Tesla Business and News Thread
#1216
Instructor
iTrader: (1)
Agreed there, a big reason I opted not to purchase FSD. Just my observation, but it was mainly the early Tesla adopters who really care about FSD, today's average Model 3 or Model Y buyers (the majority of buyers) don't really care about FSD. Most care about Traffic Aware Cruise Control or Autopilot which is used mainly on trips. Outside of Elon Musk, Institutional investors and or those looking to short TSLA are those who mainly focus outlooks on FSD, IMO of course
#1217
Lexus Fanatic
I retired early because of TSLA, yet some right now are probably thinking why is that guy so negative on Tesla?
It could happen again. A couple more negative nancy stories about Tesla and investors run for the hills the stock tanks.
It could happen again. A couple more negative nancy stories about Tesla and investors run for the hills the stock tanks.
#1218
Instructor
iTrader: (1)
There is no denying that Tesla has the largest set of HW units on the ground capturing data to make FSD better. I mean this both in the sense of cars on the road actively using FSD and also the fact that every Tesla has cameras constantly capturing real time road dynamics and info. One thing I heard on the earnings call that I didn't like was how they aren't currently actively talking to any other auto manufacturer who wants to license FSD. That makes no sense to me. This is not your typical "build vs buy" discussion that companies have when deciding if they want to acquire/license a technology or build it themselves. This is fundamentally different in the sense that the other manufacturers could not catch up to the number of data-collecting vehicles that Tesla has on the road in a short enough time period to make their neural network large enough to produce the desired outcome of a working product.
It seems so obvious to me that the only obvious conclusion is I'm missing something..!!
It seems so obvious to me that the only obvious conclusion is I'm missing something..!!
#1219
Lexus Test Driver
That's how it's done. Lol
Beat them at their own tricks. 🚀
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AMIRZA786 (01-26-24)
#1220
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
I agree to an extent. Would you care if FSD was fully functional? Do you think other Tesla buyers would care? I do. I could easily see people spending 20k on a fully functional FSD. So my point is, people don't care right now because it doesn't work. Once it does...if it does, it would almost be silly purchasing a tesla without FSD.
#1221
Lexus Fanatic
Elon said just that, other auto makers don't think FSD is real.
#1222
We have heard Tesla said all cars being released are FSD capable, then about 4-5 years later they released that some cars will need upgrades and some I believe will not be able to at all. So I will take them saying now that all cars are FSD capable with a grain of salt.
My personal believe of it being so far out also is a reason why I lean more towards Tesla has no cars currently that will be FSD capable. They may be able to be upgraded...but hey, a lot smarter people are working at Tesla so I may be completely wrong lol.
My personal believe of it being so far out also is a reason why I lean more towards Tesla has no cars currently that will be FSD capable. They may be able to be upgraded...but hey, a lot smarter people are working at Tesla so I may be completely wrong lol.
That said, I've lost most of my confidence that they'll ever deliver it as promised. I'm surprised regulators haven't forced them to offer refunds. People keep cars for a fairly long time, but this package has been for sale for seven years now. I know a lot has happened under the covers and it's very good on highways now, but in the years I've had it the quality on my local roads has risen only to the level of pretty poor from a starting point of dangerously unusable.
#1223
Instructor
iTrader: (1)
Just speaking for myself, I like driving and don't want AI driving for me. It's the control freak in me. So I wouldn't pay for FSD unless it was maybe a $1500 option, and I would only use it occasionally, like on long trips. Would it have value if it fully worked as envisioned by Tesla? 100 percent. It would save companies like Uber and Lyft tons of money not having to pay drivers, and it would create a whole industry of Robotaxi's, and ride sharing where you call a car through an app, it shows up and drops you off. Most younger people under 30 would probably never own cars anymore
I've had FSD for almost five years now. Picked it up during the FSD fire sale when, as we found out a few years later, the company was in a fairly precarious financial state. My car had HW version 2, and any car with FSD package purchased got a free upgrade to HW3 (what they call the FSD hw now). My understanding is HW4 includes camera upgrades so there is no upgrade path to HW4. For people like myself they must deliver it on the existing hardware.
That said, I've lost most of my confidence that they'll ever deliver it as promised. I'm surprised regulators haven't forced them to offer refunds. People keep cars for a fairly long time, but this package has been for sale for seven years now. I know a lot has happened under the covers and it's very good on highways now, but in the years I've had it the quality on my local roads has risen only to the level of pretty poor from a starting point of dangerously unusable.
