F150 Lightning
12-15-21, 11:25 AM
#151
EV ftw!!!
AJT123, you've made your point, EV trucks TODAY won't have towing range like an ICE truck. got it.
an EV truck is unlikely to be great at towing for a long time (until battery capacity improves) or maybe the trailers will end up with batteries and motors too so it's not just the truck doing the pulling, the trailer's doing the pushing!
remember when cell phones only lasted an hour or so? well look at what happened. mine lasts 2 days now! combination of bigger batteries and huge improvements in efficiency. same can and will happen to EVs. so all this trashing of ev towing capacity today ignores the fact that things will improve. but yes, TODAY they're not going to be good at it. but that doesn't mean an EV truck is worthless. maybe for you, but not everyone.
maybe you haven't looked at EV truck off road videos, but they will absolutely destroy ICE trucks there - better traction, better ground clearance, better steering (no ice in the way of the turning gear), on and on. and if you camp off road you have a wonderful generator for charging devices, lighting, etc.
an EV truck is unlikely to be great at towing for a long time (until battery capacity improves) or maybe the trailers will end up with batteries and motors too so it's not just the truck doing the pulling, the trailer's doing the pushing!
remember when cell phones only lasted an hour or so? well look at what happened. mine lasts 2 days now! combination of bigger batteries and huge improvements in efficiency. same can and will happen to EVs. so all this trashing of ev towing capacity today ignores the fact that things will improve. but yes, TODAY they're not going to be good at it. but that doesn't mean an EV truck is worthless. maybe for you, but not everyone.
maybe you haven't looked at EV truck off road videos, but they will absolutely destroy ICE trucks there - better traction, better ground clearance, better steering (no ice in the way of the turning gear), on and on. and if you camp off road you have a wonderful generator for charging devices, lighting, etc.
12-15-21, 02:16 PM
#152
Lexus Champion
He seems nice, always waves lol. But yes this truck is ridiculous. It's all stock so it looks nice and expensive, but yeah....
Of course I remember, but cell phone batteries are different than changing propulsion as we know it for vehicles in the United States.
Link to any? You'd rather take an EV into the jungle or onto the desert than a Land Cruiser or Wrangler?
remember when cell phones only lasted an hour or so? well look at what happened. mine lasts 2 days now! combination of bigger batteries and huge improvements in efficiency. same can and will happen to EVs. so all this trashing of ev towing capacity today ignores the fact that things will improve. but yes, TODAY they're not going to be good at it. but that doesn't mean an EV truck is worthless. maybe for you, but not everyone.
maybe you haven't looked at EV truck off road videos, but they will absolutely destroy ICE trucks there - better traction, better ground clearance, better steering (no ice in the way of the turning gear), on and on. and if you camp off road you have a wonderful generator for charging devices, lighting, etc.
12-15-21, 02:42 PM
#153
aditionally, issue is not weight, but aero... so payload inside the bed is like having 5 people and their luggage in Tesla... or any other vehicle. It will be worse, but it wont be terrible.
It seems like some people will buy a truck and start towing boats around just to prove EVs are silly. I really dont understand where the issue is - dont buy EV if you dont like it, problem is that most people will love EVs once they actually try them.
Me or my wife could never go back to regular petrol engined vehicle.
It seems like some people will buy a truck and start towing boats around just to prove EVs are silly. I really dont understand where the issue is - dont buy EV if you dont like it, problem is that most people will love EVs once they actually try them.
Me or my wife could never go back to regular petrol engined vehicle.
12-15-21, 02:53 PM
#154
Lexus Champion
aditionally, issue is not weight, but aero... so payload inside the bed is like having 5 people and their luggage in Tesla... or any other vehicle. It will be worse, but it wont be terrible.
It seems like some people will buy a truck and start towing boats around just to prove EVs are silly. I really dont understand where the issue is - dont buy EV if you dont like it, problem is that most people will love EVs once they actually try them.
Me or my wife could never go back to regular petrol engined vehicle.
