Originally Posted by Blaze876

I find it hard to believe that it would be a deal breaker. If there was a vehicle you like just as much as a model y, that MSRP for 4k less which you will be able to get at MSRP after 4 hours of haggling at the dealership, you would rather pay 4k more for a car you like just as much?


To an extent yes that's true. But Tesla owners / fans take it to another level I have never seen.

The only other forums I have been in the past few years is Mercedes and BMW and yeah they are fanatics. But some negative comments seem to be for most part universally accepted. Bmw current design direction is widely frowned upon in the forums the last time I've been in it. Mercedes subreddit widely accepts that Mercedes has an interior creaking issue lol....going off on a tangent is it just me or Mercedes interiors just don't hold up after 6-8 years?

Toyota / Lexus forums seems to widely accept some negative aspects as well but falls back on the excuse at least it's reliable lol.

There is a difference between accepting a car faults but liking it because of everything else. But forums for Teslas turn those faults into pros. I mean simple things as creaks gets excused because Teslas are quiet and maybe you didn't notice creaks in your previous cars because the ICE engine drowns it out lol. Removal of USS gets rid of those ugly circles on your bumper covers for a cleaner look.

Originally Posted by AMIRZA786

You're the first Tesla owner I've talked to that is extremely negative towards their Tesla. Even @patgilm who's had a crap load of issues with his Plaid loves the thing and would get another one. That EQS must be amazing . Not judging, I take the position that not everyone is going to like a Tesla, which is perfectly fine. I guess the EQS is just that good

Originally Posted by signdetres

The EQS is an amazing product, but that's beside the point... I really don't feel like I'm being negative about Tesla, I'm just being honest. I once sipped the Tesla kool-aid too, so I get it, but now that it's worn off, I can see a little more clearly now so I try to be as objective and honest as possible.

I'd like to point out that I'm not a Tesla hater, obviously, as we have one and I fully plan on getting a Cybertruck... In fact, I haven't been excited about a new car like this in a long time. So in sum, I like to just call it like I see it. I acknowledge the areas where Tesla excels, and I acknowledge the areas where other OEMs excel. From where I'm sitting, Cybertruck aside, other OEMs are doing A LOT more in the EV space right now and are putting out products that keep getting better and better. Tesla's core lineup, S 3 X and Y, have not pushed any needles or raised any bars in any way since they came out a loooong time ago.

Originally Posted by signdetres

we had such a fantastic experience getting our EQS SUV from Mercedes Benz of Sioux Falls in South Dakota. They were so awesome from start to finish. It only took 2 emails for them to give me the deal I was looking for. Then we got there and there were no surprises and no nasty sales tactics. We were in and out of there in 10 or 15 minutes. The finance guy was SO nice, didn't try to make us purchase a single additional warranty or anything like that. It was the fastest, easiest, and most pleasant non-Tesla buying experience I've ever had.

Originally Posted by LeX2K

You must be loading up BYDDY.

Originally Posted by AMIRZA786

Bottom line, I want to buy my car online. I don't want to deal with a middleman who takes a cut adding no value. I don't want to waste even 5 minutes trying to knock down a markup done by a middle man. Let's just leave it there.

I can only speak for myself, but the reason I would buy a Tesla over say a Lexus that has way better quality..is that the Tesla is just a better car IMO. It drives better, it has better performance, it's funner to drive, and it's more efficient and it offers me better value. Whatever it's faults, it makes up for in just being a better driving car. I don't make excuses for it's faults, they exist, but the car is so good, I'm willing to overlook them. Have you ever thought why people who drove Toyota, Lexus, BMW's transitioned to Tesla? Because they are that damn good, IMO of course.

But let me end with this. Learn to filter out the noise. Yes, there are Tesla fanatics that say Tesla can do know wrong. Just tune them out if it bothers you, that's my advice

Originally Posted by AMIRZA786

One more thing @Blaze876 ...I don't judge anyone who is critical of Tesla. I understand that not everyone wants a Tesla. You prefer Lexus, Toyota or BMW, I don't judge. I myself own three EV's, only one of them is a Tesla. Also I do look at Tesla sales numbers, but only because I'm an investor. Put my investor hat to the side, and I can care less if Tesla sales 500K cars, or 300K cars in a quarter. When Tesla cuts their pricing, to me that's a good thing because it benefits the consumer. Honestly, if Tesla hadn't cut pricing on the Model Y, I would not have bought one this year and would have waited until next year.

Let me just leave you with one more example of why I hate dealerships so much. Last weekend I went with my brother in law to look at a 2023 Toyota Sienna Hybrid. MSRP is $36,885. A bit on the pricey side, but OK. After dealership markups, it's coming out to $60K!!! Seriously?? For a minivan with a Camry engine? They wouldn't budge a penny on ADM. So we walked away. They really need a minivan, but not a $60k minivan lol

Originally Posted by Blaze876

Lol hell no. I would never pay ADM. I'll rather buy sold beater until the market changes. I don't care if the ADM is $500. I'm paying MSRP and that's it. If I truly love the vehicle and have my mind set I'm buying it used if the dealers can't give me at MSRP.

One thing I'm sure of you would probably never go back to an ICE, I see you love your EVs lol.

To be honest I don't really have a favorite brand, if I had to choose it would be Porsche but I don't have Porsche money haha. Never owned one but I like majority of the vehicles in their line up. Ideally would want a Cayenne GTS or Panamera as a daily.

I will need an SUV soon and would rather keep the budget at 65k and under. The new GX is what I like but I know ADM will be an issue....I'm patient though so I'll wait until it's not haha.

Originally Posted by AMIRZA786

I never say never! In 2025 two of my cars will be going off lease. One of them I may buy out (my Polestar), but I may be replacing both my Ioniq 5 and 2013 Sienna with Sienna Hybrid....that is if I can get it at MSRP. My wife would be driving the Sienna. She likes Minivans, and we need a Minivan. My 2013 is just too inefficient to use as a daily commuter

Originally Posted by Blaze876

Would you switch to an EV minivan if there is one by 2025? I hope for your sake there is lol. It would probably be close to 60k anyway so a Sienna or Pacifica plug in might make more sense.

Fortunately my fiance despises minivans. She likes big gas guzzling SUVs, yukons, range rovers, escalades.

Anyway let me get back on topic, next year will be very interesting especially if the economy weakens. How will EVs do in a weaker economy? How will manufacturers relying on full size SUVs and pick up sales manage?

If Tesla shows continued strong growth in a weakening economy it would cast away most of my doubts I have about their growth.

Originally Posted by spwolf

nope, just a Tesla owner, own 2. Dont own Tesla or BYD stock.

But there is no reason to spread false news because you own Tesla stock.