specs for the masses.
1) This is "car chat". We are here to talk about cars - IE: the Lexus ES.
2) I didn't know there was a requirement that I have to buy the car to talk about it?
I get it, you like the Lexus ES, I like it too because I think its a good car. I only stated my opinion I'll never buy one because its still a Camry/Avalon re-skin with FWD costing close to 55K loaded. For 55 grand - I'll shop for another Lexus model or another brand.
Why buy a real Louis Vuitton bag when the fake looks almost as good as the real thing?
When you begin to enter vehicle segments like the LS, price/value begins to become irrelevant and other factors like image and perception of quality come into play. It's statement/status symbol. The LS might be on the lower-end of the vehicles in its segment as far as status goes, it's still on the same list.
This is "Car Chat"
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.clublexus.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
This is "Car Chat"
Yup - it is "Car Chat".
I kinda-sorta disagree. I think the IS has room to grow, as it is nowhere near large in its class, and it would need to fill the sport-sedan gap left by the GS. The IS is a strange car in terms of pricing and features compared to its competition. The 3-series and C-class have very broad price ranges with lots of features available at the upper end of the spectrum, whereas the IS seems to be deliberately capped out in the low-$50k range by having the F Sport and Luxury versions separated. However, if the IS was made to be a little more premium, it could easily have both the F Sport and luxury features and have a higher "fully-loaded" price - if it was a hair larger it could prove to be palatable for what would have been GS prospective customers. Just a theory. However I think the most likely is that Lexus will stay consistent with the segment and introduce only an incremental size increase.
I see where you are getting at with the Luxury features and F-Sport features melted together in one bigger package as an option. The Lexus LS is divided up like that also. I wish the Lexus LS500 F-Sport could get the executive package with Kirko Glass. I wish they were merge the packages together also but I think Lexus is going for like two different versions of the same car - like offering something to everyone.
#624
Lexus Fanatic
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What do you mean by risks? What is an example of a model that is "risky". I certainly don't think the ES would the best model for Lexus to go way off the script considering how successful it has been.
#625
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Ok. Back on topic, regarding something about the 2019 7ES that no one is really talking about...
2018 ES350: 268 horsepower and 248 pound-feet of torque
2019 ES350: 302 horsepower and 267 pound-feet of torque (increases of 34 hp and 19 lb-ft)
2018 GS350: 311 horsepower and 280 pound-feet of torque
Btw 2019 ES350 and 2018 GS350: Only 9 hp difference, and 13 lb-ft (97.1% of GS350 hp capability, yet lighter)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/compar...-350_d917_d920
note: 2018 GS350 curb weight: 3,726 to 3,891 lbs
2018 ES350 curb weight: 3,571
2019 ES350 curb weight: 3,649
The 2019 ES350 car has also grown in most dimensions.
It’s 2.6 inches longer and 1.8 inches wider than its predecessor, with a 2.0-inch longer wheelbase.
The 2019 Lexus ES 350 is now a 300+hp car and still lighter in weight than the GS350. In short, it adds up to a potentially better driving experience and be more fun to drive than the 2018 generation and earlier ES350. It may not be a GS, but horsepower performance-wise -- it has creeped up to 97% of a GS, and horsepower out performs a 2018 BMW 530I(248hp) by 54hp. (note: BMW 540i clocks in at 335hp).
2018 ES350: 268 horsepower and 248 pound-feet of torque
2019 ES350: 302 horsepower and 267 pound-feet of torque (increases of 34 hp and 19 lb-ft)
2018 GS350: 311 horsepower and 280 pound-feet of torque
Btw 2019 ES350 and 2018 GS350: Only 9 hp difference, and 13 lb-ft (97.1% of GS350 hp capability, yet lighter)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/compar...-350_d917_d920
note: 2018 GS350 curb weight: 3,726 to 3,891 lbs
2018 ES350 curb weight: 3,571
2019 ES350 curb weight: 3,649
The 2019 ES350 car has also grown in most dimensions.
It’s 2.6 inches longer and 1.8 inches wider than its predecessor, with a 2.0-inch longer wheelbase.