It seems like some people will buy a truck and start towing boats around just to prove EVs are silly. I really dont understand where the issue is - dont buy EV if you dont like it, problem is that most people will love EVs once they actually try them.
Me or my wife could never go back to regular petrol engined vehicle.
12-15-21, 03:34 PM
#155
Lexus Test Driver
Where I live, people love and drive tons of F-150's and Chevy Silverado's. Like you, I rarely see anything being towed, nor do I see anything being hauled in their beds. One of my neighbors who lives about 2 blocks down has 4 Chevy Silverado 1500's that have been lifted and have giant off road tires. I have not seen one of those haul anything except people. I'm sure there are people who use them regularly to tow and haul stuff, but I suspect most don't
1) Each truck you see, you're observing for less than 1% of its entire useful life. Some people choose to have a truck to do everything instead of saving it for hauling and also having a sedan for commuting. One day I might drive my F-150 to the office with nothing but myself in it. On Saturday I could be heading to our land up north with a couple thousand pounds of building materials in the bed. Based on what you've said here, I assume if you saw me empty, you'd assume the second thing never happens. I reckon if I walk by your desk and see you on CL instead of working, you never work.
2) unless you actually look into the bed, you don't know it's empty. Given the height of trucks these days, I'm betting you aren't looking back there. I've been at weight capacity a lot of times where you won't see it because i can still my tonneau cover. Things like concrete bags are pretty dense.
12-15-21, 03:46 PM
#156
Lexus Champion
As an anecdote this doesn't work at all for a couple reasons.
1) Each truck you see, you're observing for less than 1% of its entire useful life. Some people choose to have a truck to do everything instead of saving it for hauling and also having a sedan for commuting. One day I might drive my F-150 to the office with nothing but myself in it. On Saturday I could be heading to our land up north with a couple thousand pounds of building materials in the bed. Based on what you've said here, I assume if you saw me empty, you'd assume the second thing never happens. I reckon if I walk by your desk and see you on CL instead of working, you never work.
2) unless you actually look into the bed, you don't know it's empty. Given the height of trucks these days, I'm betting you aren't looking back there. I've been at weight capacity a lot of times where you won't see it because i can still my tonneau cover. Things like concrete bags are pretty dense.
1) Each truck you see, you're observing for less than 1% of its entire useful life. Some people choose to have a truck to do everything instead of saving it for hauling and also having a sedan for commuting. One day I might drive my F-150 to the office with nothing but myself in it. On Saturday I could be heading to our land up north with a couple thousand pounds of building materials in the bed. Based on what you've said here, I assume if you saw me empty, you'd assume the second thing never happens. I reckon if I walk by your desk and see you on CL instead of working, you never work.
2) unless you actually look into the bed, you don't know it's empty. Given the height of trucks these days, I'm betting you aren't looking back there. I've been at weight capacity a lot of times where you won't see it because i can still my tonneau cover. Things like concrete bags are pretty dense.
12-15-21, 04:59 PM
#158
Lexus Champion
12-15-21, 07:01 PM
#159
12-15-21, 07:21 PM
#160
Lexus Champion
Right. Nobody gets to tell anyone what they should drive. At least not in this country. Anyone who tells me I don't need a truck, it's none of your business anyway lol.
12-16-21, 09:01 AM
#161
Lexus Champion
12-16-21, 09:04 AM
#162
Lexus Champion
I think he had a misunderstanding and thought people were criticizing pickup truck owners in general. We were just discussing that it's not necessary to buy a truck if you don't haul or tow stuff. For example I'm on the pre-order list to buy the F-150 Lightning with no intentions of towing anything and the most I would ever have in the bed (in most cases) would be 100 lbs on one of my wife's Costco runs...
My neighbor for example with the F-450. He doesn't need it based on what I've seen but who am I to tell someone what to buy????
