Tesla business discussion
01-08-23, 01:44 PM
#256
Pole Position
Fed-up Tesla owners say they're so sick of Elon Musk's antics that they're ditching their cars
Tim Levin
Jan 7, 2023, 6:50 AM
Bottom of Form
A self-described former Tesla fanboy, Bob Perkowitz was among the first few thousand people to reserve a Model S way back in 2009. He took delivery in 2012 and eventually upgraded to a 2017 edition of the same sedan.
He was planning to buy a 2022 model, too. Then things went off the rails.
Perkowitz is one of many Tesla owners rethinking their allegiance to the brand as Elon Musk becomes an increasingly erratic and polarizing figure online. Tesla's CEO has always been outspoken, but in recent months — and particularly after he bought Twitter — the persona on display to his 125 million Twitter followers has shifted from that of the occasionally irreverent, visionary entrepreneur to something decidedly more belligerent and political.
Tesla owners say Musk's antics are becoming too much
Perkowitz says he hasn't bought a new Tesla because of Musk's right-wing views, his tumultuous Twitter acquisition, and his radical emphasis on free speech, which Perkowitz believes will allow misinformation to run rampant on Twitter.
"Elon was a really good reason to buy the car," Perkowitz told Insider. "He had a great brand. He is not such a great brand anymore."
Alan Lasoff, of Calabasas, California, is currently leasing a Model Y SUV, but won't be getting another when his term expires. For him, the decision boils down to what he sees as the billionaire's hypocrisy and amplification of conspiracy theories.
"He told everybody he's buying Twitter because he wants it to be sort of apolitical, and on the eve of the election he says you should vote for Republicans," Lasoff told Insider. "He can have his opinion, but the thing I really despise in people is hypocrisy."
John Byrne, a software CEO in Maryland, hadn't been a huge fan of his 2020 Model X SUV for some time. He said it was creaky, vibrated at times, and was of an overall build quality that didn't justify its $95,000 price tag.
But Musk's behavior since the Twitter saga — particularly his broadcasting of right-wing views and attack on Anthony Fauci — was the final straw. Byrne traded in his car for an electric Audi in late 2022.
"I don't want to be a brand ambassador for them anymore," Byrne told Insider.
Tesla did not return a request for comment.
Musk may be attracting conservatives to the brand
Some recent studies back up the anecdotes. The research firm Morning Consult found that Tesla's net favorability rating among Democrats dropped by 20% between October and November. Favorability among Republicans improved slightly.
According to Matthew Quint, a brand expert at Columbia Business School, consumers are more likely to react poorly to a car company being controversial than another type of business. That's because a car is a long-term purchase that represents its owner to the outside world wherever they go — unlike, say, a can of Goya beans.
Moreover, Quint said, the five-figure outlay involved will make someone think harder about whom they're enriching and whether they agree with their views.
The turnaround among some fans comes at a trying time for the company.
After years of Teslas flying off of the shelves, the company is facing big questions about if consumer demand is waning. Amid those concerns, investor fears about Musk's preoccupation with Twitter, and slowing sales growth, Tesla's stock plummeted 65% in 2022.
Plus, Tesla is dealing with an aging product line while it faces unprecedented competition in the EV space, Sam Fiorani, vice president of global vehicle forecasting at AutoForecast Solutions, told Insider.
Still, it's unclear whether Musk's outbursts will deal a significant blow to Tesla's sales going forward. Things could balance out if Musk repels progressives while simultaneously selling lots of conservatives on his cars, Quint said. And if Musk wants to blunt the impact of his words, all he has to do is tone things down, Quint said.
Perkowitz agrees. He's been looking at the Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Polestar 2 as electric alternatives, but he's holding out hope that he'll be able to buy a Model S in good conscience.
"I've been kind of stalling, waiting for Elon to come to his senses and say something that makes sense," Perkowitz said. "But if he doesn't do it soon, I'll be driving the Polestar."
