Unhappy with ES 300h
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jpreslee (01-22-20)
01-22-20 | 09:55 AM
#20
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 364
Likes: 84
From: CA
I’m not sure of your driving conditions (terrain, traffic, lead foot, etc), but I’m getting over 40 mpg on the highway in mountainous terrain, in Normal mode, at 60-75mph. In town I’m getting 36-38 mpg driving very short (10 minutes or less) trips. I’m happy with the fuel economy and ride/fit.
My 2020 ES300h (Premium) is much quieter and better driving than the 2011 Camry Hybrid we use to have...sounds like maybe you got a bad apple??
My 2020 ES300h (Premium) is much quieter and better driving than the 2011 Camry Hybrid we use to have...sounds like maybe you got a bad apple??
Our 2019 300h appears to be well constructed and rattle free. We have no wind noise and the ride is very good. Now with that said, it’s been clearly noted in some reviews that Lexus firmed up the ride with the 2019 redesign in favor of better handling/cornering. A worthwhile trade off IMO. So it’s not as floaty as it used to be...by design.
It’s also worth noting that you will normally not get the EPA rating driving at 70. We’ve averaged 40mpg, which I think is very good considering we bought the car as the weather turned colder. During a day or two when the weather was warmer, it was apparent we were getting in the low to mid 40s.
It’s also worth noting that you will normally not get the EPA rating driving at 70. We’ve averaged 40mpg, which I think is very good considering we bought the car as the weather turned colder. During a day or two when the weather was warmer, it was apparent we were getting in the low to mid 40s.
Coming from a 2015 ES 300h, we are very happy with our 2019 300h. It is a better looking car, with a similar ride, although it seems to absorb larger road imperfections a little better. If it is any quieter, it is only by a small margin. Our last tank of gas registered 43mpg. This is our fifth hybrid and we always run on eco mode (which I suspect the manufacturer used for developing the mileage ratings). I’m not trying to minimize your points at all, but you are also comparing against some nice cars that just don’t happen to wear the Lexus label. Remember, this car is based on the Toyota Avalon so I would expect the ride and noise levels to be similar. Gone are the days of the Luxo-barges with inches of sound deadening as that adds too much weight and that impacts their CAFE scores. The last generation of ES also generated ride complaints from owners that had higher expectations. My wife and I purchased the 2015 ES after owning two Priuses so I can tell you we had very different expectations and have not been disappointed. Remember too, this is the first year of this generation and there are often issues that don’t show up until there are thousands of a particular model year on the road - such as the driver’s window noise complaint some owners have experienced.
Motor vehicles at today’s prices depreciate fast - even more with luxury brands. If I wasn’t satisfied with my purchase, I would trade it off before it loses any more value. If it was a lease, I understand there are web sites where you can essentially sell your lease (I may be oversimplifying as I have never leased a car). Just Google “auto lease takeover” to see what I mean.
Life is too short and modern cars are too expensive to live with one you aren’t happy with. Just my opinion.
Motor vehicles at today’s prices depreciate fast - even more with luxury brands. If I wasn’t satisfied with my purchase, I would trade it off before it loses any more value. If it was a lease, I understand there are web sites where you can essentially sell your lease (I may be oversimplifying as I have never leased a car). Just Google “auto lease takeover” to see what I mean.
Life is too short and modern cars are too expensive to live with one you aren’t happy with. Just my opinion.
Last edited by jimv1983; 01-22-20 at 09:59 AM.
01-22-20 | 06:19 PM
#22
I own 19 es300h UL. I agree with all your points, except my average mpg has been 47. I live in the Bay Area, do mixed driving, it is my weekend car. I drive in sport and normal modes only.
My current and previous cars are is350 ls430 gs350 and es300. While the tech is far more advanced from all my other cars it just seems like they cut corners on quality in many places. I do enjoy the car and the great gas mileage, but find it hard to justify its 55k price.
My current and previous cars are is350 ls430 gs350 and es300. While the tech is far more advanced from all my other cars it just seems like they cut corners on quality in many places. I do enjoy the car and the great gas mileage, but find it hard to justify its 55k price.
01-23-20 | 05:18 AM
#23
Driver School Candidate
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: Ca
I've now had my ES 300h for just over 9 months and I have to say I'm not as happy with it as I hoped I would be. There are just way to many things upsetting me for a $50,000 car.
There is a rattle in the dash somewhere around the gauge cluster, steering wheel or air vent. It's really hard to pinpoint. The dealer said I'd have to have to take them on a ride along so they can hear it. The problem is that it doesn't happen all the time and I don't like the idea of them tearing open the dash which could cause even more problems.
I am experiencing the same driver's side wind noise that others have mentioned.
The ride really isn't all that smooth. Not much better than the 2011 Camry Hybrid I replaced.