12-16-21, 09:29 AM
#163
As I mentioned in my Lightning video, I agree that anyone looking to do lots of long hauls and/or towing should stick with gas or diesel for now. That's not what this truck does best (acceleration, handling, backup power source, day trips, etc.)
But that's the interesting thing about trucks -- almost every owner uses them differently. Some are effectively family sedans with the capability for weekend projects, some are for off-roading adventures, some go to construction sites and sit all day, some tow and do long distances...
As one example, my Grandfather spent the last 35 years of his life doing what he loved -- working outdoors. He traded in and bought a new truck every two years, using them for his lawn care and handyman business. Building decks and fences. Siding and roofing houses. Painting. Yards of mulch scooped into the bed. Dump runs. Brush and debris removal. Mowing 14 lawns a week through his 80s.
And he never once towed because that wasn't part of his business or needs.
An EV truck, had it been available during his lifetime, would have been perfect for his type of truck ownership. Drive around all day in town -- well under 230 miles -- fully loaded. Work a full day. Plug it in at night. Rinse and repeat.
I'm not trying to say anyone NEEDS the Lightning, and I get that it's scary to see a massive industry change coming in the next 15 years. But I don't think companies are going to drop gas and diesel trucks on the same timeline and in the same way that, say, the Lexus IS sedan goes EV-only. Plus, even if new car gas engines (for not large trucks) go away by 2035, it's not like that's the end of the cycle. Folks will still have a century-plus worth of older vehicles on the road. And used gas vehicles will dominate the roadways for another decade beyond whatever line in the sand is drawn.
So that means the world has almost 25 years to make better EVs, create cleaner batteries, and build infrastructure... which is a massive amount of time for the government and private sector to make changes. On that timeline, 25 years ago, "fast" American cars were just starting to pass 300hp, Lexus hadn't released the RX in the states, and people still bought actual ars (not crossovers or SUVs). Today, you can buy an 800hp sedan from Dodge, a 760hp Mustang, the RX is the number one Lexus vehicle of all time, and sedans are all but gone.
What comes next? We're in for some interesting times!
But that's the interesting thing about trucks -- almost every owner uses them differently. Some are effectively family sedans with the capability for weekend projects, some are for off-roading adventures, some go to construction sites and sit all day, some tow and do long distances...
As one example, my Grandfather spent the last 35 years of his life doing what he loved -- working outdoors. He traded in and bought a new truck every two years, using them for his lawn care and handyman business. Building decks and fences. Siding and roofing houses. Painting. Yards of mulch scooped into the bed. Dump runs. Brush and debris removal. Mowing 14 lawns a week through his 80s.
And he never once towed because that wasn't part of his business or needs.
An EV truck, had it been available during his lifetime, would have been perfect for his type of truck ownership. Drive around all day in town -- well under 230 miles -- fully loaded. Work a full day. Plug it in at night. Rinse and repeat.
I'm not trying to say anyone NEEDS the Lightning, and I get that it's scary to see a massive industry change coming in the next 15 years. But I don't think companies are going to drop gas and diesel trucks on the same timeline and in the same way that, say, the Lexus IS sedan goes EV-only. Plus, even if new car gas engines (for not large trucks) go away by 2035, it's not like that's the end of the cycle. Folks will still have a century-plus worth of older vehicles on the road. And used gas vehicles will dominate the roadways for another decade beyond whatever line in the sand is drawn.
So that means the world has almost 25 years to make better EVs, create cleaner batteries, and build infrastructure... which is a massive amount of time for the government and private sector to make changes. On that timeline, 25 years ago, "fast" American cars were just starting to pass 300hp, Lexus hadn't released the RX in the states, and people still bought actual ars (not crossovers or SUVs). Today, you can buy an 800hp sedan from Dodge, a 760hp Mustang, the RX is the number one Lexus vehicle of all time, and sedans are all but gone.
What comes next? We're in for some interesting times!
12-16-21, 09:43 AM
#164
Lexus Test Driver
As I mentioned in my Lightning video, I agree that anyone looking to do lots of long hauls and/or towing should stick with gas or diesel for now. That's not what this truck does best (acceleration, handling, backup power source, day trips, etc.)
