LeX2K

Why is using less energy counter productive?
My energy use is similar to most people, cold winter energy use is offset by more mild summers. No idea why you think I generate more trash. BTW Canada doesn't have the same weather across the entire country.

And yes of course the Norway model will work everywhere, replace fossil fuel energy production with renewable. It's already happening in the United States electricity we generate from clean sources the more EVs we can power. Gas cars will NEVER be clean.

AMIRZA786

This is sadly true. Although the number of new EV registrations are growing in states like Texas and Florida, which is a positive sign that politics as a roadblock may be getting less and less

LeX2K

Tesla has the highest loyalty among auto makers would it be even high if Elon didn't...you know.

AMIRZA786

Haha don't say it 🤣

LeX2K

Riddle me this, does loyalty work only one way? Certain CEO says things that apparently alienate buyers but what he says doesn't appeal to others?

AMIRZA786

I don't know, don't have the answer to your question. I can only tell you why I'm a Tesla buyer and can't speak for others . Great product at a great price, amazing software that's always updated. Easy buying experience, second to none charging infrastructure, and plenty of service centers. Used to be able to say Toyota/Lexus were in this category once upon a time, which is why I was their loyal customer for 25 years

Lwerewolf

They've never ever sold the IS/GS350 here either, and that was before the average CO2 requirements - which aren't really a problem given how many hybrids Toyota sells over here. The IS300h isn't exactly rare, the GS300h isn't an unusual spec for a GS, the GS & LS overall here are as rare as they get - I've seen more LC500s (and no hybrids) than both the GS and the LS combined. The RX is almost exclusively found in hybrid guise and is very highly regarded - most people don't really care for the non-hybrid variety. Same for the rav4 - it's mostly diesels or hybrids. The IS-F, GS-F, RC-F and LC500 were/are still offered.

As far as other brands are concerned, the majority of cars are either downsized turbos or diesels, and flashy/loud/otherwise obnoxious AMG-esque versions tend to be not exactly sought after for the higher-end (S/7/A8) models - diesels still very much rule that segment and I haven't heard any local complaints about the performance of the 730d or the s350d or whatever, really - they can easily maintain 150-200kph on the highway if you're somewhat in a hurry and the traffic allows it, there's still plenty of "go" for overtaking on rural roads, people that can afford and choose to buy such big cars generally couldn't care less about traffic light races, fill-ups are as rare as they get, nobody gives you a second glance, case closed. With all that in mind, it's not exactly hard to see why they aren't offering the new non-hybrid LS - it's pretty much everything a full-size luxury car over here should not be. The base spec LS500h was sold at an incentive as an upgrade towards GS450h owners since the GS got axed and it was well received that way. Otherwise, it's more cramped inside and flashier than the rest, a big departure from what it used to be (the biggest issue), not from a local brand (another big minus) and... is the best hybrid in its class and probably (and reputably) the most reliable - hence why you still see them around from time to time.

p.s. mind showing me a 1.5l i4-t G-class in Europe? There's an m264 version for China, but most of these cars around here, and basically all of the newer ones are G63s. The diesels are mostly for civil services / military duty / people that actually might need a g-wagen, unless it's an older G500 with the NA engines that fare pretty well in actual offroad conditions.

p.s.2 Gas prices where I live are the equivalent of $5.5/US gal (95 RON equivalent to your base "premium", this is the cheapest here), in Germany it's ~$7.1/US gal and they go as high as ~$8.3/US gal in some places (NL / Iceland / Switzeland). Average income tends to be not as high as the US. People here definitely are fuel economy-conscious - even the ones who realistically couldn't care less.

AJT123

There’s a pretty good shot regulations will be rolled back hopefully soon.

SW17LS

Honestly, I think this is Elon Musk's plan.

AMIRZA786

I don't think so. States that follow CARB will continue with strict emissions, pretty much forcing automakers to continue with current emission standards. Why do you think automakers went down this route starting in the 1970's? California residents buy the most cars at 1.775 Million cars, Texas at 1.522 Million, and Florida at 1.367 Million cars. Number 4, which is NY drops below a million at 884,839. If you combine all the "CARB" states, they buy a lot of the cars in the US, 5,235,911 Million. Like it or not, emissions standards are not going away, they will only get stricter. Save this post for future reference

LeX2K

We had this discussion in Car Chat the more cars pollute the shorter your lifespan see locales without emissions standards. Easy to say who needs emissions laws when the air is clean because of regulations.

AMIRZA786

Anyway, I think this is the wrong forum to discuss emissions, displacement etc. This discussion should be left for Car Chat. If you want to discuss taxes on cars, EV's are taxed here in California to make up for lost gas tax revenue. My DMV renewal fees are way higher than gas vehicles:

Hyundai Ioniq 5: $731
Tesla Model Y: $750
Polestar: $706
Toyota Sienna: $187

swajames

That's also tied to value, though. Yes, EV renewals here are higher, but your EVs are all newer than your Sienna and that's a big contributor to the registration fees. My son's RX, our oldest car, was just $177. My truck on the other hand is over $1000, partly due to MSRP but partly as CA treats all trucks as commercial. My Land Rover is about the same as your Model Y, no EV penalty in play but the MSRP impacts it.

1111GS

I was going to say the same about values. His post is really misleading. If CA taxed EVs like he implied, there wouldn't have been that many EVs in CA. Some states do "EV penalty". They go from a $100 to all the way to $400 each new EV registration.

AMIRZA786

True, California charges $175 more for EV's as well as a $3 Alternative fuel fee. My point was, we don't get the free ride everyone thinks we do