All-new 2019 Lexus ES to debut at Beijing Motorshow
04-27-18, 04:11 PM
#721
Lexus Fanatic
It is important that the A/C compressor be run occasionally during the off-season...maybe five or ten minutes a week. That, of course, is to keep the belt-driven compressor's bearings, pulley, and other moving parts lubed so that they don't dry out and corrode. Even with compressors run by an electric motor, it is also important (though somewhat less-so) to run them during the off-season. You don't have to put up with an icy blast from the vents, though......all modern A/C units allow you to mix as much heat in with the airflow as you want. just by turning up the heat-****. Also, most modern defrost systems automatically turn on the compressor in the defrost mode, to provide a source of dry air...that's why the air sometimes comes out cold and chills the windshield down unless you add heat.
Here's a link to that subject, and you may also find it mentioned in the Owners' Manual of some vehicles.
https://www.autorepairshopsanjose.co...car-ac-winter/.
Here's a link to that subject, and you may also find it mentioned in the Owners' Manual of some vehicles.
https://www.autorepairshopsanjose.co...car-ac-winter/.
That is not what we are talking about. And not the issue.
04-27-18, 04:13 PM
#722
Personally I don't think so (at least for the moment). The 2.0L as you mentioned in the last sentence is a bit 'rough', which counters what the ES is about, which is smoothness which is why it retains the NA V6. The 2.0T gets harped on for being "slow".. but truth is the engine is fine, slight lag that's alleviated in 'Sport' mode. The main culprit is the weight of the cars. If the IS could shed 200lbs, it would be more punchy and efficient. The reason they don't offer the IS, RC, and GS 2.0T's with the AWD is because it currently can only accept RWD. The FWD based vehicles like NX was made to accept AWD. There are two versions of the 2.0T but the RWD versions offer 6 more hp. The reason Lexus made the switch to the '300' moniker is because it's main competitors C300 (used to be C250), and 330i (used to be 328i) made the switch.
I find that the 2.0 Turbo has a very smooth and quiet idle; the IS200t seems to use a lot of sound insulation, and has a marvellous engine subframe and hydraulic engine mounts.
Around town with small throttle openings and low rpm, the 2.0T has a tiring throb, and feels weak in power.
However, at wide open throttle openings and high rpm, the 2.0T spins beautifully [almost as good as the old 2005-07 3.0 V6], and it delivers plenty of punch, though not as much as a 3.5 V6.
The GS 3.5 V6 has a loud and thrummy idle; putting the gearbox into N will make the idle smoother, but still loud.
At small throttle openings, low rpm and around town, the 3.5 V6 purrs effortlessly; it is perilously smooth.
At wide open throttle and high rpm, the 3.5 delivers plenty of power, however it does not rev as smoothly as the 2.0T, and is well short of Lexus' old 3.0 V6 for smoothness and quietness.
Neither engines are perfect; both have their pros and cons.
However, because most of our driving is around town, and we rarely full throttle the vehicles anymore, the 3.5 V6 feels nicer, despite the loud and poor idle.
We spend more time pottering around town, than idling at the traffic lights...
04-27-18, 04:15 PM
#723
Lexus Fanatic
Yeah, just like you, I do not like to drive with the vents off. I like some air flowing.
I don't have any issue with it being on as needed. I believe having it "ON" only means it's available if the system deems it helpful. It won't actually be running the entire time. In my climate, it's very helpful in the winter, when it's so damp, for defogging the windows. It'll vary with climate and preferences, but like I said, I had it and never used it once.
I don't have any issue with it being on as needed. I believe having it "ON" only means it's available if the system deems it helpful. It won't actually be running the entire time. In my climate, it's very helpful in the winter, when it's so damp, for defogging the windows. It'll vary with climate and preferences, but like I said, I had it and never used it once.
I believe the compressor' s function is linked with the Outside temperature sensor and cabin temperature setting. So the car only enables the compressor if needed, otherwise its disabled. So i don't mind not having a dedicated A/C button, it has not given me a problem so far.