That said, I've lost most of my confidence that they'll ever deliver it as promised. I'm surprised regulators haven't forced them to offer refunds. People keep cars for a fairly long time, but this package has been for sale for seven years now. I know a lot has happened under the covers and it's very good on highways now, but in the years I've had it the quality on my local roads has risen only to the level of pretty poor from a starting point of dangerously unusable.
#1224
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
I love driving too. However, imagine sending out your tesla to go pick up the kids, pick up someone from the airport. You and your spouse are out and she wants to leave but you don't. You left something at home? Just send your car home and have whoever s home put it in the car or optimus? lol. Imagine a Tesla minivan with FSD, watching tv while laying down in the back on a long road trip. Need your tires changed? Send the car to the shop on its own.....a lot of scenarios I would rather not drive.
Yeah, its borderline a scam. One of my reasons I don't believe in FSD anytime soon. Too many variables, one you just highlighted about your local roads. Maybe one day we will see one of those ADs, "did you purchase FSD? You may be qualified for compensation, please call 1-800-FSD".
Yeah, its borderline a scam. One of my reasons I don't believe in FSD anytime soon. Too many variables, one you just highlighted about your local roads. Maybe one day we will see one of those ADs, "did you purchase FSD? You may be qualified for compensation, please call 1-800-FSD".
Tesla has already been sued a few times for Autopilot and FSD related crashes, and won every case. The most recent was class action suit in California. It's possible this may happen in a state that's not EV friendly
#1225
Instructor
iTrader: (1)
Sure, would be great to be able to do those things you mentioned, but personally FSD is just not for me. And btw, Tesla will never have a Minivan. At least not in my lifetime. I'll stand by that statement, which I probably shouldn't
Tesla has already been sued a few times for Autopilot and FSD related crashes, and won every case. The most recent was class action suit in California. It's possible this may happen in a state that's not EV friendly
Tesla has already been sued a few times for Autopilot and FSD related crashes, and won every case. The most recent was class action suit in California. It's possible this may happen in a state that's not EV friendly
We weren't discussing Tesla being sued because of crashes. Is Tesla should be sued for selling a product that doesn't work and the promise of it working soon. I would be a billionaire if I could sell a product for thousands that doesn't work and make people believe it will soon.
#1226
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Lol why you say that about a minivan? Not cool enough? Haha.
We weren't discussing Tesla being sued because of crashes. Is Tesla should be sued for selling a product that doesn't work and the promise of it working soon. I would be a billionaire if I could sell a product for thousands that doesn't work and make people believe it will soon.
We weren't discussing Tesla being sued because of crashes. Is Tesla should be sued for selling a product that doesn't work and the promise of it working soon. I would be a billionaire if I could sell a product for thousands that doesn't work and make people believe it will soon.
OK, I see what you're saying. Tesla has always put out unfinished products, but they improve them over time. I'm one of those critics that blasted Tesla for removing parking sensors and relying on vision, but I've seen how much it's evolved in just the last 6 months, so I'm confident they will get FSD working. Even though I don't have FSD, Tesla, with my permission, is collecting tons of driving data from me, something I had to "opt in" to. And there are millions of Tesla's they are constantly collecting data from. It's just a matter of time. Also, you don't have to buy FSD...you can get a subscription for $199 a month and can cancel anytime. This is a great way to try it without making a $12k commitment. Also, they will give you 3 months free FSD if you buy a Model S or X, and even occasionally offer this for the 3 and Y
Last edited by AMIRZA786; 01-26-24 at 12:24 PM.
#1227
Lexus Fanatic
You buy something labeled beta and expect it to be a finished product that is on you. And I'll say it again even though the pitchfork crowd doesn't care, FSD+human is safer than just human.
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AMIRZA786 (01-26-24)
#1228
Instructor
iTrader: (1)
#1229
Lexus Fanatic
That's being disingenuous. They bought something labeled beta and was told by the owner of the company it likely will be done next year. It will soon be a decade and it will still be in beta. To make it even worse customers who purchased FSD can not transfer it to their new Tesla (with the exception of a few months last year). So for those early adopters who already sold their Tesla they purchased FSD for, it's their fault for buying a beta product? I guess they should have known the owner of the company is dishonest. But when Toyota calls their hybrids electrified vehicles they are deceptive and the scum of the earth. Why dont you blame customers for not knowing what a hybrid vehicle is? You buy a hybrid expecting it to be full electric, that's on you.