Tim Levin
Jan 7, 2023, 6:50 AM
Bottom of Form
A self-described former Tesla fanboy, Bob Perkowitz was among the first few thousand people to reserve a Model S way back in 2009. He took delivery in 2012 and eventually upgraded to a 2017 edition of the same sedan.
He was planning to buy a 2022 model, too. Then things went off the rails.
Perkowitz is one of many Tesla owners rethinking their allegiance to the brand as Elon Musk becomes an increasingly erratic and polarizing figure online. Tesla's CEO has always been outspoken, but in recent months — and particularly after he bought Twitter — the persona on display to his 125 million Twitter followers has shifted from that of the occasionally irreverent, visionary entrepreneur to something decidedly more belligerent and political.
Tesla owners say Musk's antics are becoming too much
Perkowitz says he hasn't bought a new Tesla because of Musk's right-wing views, his tumultuous Twitter acquisition, and his radical emphasis on free speech, which Perkowitz believes will allow misinformation to run rampant on Twitter.
"Elon was a really good reason to buy the car," Perkowitz told Insider. "He had a great brand. He is not such a great brand anymore."
Alan Lasoff, of Calabasas, California, is currently leasing a Model Y SUV, but won't be getting another when his term expires. For him, the decision boils down to what he sees as the billionaire's hypocrisy and amplification of conspiracy theories.
"He told everybody he's buying Twitter because he wants it to be sort of apolitical, and on the eve of the election he says you should vote for Republicans," Lasoff told Insider. "He can have his opinion, but the thing I really despise in people is hypocrisy."
John Byrne, a software CEO in Maryland, hadn't been a huge fan of his 2020 Model X SUV for some time. He said it was creaky, vibrated at times, and was of an overall build quality that didn't justify its $95,000 price tag.
But Musk's behavior since the Twitter saga — particularly his broadcasting of right-wing views and attack on Anthony Fauci — was the final straw. Byrne traded in his car for an electric Audi in late 2022.
"I don't want to be a brand ambassador for them anymore," Byrne told Insider.
Tesla did not return a request for comment.
Musk may be attracting conservatives to the brand
Some recent studies back up the anecdotes. The research firm Morning Consult found that Tesla's net favorability rating among Democrats dropped by 20% between October and November. Favorability among Republicans improved slightly.
According to Matthew Quint, a brand expert at Columbia Business School, consumers are more likely to react poorly to a car company being controversial than another type of business. That's because a car is a long-term purchase that represents its owner to the outside world wherever they go — unlike, say, a can of Goya beans.
Moreover, Quint said, the five-figure outlay involved will make someone think harder about whom they're enriching and whether they agree with their views.
The turnaround among some fans comes at a trying time for the company.
After years of Teslas flying off of the shelves, the company is facing big questions about if consumer demand is waning. Amid those concerns, investor fears about Musk's preoccupation with Twitter, and slowing sales growth, Tesla's stock plummeted 65% in 2022.
Plus, Tesla is dealing with an aging product line while it faces unprecedented competition in the EV space, Sam Fiorani, vice president of global vehicle forecasting at AutoForecast Solutions, told Insider.
Still, it's unclear whether Musk's outbursts will deal a significant blow to Tesla's sales going forward. Things could balance out if Musk repels progressives while simultaneously selling lots of conservatives on his cars, Quint said. And if Musk wants to blunt the impact of his words, all he has to do is tone things down, Quint said.
Perkowitz agrees. He's been looking at the Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Polestar 2 as electric alternatives, but he's holding out hope that he'll be able to buy a Model S in good conscience.
"I've been kind of stalling, waiting for Elon to come to his senses and say something that makes sense," Perkowitz said. "But if he doesn't do it soon, I'll be driving the Polestar."