I prefer when there is a dedicated AC button like on the IS. But Lexus's reasoning to hiding it/ not adding a button is mostly because by leaving it 'On' it is a dehumidifier like JDR76 mentioned. It can reduce fogginess in the windshield, and less off and on reduces the change of mildew growing in the vent system. It's great on the hybrids because it doesn't have to use any gas and can run on electricity from the hybrid system. So even with AC 'ON' you can set your temperature to 85 degrees and it will be super hot or 65 degrees and it will be super cold. It's not much different than your thermostat at home. Just set the temperature to what you feel is comfortable.
04-27-18, 04:19 PM
#724
Lexus Fanatic
04-27-18, 04:28 PM
#725
Pole Position
It is important that the A/C compressor be run occasionally during the off-season...maybe five or ten minutes a week. That, of course, is to keep the belt-driven compressor's bearings, pulley, and other moving parts lubed so that they don't dry out and corrode. Even with compressors run by an electric motor, it is also important (though somewhat less-so) to run them during the off-season. You don't have to put up with an icy blast from the vents, though......all modern A/C units allow you to mix as much heat in with the airflow as you want. just by turning up the heat-****. Also, most modern defrost systems automatically turn on the compressor in the defrost mode, to provide a source of dry air...that's why the air sometimes comes out cold and chills the windshield down unless you add heat.
Here's a link to that subject, and you may also find it mentioned in the Owners' Manual of some vehicles.
https://www.autorepairshopsanjose.co...car-ac-winter/.
Here's a link to that subject, and you may also find it mentioned in the Owners' Manual of some vehicles.
https://www.autorepairshopsanjose.co...car-ac-winter/.
04-27-18, 04:31 PM
#726
I have brand new IS200t & GS350.
I find that the 2.0 Turbo has a very smooth and quiet idle; the IS200t seems to use a lot of sound insulation, and has a marvellous engine subframe and hydraulic engine mounts.
Around town with small throttle openings and low rpm, the 2.0T has a tiring throb, and feels weak in power.
However, at wide open throttle openings and high rpm, the 2.0T spins beautifully [almost as good as the old 2005-07 3.0 V6], and it delivers plenty of punch, though not as much as a 3.5 V6.
The GS 3.5 V6 has a loud and thrummy idle; putting the gearbox into N will make the idle smoother, but still loud.
At small throttle openings, low rpm and around town, the 3.5 V6 purrs effortlessly; it is perilously smooth.
At wide open throttle and high rpm, the 3.5 delivers plenty of power, however it does not rev as smoothly as the 2.0T, and is well short of Lexus' old 3.0 V6 for smoothness and quietness.
Neither engines are perfect; both have their pros and cons.
However, because most of our driving is around town, and we rarely full throttle the vehicles anymore, the 3.5 V6 feels nicer, despite the loud and poor idle.
We spend more time pottering around town, than idling at the traffic lights...
I find that the 2.0 Turbo has a very smooth and quiet idle; the IS200t seems to use a lot of sound insulation, and has a marvellous engine subframe and hydraulic engine mounts.
Around town with small throttle openings and low rpm, the 2.0T has a tiring throb, and feels weak in power.
However, at wide open throttle openings and high rpm, the 2.0T spins beautifully [almost as good as the old 2005-07 3.0 V6], and it delivers plenty of punch, though not as much as a 3.5 V6.
The GS 3.5 V6 has a loud and thrummy idle; putting the gearbox into N will make the idle smoother, but still loud.
At small throttle openings, low rpm and around town, the 3.5 V6 purrs effortlessly; it is perilously smooth.
At wide open throttle and high rpm, the 3.5 delivers plenty of power, however it does not rev as smoothly as the 2.0T, and is well short of Lexus' old 3.0 V6 for smoothness and quietness.
Neither engines are perfect; both have their pros and cons.