But that's the interesting thing about trucks -- almost every owner uses them differently. Some are effectively family sedans with the capability for weekend projects, some are for off-roading adventures, some go to construction sites and sit all day, some tow and do long distances...
As one example, my Grandfather spent the last 35 years of his life doing what he loved -- working outdoors. He traded in and bought a new truck every two years, using them for his lawn care and handyman business. Building decks and fences. Siding and roofing houses. Painting. Yards of mulch scooped into the bed. Dump runs. Brush and debris removal. Mowing 14 lawns a week through his 80s.
And he never once towed because that wasn't part of his business or needs.
An EV truck, had it been available during his lifetime, would have been perfect for his type of truck ownership. Drive around all day in town -- well under 230 miles -- fully loaded. Work a full day. Plug it in at night. Rinse and repeat.
I'm not trying to say anyone NEEDS the Lightning, and I get that it's scary to see a massive industry change coming in the next 15 years. But I don't think companies are going to drop gas and diesel trucks on the same timeline and in the same way that, say, the Lexus IS sedan goes EV-only. Plus, even if new car gas engines (for not large trucks) go away by 2035, it's not like that's the end of the cycle. Folks will still have a century-plus worth of older vehicles on the road. And used gas vehicles will dominate the roadways for another decade beyond whatever line in the sand is drawn.
So that means the world has almost 25 years to make better EVs, create cleaner batteries, and build infrastructure... which is a massive amount of time for the government and private sector to make changes. On that timeline, 25 years ago, "fast" American cars were just starting to pass 300hp, Lexus hadn't released the RX in the states, and people still bought actual ars (not crossovers or SUVs). Today, you can buy an 800hp sedan from Dodge, a 760hp Mustang, the RX is the number one Lexus vehicle of all time, and sedans are all but gone.
What comes next? We're in for some interesting times!
But that's the interesting thing about trucks -- almost every owner uses them differently. Some are effectively family sedans with the capability for weekend projects, some are for off-roading adventures, some go to construction sites and sit all day, some tow and do long distances...
As one example, my Grandfather spent the last 35 years of his life doing what he loved -- working outdoors. He traded in and bought a new truck every two years, using them for his lawn care and handyman business. Building decks and fences. Siding and roofing houses. Painting. Yards of mulch scooped into the bed. Dump runs. Brush and debris removal. Mowing 14 lawns a week through his 80s.
And he never once towed because that wasn't part of his business or needs.
An EV truck, had it been available during his lifetime, would have been perfect for his type of truck ownership. Drive around all day in town -- well under 230 miles -- fully loaded. Work a full day. Plug it in at night. Rinse and repeat.
I'm not trying to say anyone NEEDS the Lightning, and I get that it's scary to see a massive industry change coming in the next 15 years. But I don't think companies are going to drop gas and diesel trucks on the same timeline and in the same way that, say, the Lexus IS sedan goes EV-only. Plus, even if new car gas engines (for not large trucks) go away by 2035, it's not like that's the end of the cycle. Folks will still have a century-plus worth of older vehicles on the road. And used gas vehicles will dominate the roadways for another decade beyond whatever line in the sand is drawn.
So that means the world has almost 25 years to make better EVs, create cleaner batteries, and build infrastructure... which is a massive amount of time for the government and private sector to make changes. On that timeline, 25 years ago, "fast" American cars were just starting to pass 300hp, Lexus hadn't released the RX in the states, and people still bought actual ars (not crossovers or SUVs). Today, you can buy an 800hp sedan from Dodge, a 760hp Mustang, the RX is the number one Lexus vehicle of all time, and sedans are all but gone.
What comes next? We're in for some interesting times!
Things will look very different 10 years from now.
12-16-21, 09:47 AM
#165
Driving around in a growling Mustang that I adore... I stay away from most Teslas... too fast! And that Plaid is next-level INSANE.