Source
01-08-23, 01:54 PM
#257
Lexus Champion
Looks like they spoke to three legends to justify the direction of their story. Buy the vehicle or don’t buy it. So much drama. If you’re not going to buy a pretty good vehicle because of your political beliefs then you deserve to come back to it in a few years when your other brand experiment fails.
Source
Source
Current data, market cap, and sales numbers say BS to this. And I don't even own a Tesla (Polestar 2)
Last edited by AMIRZA786; 01-08-23 at 02:03 PM.
01-08-23, 02:16 PM
#258
Instead of coming up with new models, I think its more important they actually deliver on their already announced models like the Cybertruck and Roadster. I feel like taking half a decade or more to deliver on announcements will eventually bite them in the rear.
01-08-23, 02:20 PM
#259
Lexus Champion
Honestly, do you think that many people want a cyber truck? Maybe I'm wrong as I haven't seen the preorders, but from my perspective the cyber truck is not that important. The Roadster maybe, but it will never sell near the M3 and Y numbers
01-08-23, 02:35 PM
#260
I don't have the knowledge nor data to make any predictions, but from purely from a brand perspective, its not a great look when you never actually deliver on things you promise. That just seems like business 101 to me. But this was mostly in response to some comments about what new products Tesla should introduce, when in reality they have already introduced new products, they just need to follow through and deliver on them.
01-08-23, 02:45 PM
#261
Lexus Champion
I don't have the knowledge nor data to make any predictions, but from purely from a brand perspective, its not a great look when you never actually deliver on things you promise. That just seems like business 101 to me. But this was mostly in response to some comments about what new products Tesla should introduce, when in reality they have already introduced new products, they just need to follow through and deliver on them.
01-08-23, 03:46 PM
#262
My point is, stop making announcements and deliver on what you already promised, don't be makers of vaporware. It will eventually catch up to you.
01-08-23, 03:47 PM
#263
Lexus Champion
They have done exactly that, they introduced new products which they have failed to deliver on for years. So in the case of the Cybertruck and the Roadster, they truly are Lucid.
My point is, stop making announcements and deliver on what you already promised, don't be makers of vaporware. It will eventually catch up to you.
My point is, stop making announcements and deliver on what you already promised, don't be makers of vaporware. It will eventually catch up to you.
01-08-23, 04:15 PM
#264
Lexus Champion
01-08-23, 04:18 PM
#265
Pole Position
01-08-23, 04:33 PM
#266
Lexus Champion
Tesla Semi was never going to be real until it was. Same will happen with Cybertruck etc. etc.
If that's not good enough for some people I don't see what the big deal is, buy something else problem solved.
If that's not good enough for some people I don't see what the big deal is, buy something else problem solved.
01-08-23, 06:25 PM
#267
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
They have done exactly that, they introduced new products which they have failed to deliver on for years. So in the case of the Cybertruck and the Roadster, they truly are Lucid.
My point is, stop making announcements and deliver on what you already promised, don't be makers of vaporware. It will eventually catch up to you.
My point is, stop making announcements and deliver on what you already promised, don't be makers of vaporware. It will eventually catch up to you.
cybertruck may be a flop, but it might not, despite all the naysayers.
01-08-23, 06:51 PM
#268
01-08-23, 06:54 PM
#269
the roadster will probably be $250k so it won't be sold in big numbers and besides the halo aspect, isn't important to tesla. however, cybertruck is important. but we need to remember this is a company that's never sold a truck and isn't just trying to do an electric conventional truck, but something pretty radical. to design and then build that at scale, while you're still scaling the rest of the business, isn't easy. lucid and rivian hadn't delivered anything a year ago, but good for them finally getting something out the door. we'll see how long it takes for lucid to have a SECOND product. rivian got the truck out, but has taken a while for the suv. it's just not easy.
cybertruck may be a flop, but it might not, despite all the naysayers.
cybertruck may be a flop, but it might not, despite all the naysayers.
01-08-23, 07:01 PM
#270
Whats important is that they follow through.