The road noise isn't really any lower than the 2011 Camry Hybrid I replaced.
Even with ECO mode on with cruise control set to 70MPH with 90% freeway driving I'm only getting 37MPG which is almost 20% less than the 45MPG estimate given by Lexus.
The leather on the driver's seat back is stretched and sagging. That started to be noticable after like 4 months of owning the car and has only gotten worse since then.
That's pretty bad for a $50,000 car that isn't even a year old yet.
Based on the reputation I expect from Lexus and the quality of my two previous Toyotas I've very shocked and upset. I expected much better from Lexus.
There is a rattle in the dash somewhere around the gauge cluster, steering wheel or air vent. It's really hard to pinpoint. The dealer said I'd have to have to take them on a ride along so they can hear it. The problem is that it doesn't happen all the time and I don't like the idea of them tearing open the dash which could cause even more problems.
I am experiencing the same driver's side wind noise that others have mentioned.
The ride really isn't all that smooth. Not much better than the 2011 Camry Hybrid I replaced.
The road noise isn't really any lower than the 2011 Camry Hybrid I replaced.
Even with ECO mode on with cruise control set to 70MPH with 90% freeway driving I'm only getting 37MPG which is almost 20% less than the 45MPG estimate given by Lexus.
The leather on the driver's seat back is stretched and sagging. That started to be noticable after like 4 months of owning the car and has only gotten worse since then.
That's pretty bad for a $50,000 car that isn't even a year old yet.
Based on the reputation I expect from Lexus and the quality of my two previous Toyotas I've very shocked and upset. I expected much better from Lexus.
I was able to record the rattling today, but I’m not able to attach here since is mov
Last edited by Arabh; 01-23-20 at 12:20 PM.
01-23-20 | 07:35 AM
#24
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,099
Likes: 73
From: Tx
I did a lot of research before purchasing the ES and one thing that I noticed is that a lot of vehicles now fall under the $50k price category, even Honda. If you truly want a luxurious vehicle you will now need to spend around $70-$80k or more. This being my first Lexus I didn't have high expectations since it's just a Toyota with some upgrades.
One would like to think that it would be the same materials (i.e. leather, speakers, powertrain) going in the build. That said, a common feedback I do read in these forums is the ES is an upgraded Avalon (almost all ES's are built in the same plant as the Avalon anyway) and not an ES of yesteryear...
01-23-20 | 08:10 AM
#25
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 8,203
Likes: 2,574
From: NJ
Do ES300h owners think that Made in Japan vs Made in Kentucky makes a difference in your satisfaction?
One would like to think that it would be the same materials (i.e. leather, speakers, powertrain) going in the build. That said, a common feedback I do read in these forums is the ES is an upgraded Avalon (almost all ES's are built in the same plant as the Avalon anyway) and not an ES of yesteryear...
One would like to think that it would be the same materials (i.e. leather, speakers, powertrain) going in the build. That said, a common feedback I do read in these forums is the ES is an upgraded Avalon (almost all ES's are built in the same plant as the Avalon anyway) and not an ES of yesteryear...
01-23-20 | 08:21 AM
#26
Advanced
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 547
Likes: 145
From: CA
Probably doesn't matter where it is built. Our RX was built in Japan and presumably our ES in Kentucky and I don't notice any difference in quality, workmanship etc. But the ES of yesteryear?? The one that was half the size of the latest generation? How was that better and truly any different than a Camry other than some sound insulation and fancier interior?? The latest generation ES seems light years ahead Avalon comparison or not.
01-23-20 | 08:31 AM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 8,203
Likes: 2,574
From: NJ
01-23-20 | 09:57 AM
#29
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 1,019
From: Illinois
For years, Lexus faced the challenge with the ES of balancing how many "corners they could cut" to be able to keep the price of a bare bones ES under $40,000 and to keep the price of a fully loaded ES under $45,000. Then, the challenge became to keep the price of a fully loaded ES under $50,000. Now, it appears that the challenge in the next several years may be to keep the MSRP of a fully loaded ES under $60,000.
My first ES was a 2006 ES. With that 2006 ES and with the 2005 GX that I still own, I could not find fault at all with either the quality of the materials or the quality of the workmanship. I'm not sure that you can always say the same thing about the materials or workmanship in many Lexus models in their current line-up. The reality is that keeping prices at a acceptable level can require making compromises with regard to the materials used or quality control.
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01-23-20 | 09:59 AM
#30
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 8,203
Likes: 2,574
From: NJ
Not sure but the differences are certainly more than tech. Did the 99 have 19 wheels? Similar suspension, etc? Silly conversation honestly. Perhaps you prefer your 19' B&W TV from that era as compared to your 65" high def today? My neighbor has a 2010 ES and that my friend is light years different from mine.