However, because most of our driving is around town, and we rarely full throttle the vehicles anymore, the 3.5 V6 feels nicer, despite the loud and poor idle.
We spend more time pottering around town, than idling at the traffic lights...
04-27-18, 05:23 PM
#727
Lexus Test Driver
Appreciate the comparison. I don't have a problem with the 2.0T, its a little rough on start-up but settles down, and there's the slightest bit of turbo lag (so is everyone else's though), but it's punchy. I like that it's built in-house. I'm sure the 2.0T or a version of it could find it's way into the ES in the future. I also believe you'll see a 20hp 20lbft jump when the 4IS comes, which would put it on par with the competition which is starting to reach 270+ hp in some applications. Lexus just needs to work on overall weight of their cars. But as to the ES, it just makes sense to continue with the V6 for the moment. The new hybrid I4 will be less strained with a more goosed battery and electric motor, than the current 300h.
Evidence of this is: The 2IS held the 2.5 V6 from 06 till 2015 - a total of 9 years. (And the 3.5 V6 even longer - for a total of 12 years.) Since the AR Turbo was only released in the IS for MY2016, its likely Lexus won't change out the engine in 4 years (MY2021 for 4IS). It'll be too quick to change and they'll likely milk it till they have to change it. I mean, the 2014 Lexus IS sold similar numbers to the 2006 Lexus IS despite having a 8 year old engine at the time.
04-27-18, 05:40 PM
#728
On the topic of the 4IS, I disagree with you that it'll have a new Turbo with 20 extra HP/TQ. Toyota and Lexus are pretty slow on changing engines, like super slow that its ridiculous.
Evidence of this is: The 2IS held the 2.5 V6 from 06 till 2015 - a total of 9 years. (And the 3.5 V6 even longer - for a total of 12 years.) Since the AR Turbo was only released in the IS for MY2016, its likely Lexus won't change out the engine in 4 years (MY2021 for 4IS). It'll be too quick to change and they'll likely milk it till they have to change it. I mean, the 2014 Lexus IS sold similar numbers to the 2006 Lexus IS despite having a 8 year old engine at the time.
Evidence of this is: The 2IS held the 2.5 V6 from 06 till 2015 - a total of 9 years. (And the 3.5 V6 even longer - for a total of 12 years.) Since the AR Turbo was only released in the IS for MY2016, its likely Lexus won't change out the engine in 4 years (MY2021 for 4IS). It'll be too quick to change and they'll likely milk it till they have to change it. I mean, the 2014 Lexus IS sold similar numbers to the 2006 Lexus IS despite having a 8 year old engine at the time.
If the IS retains the 311hp 3.5L V6 then its doubtful they'll upgrade the 2.0T. If they manage to put a detuned 3.5L TTV6 in there, there's a better chance of the upgrade.
Lexus also changed two powertrains on the GS between 2006-2007. 2006 GS300 and GS430 to the 2007 GS350 and GS460. So anything is possible.
But as for right now, the 2.0T is not needed in the 7ES hence its omission.
04-27-18, 05:54 PM
#729
Lexus Test Driver
I wonder if Toyota will ever make a Camry plug-in hybrid and it there will ever be an ES cousin of that. Europe already gets delectable wagons like the Passat and Kia Optima PHEV estates. An ES plug-in wagon would be a great SUV competitor with much better mileage and electric range.
04-27-18, 06:17 PM
#730
Give it a few years, and I suspect that Lexus will indeed have a more powerful version of the 2.0T for the IS, while the 7ES uses the current 2.0T version, and eventually even the Camry will get the 2.0T, or at least a detuned 2.0T.
Meanwhile, I wonder if many people realize that TMC and indeed the whole world including GM, Ford & VW is heading towards "electrification" - in the same way that they "digitized" back in the late 1990's as Kodak was phased out?