The 2019 Lexus ES 350 is now a 300+hp car and still lighter in weight than the GS350. In short, it adds up to a potentially better driving experience and be more fun to drive than the 2018 generation and earlier ES350. It may not be a GS, but horsepower performance-wise -- it has creeped up to 97% of a GS, and horsepower out performs a 2018 BMW 530I(248hp) by 54hp. (note: BMW 540i clocks in at 335hp).
#626
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Risk probably isn't the best word for it, but I'm referring to models/variants that aren't expected to sell like the ES/RX. IS-F was a big risk for them, but then they failed to follow up with one for the current gen. From an engine standpoint, they've been using variants of the 3.5L since 2005? Sure incremental updates have been made since the introduction, but very similar outputs since then. Awesome in 2005, kind of meh in 2018.
#627
Lexus Fanatic
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The 2019 Lexus ES 350 is now a 300+hp car and still lighter in weight than the GS350. In short, it adds up to a potentially better driving experience and be more fun to drive than the 2018 generation and earlier ES350. It may not be a GS, but horsepower performance-wise -- it has creeped up to 97% of a GS, and horsepower out performs a 2018 BMW 530I(248hp) by 54hp. (note: BMW 540i clocks in at 335hp).
#628
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I don't think they have put that much money into this new 7ES.
I suspect the money has been channelled into "electrification" - which is the way to the future...
I suspect the money has been channelled into "electrification" - which is the way to the future...
#629
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Here is a nicely done 360 spin video of the F sport exterior. Just like the Camry XSE, the new platform has done wonders to the proportions of the car, looks really good IMO.
#630
Lexus Test Driver
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Ok. Back on topic, regarding something about the 2019 7ES that no one is really talking about...
2018 ES350: 268 horsepower and 248 pound-feet of torque
2019 ES350: 302 horsepower and 267 pound-feet of torque (increases of 34 hp and 19 lb-ft)
2018 GS350: 311 horsepower and 280 pound-feet of torque
Btw 2019 ES350 and 2018 GS350: Only 9 hp difference, and 13 lb-ft (97.1% of GS350 hp capability, yet lighter)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/compar...-350_d917_d920
note: 2018 GS350 curb weight: 3,726 to 3,891 lbs
2018 ES350 curb weight: 3,571
2019 ES350 curb weight: 3,649
The 2019 ES350 car has also grown in most dimensions.
It’s 2.6 inches longer and 1.8 inches wider than its predecessor, with a 2.0-inch longer wheelbase.
The 2019 Lexus ES 350 is now a 300+hp car and still lighter in weight than the GS350. In short, it adds up to a potentially better driving experience and be more fun to drive than the 2018 generation and earlier ES350. It may not be a GS, but horsepower performance-wise -- it has creeped up to 97% of a GS, and horsepower out performs a 2018 BMW 530I(248hp) by 54hp. (note: BMW 540i clocks in at 335hp).
2018 ES350: 268 horsepower and 248 pound-feet of torque
2019 ES350: 302 horsepower and 267 pound-feet of torque (increases of 34 hp and 19 lb-ft)
2018 GS350: 311 horsepower and 280 pound-feet of torque
Btw 2019 ES350 and 2018 GS350: Only 9 hp difference, and 13 lb-ft (97.1% of GS350 hp capability, yet lighter)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/compar...-350_d917_d920
note: 2018 GS350 curb weight: 3,726 to 3,891 lbs
2018 ES350 curb weight: 3,571
2019 ES350 curb weight: 3,649
The 2019 ES350 car has also grown in most dimensions.
It’s 2.6 inches longer and 1.8 inches wider than its predecessor, with a 2.0-inch longer wheelbase.
The 2019 Lexus ES 350 is now a 300+hp car and still lighter in weight than the GS350. In short, it adds up to a potentially better driving experience and be more fun to drive than the 2018 generation and earlier ES350. It may not be a GS, but horsepower performance-wise -- it has creeped up to 97% of a GS, and horsepower out performs a 2018 BMW 530I(248hp) by 54hp. (note: BMW 540i clocks in at 335hp).
It also has much worse sound deading, flimsier doors and other panels.
Also im sure the Weight DISTRIBUTION is nowhere as balanced as the GS so that alone would ruin the handling!
I have seen zero information about ES having any use of aluminum in the suspension components, which is common for luxury German cars.
Last edited by RNM GS3; 04-26-18 at 03:11 PM.