Musk: Tesla must cut costs or stock will be ‘crushed like a souffle under a sledgeham
03-05-21, 07:53 PM
#256
Lexus Fanatic
Facetious, maybe, but not childish. One never knows what to expect with Musk.
Anyhow, back to topic, which is costs. I think EZZ has a good point with the Ioniq 5....it's going to be a good competition for a lower-priced Tesla in the future.
Anyhow, back to topic, which is costs. I think EZZ has a good point with the Ioniq 5....it's going to be a good competition for a lower-priced Tesla in the future.
Originally Posted by EZZ
The Ioniq 5 is just the beginning of their product launch. They will have cheaper EVs to assist the European markets and when Tesla finishes the Berlin plant, it will release a $25k hatchback with the new 4680 cell (which cuts battery prices in half vs. today). EVs will begin to make a pretty big dent by 2025 for sure.
03-05-21, 08:09 PM
#257
Lexus Test Driver
Betting against Tesla and Musk is like betting against Brady in the SuperBowl.
They are at least 10yrs in front of all other companies on EV tech and large scale EV production. They’re setting up factories in China and India. Not to mention their charging infrastructure is light years ahead of the competition.
They are at least 10yrs in front of all other companies on EV tech and large scale EV production. They’re setting up factories in China and India. Not to mention their charging infrastructure is light years ahead of the competition.
03-05-21, 08:43 PM
#258
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by RNM GS3
Betting against Tesla and Musk is like betting against Brady in the SuperBowl.
They are at least 10yrs in front of all other companies on EV tech and large scale EV production. They’re setting up factories in China and India. Not to mention their charging infrastructure is light years ahead of the competition.
They are at least 10yrs in front of all other companies on EV tech and large scale EV production. They’re setting up factories in China and India. Not to mention their charging infrastructure is light years ahead of the competition.
03-05-21, 08:55 PM
#259
Lexus Fanatic
03-05-21, 09:06 PM
#260
Lexus Test Driver
Elon Musk will love this: Tesla short sellers lost more than the US airline industry this year
Lots of people bet against Elon and Tesla. I think he's winning
03-06-21, 07:54 AM
#263
Pole Position
Mach E deliveries literally just started ramping up late Jan. Early delayed-delivery demand isn’t necessarily a predictor of sustained demand. And Tesla sales went up. Lazy analysts assumed a Ford sake equated to a Tesla loss. The market is simply expanding.
Last edited by swajames; 03-06-21 at 07:57 AM.
03-06-21, 08:10 AM
#264
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by swajames
Mach E deliveries literally just started ramping up late Jan. Early delayed-delivery demand isn’t necessarily a predictor of sustained demand. And Tesla sales went up. Lazy analysts assumed a Ford sake equated to a Tesla loss. The market is simply expanding.
03-06-21, 08:14 AM
#265
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
I would like to see the hard stats on the market expanding. I do agree that the Mach E just came to market.
03-06-21, 08:24 AM
#266
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
The Mach E is a good 'attack' on Tesla and the Ford F-150EV is coming. The VW ID4 which Doug Demuro just reviewed looks like another good attack on Tesla.
The Bolt EUV is nice too but seems to still be on their older platform, so not as great as it could be, but still very nice. Hyundai/Kia has had EVs for several years now and is slowly gaining solid experience with building and developing them. The new Ioniq 5 looks very impressive and they also plan to launch several Genesis EVs as well, so they will be a force too. Hard to know what Nissan and Stellantis are going to do. I believe Peugeot already has EVs?
Tesla's manufacturing quality is notoriously horrible (still) and the vehicle, besides the software and drive train is absolutely built as CHEAP as possible. It's just not very impressive in that sense, but it is (very) fast, and appeals to techy and forwarding thinking buyers and I really like the exterior designs. I would not buy one because I find the interior so awful on the 3/Y. The S/X are really nice though. I'd have considered an X if there weren't endless reports of pretty consistent build issues. And I think I'm not alone. And that's why I think the other manufacturers are going to chip away at Tesla's lead. While Tesla is still appealing to the techie/trendy buyers, the other manufacturers may well appeal to 'everyone else' and grab the lion's share of buyers as more and more people want (or have to buy) EVs.