Traditional ICE is on it's way out, and in comes EV - this may be the very reason why 5GS was axed in favor of a suspected replacement by an EV GSe equivalent.
https://www.greencarreports.com/news...c-car-division
Due to global motor vehicle electrification, I don't believe that there is too much more room for traditional ICE development like Toyota 2.0T turbos, 3.0L V6 TT & 4.0 V8 TT - let alone electric turbos which accelerate to 70,000 rpm in just 2 milliseconds to eliminate turbo lag, or SH-AWD for traction.
Conventional thinking with internal combustion engines ICE is not putting enough thought & consideration into the electrification of the motor vehicle industry.
Development of ICE's will gradually slow down...
.
Meanwhile, I wonder if many people realize that TMC and indeed the whole world including GM, Ford & VW is heading towards "electrification" - in the same way that they "digitized" back in the late 1990's as Kodak was phased out?
Traditional ICE is on it's way out, and in comes EV - this may be the very reason why 5GS was axed in favor of a suspected replacement by an EV GSe equivalent.
https://www.greencarreports.com/news...c-car-division
Due to global motor vehicle electrification, I don't believe that there is too much more room for traditional ICE development like Toyota 2.0T turbos, 3.0L V6 TT & 4.0 V8 TT - let alone electric turbos which accelerate to 70,000 rpm in just 2 milliseconds to eliminate turbo lag, or SH-AWD for traction.
Conventional thinking with internal combustion engines ICE is not putting enough thought & consideration into the electrification of the motor vehicle industry.
Development of ICE's will gradually slow down...
.
Last edited by peteharvey; 04-28-18 at 04:04 AM.
04-27-18, 07:28 PM
#732
Air conditioners are something like 15 Amps.
Electric stoves run higher amperages too.
Just a matter of installing high amperage power lines to parking bays for overnight "top-up" charging.
Also, battery technology will improve over time, with technologies like graphene which is both more energy dense, and allows more rapid recharge times.
All the major manufacturers are presently preparing to electrify their range.
.
Last edited by peteharvey; 04-27-18 at 11:04 PM.
04-27-18, 07:30 PM
#733
Forum Administrator
iTrader: (2)
Back on topic folks About the new ES please
04-27-18, 07:49 PM
#734
Lexus Champion
I wonder if Toyota will ever make a Camry plug-in hybrid and it there will ever be an ES cousin of that. Europe already gets delectable wagons like the Passat and Kia Optima PHEV estates. An ES plug-in wagon would be a great SUV competitor with much better mileage and electric range.
I don't know if Toyota will introduce a plug-in hybrid version of the Camry, Avalon or ES. I doubt it, at least I doubt that these PHEVs would come with the current 2.5-litre engine, and nickel metal hydride or lithium ion battery. If the solid state battery is only a generation (5 years) away, I think that Toyota will ride out the current generation with its hybrid drivetrain and then offer something dramatically different for 2023 / 2024 (and design that next platform to accept in-floor traction battery).
04-27-18, 10:21 PM
#735
Lexus Test Driver
The thing is, it wouldn't take much engineering to add a larger PHEV battery pack. If Hyundai, Kia, BMW, VW/Porsche and Ford can do it, why can't Toyota? The new ES puts the battery pack under the rear seats; extra cells could go behind the rear seat like the old ES. Making a PHEV isn't rocket science as Toyota already has the Prius Prime.
Knowing how conservative TMC is, I think they won't bother with PHEVs. They'll probably go straight for BEVs, first using lithium ion packs and later on using that magic solid state cell they've been working on. Interestingly, Toyota used lithium ion cells on the base spec Camry hybrid for weight reduction and not for density. The other hybrids still use NiMH for longevity.
Knowing how conservative TMC is, I think they won't bother with PHEVs. They'll probably go straight for BEVs, first using lithium ion packs and later on using that magic solid state cell they've been working on. Interestingly, Toyota used lithium ion cells on the base spec Camry hybrid for weight reduction and not for density. The other hybrids still use NiMH for longevity.