But of course Tesla has a vote too. Their quality will improve. They made a decent upgrade to the 3/Y interior recently (although it's still as spartan as a cereal box, lol). They don't offer mainstream features like Sirius, Apple Carplay, Android Auto, HUD, cooling seats, 360 camera view, and many other things. The 'smitten' don't care, but mainstream buyers do. And without those features, they're not a luxury brand. They're a tech brand. The "full self-driving" 10K package, to me, is one of the most egregious misnamed SCAMS ever made. It's useful to some buyers sure, but will leave it at that. No idea when the bizarre Cybertruck will launch, but I think it will be a tiny niche player, not what Tesla needs.
Bottom line, I think Tesla will face increasing headwinds. If more govts provide more incentives for people to get EVs, that could help Tesla of course, but it also helps everyone else.
As I've mentioned, my next car (in 3 years) is almost certainly going to be an EV CUV/SUV, but I've no idea what it will be.
The Bolt EUV is nice too but seems to still be on their older platform, so not as great as it could be, but still very nice. Hyundai/Kia has had EVs for several years now and is slowly gaining solid experience with building and developing them. The new Ioniq 5 looks very impressive and they also plan to launch several Genesis EVs as well, so they will be a force too. Hard to know what Nissan and Stellantis are going to do. I believe Peugeot already has EVs?
Tesla's manufacturing quality is notoriously horrible (still) and the vehicle, besides the software and drive train is absolutely built as CHEAP as possible. It's just not very impressive in that sense, but it is (very) fast, and appeals to techy and forwarding thinking buyers and I really like the exterior designs. I would not buy one because I find the interior so awful on the 3/Y. The S/X are really nice though. I'd have considered an X if there weren't endless reports of pretty consistent build issues. And I think I'm not alone. And that's why I think the other manufacturers are going to chip away at Tesla's lead. While Tesla is still appealing to the techie/trendy buyers, the other manufacturers may well appeal to 'everyone else' and grab the lion's share of buyers as more and more people want (or have to buy) EVs.
But of course Tesla has a vote too. Their quality will improve. They made a decent upgrade to the 3/Y interior recently (although it's still as spartan as a cereal box, lol). They don't offer mainstream features like Sirius, Apple Carplay, Android Auto, HUD, cooling seats, 360 camera view, and many other things. The 'smitten' don't care, but mainstream buyers do. And without those features, they're not a luxury brand. They're a tech brand. The "full self-driving" 10K package, to me, is one of the most egregious misnamed SCAMS ever made. It's useful to some buyers sure, but will leave it at that. No idea when the bizarre Cybertruck will launch, but I think it will be a tiny niche player, not what Tesla needs.
Bottom line, I think Tesla will face increasing headwinds. If more govts provide more incentives for people to get EVs, that could help Tesla of course, but it also helps everyone else.
As I've mentioned, my next car (in 3 years) is almost certainly going to be an EV CUV/SUV, but I've no idea what it will be.
03-06-21, 08:36 AM
#267
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by LexsCTJill
I would like to see the hard stats on the market expanding. I do agree that the Mach E just came to market.
https://ihsmarkit.com/research-analy...0-percent.html
03-06-21, 09:08 AM
#268
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
I sometimes think percentage is a little misleading. Was hoping for hard numbers like Tesla US sales 2021 vs Ford EV vs VW EV and then look back how Tesla was doing in 2020...
03-06-21, 09:20 AM
#269
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by LexsCTJill
I sometimes think percentage is a little misleading. Was hoping for hard numbers like Tesla US sales 2021 vs Ford EV vs VW EV and then look back how Tesla was doing in 2020...
03-06-21, 09:33 AM
#270
Lexus Test Driver
There is also a chip shortage which has delayed Tesla 3 production.
If Tesla made Model 3 and Y more like model S and X in terms of design without the goofy front bumper - it would reach more of the general public.
The interior is also horribly styled without gauges above steering column and just cheap quality materials.
Look at Porsche- Taycan is a beautiful car with a normal interior - therefore it can be done 😀.
I’m not a big believer in Ford and feel the Mach E will have major issues and already their rollout has been delayed. Matt Farrah liked the driving experience but the car broke down several times on them.
It does look 100x better than a Model Y though.
If Tesla made Model 3 and Y more like model S and X in terms of design without the goofy front bumper - it would reach more of the general public.
The interior is also horribly styled without gauges above steering column and just cheap quality materials.
Look at Porsche- Taycan is a beautiful car with a normal interior - therefore it can be done 😀.
I’m not a big believer in Ford and feel the Mach E will have major issues and already their rollout has been delayed. Matt Farrah liked the driving experience but the car broke down several times on them.
It does look 100x better than a Model Y though.