Tesla Cybertruck
04-22-24, 10:08 AM
#1501
Lexus Champion
Than you haven't really off roaded 
. I can bet you anything if you tried some of the offroading I did in my Samurai you would've gotten stuck. The Cybertruck can do all the basic off roading, it runs into problems with deep mud and steep slopes where you need power in all wheels
. I can bet you anything if you tried some of the offroading I did in my Samurai you would've gotten stuck. The Cybertruck can do all the basic off roading, it runs into problems with deep mud and steep slopes where you need power in all wheelsLC/LX have claws right off the bat with a Torsen center diff and FT4WD.
04-22-24, 10:10 AM
#1502
Lexus Champion
Well there you go....Torsen is a locking diff. That's why you are able to off road so well. You're LC/LX currently has an advantage over the CT, which is set to open diff right now
04-22-24, 10:16 AM
#1503
Lexus Champion
04-22-24, 10:44 AM
#1504
Super Moderator
The reason why a Land Cruiser off roads so well is it has raised suspension, and four locking diffs. I had a Suzuki Samurai that had no power and was a piece of junk, but it had raised suspension, off road tires, and four locking diffs (manual), so I could off road it anywhere. I couldn't off road it until I actually got out of it, and manually locked the diffs. Without locking the diffs, it would get stuck in mud or sand, or have trouble going up a steep incline.
When you talk about getting out of the Samurai, you were locking the hubs, not the diffs. Many part-time 4WD vehicles leverage locking hubs so that the front portion of the driveline (prop shaft, differential, axles) does not have to spin when you're driving around in 2WD mode. The wheels can just spin freely on their own just like any RWD vehicle, which reduces wear and improves fuel economy. The hub locks "attach" the wheel to that driveline so it can receive power when 4WD is engaged. Those locks can be manual, as they were in your Samurai. This type is simpler, and was commonly found on cheaper and/or older vehicles. Or they can be automatic, where they are controlled either electronically or via engine vacuum. If you drove an Explorer around the time you had your Samurai, you would have had hubs which were automatically engaged when you pushed the "4x4" button on the dash.
Now, to totally blow your mind: Your Samurai had ZERO locking diffs. The front and rear differentials were open, and lockers or spools are one of the more popular upgrades for hardcore modified offroaders. However, remember when we talked about on-road-capable 4wd, often called full-time 4wd? That requires a center differential, which your Samurai did not have. However, the transfer case had an even front/rear torque split when 4wd was engaged, and therefore behaved the same way as a center differential that was locked all the time and could not be unlocked.
Bring this all back to the Cybertruck. No EV with 2 or more motors will ever have a center differential, locking or not. It's simply not necessary, would add weight and complexity, and dramatically reduce range, because the diff and the front/rear driveshafts would take up tons of precious battery space. Place the motors at each end, and you're done. The two-motor CT has two differentials, one driven by each motor.
Rivian takes this to its logical conclusion, with 4 motors--one per wheel--and some pretty sophisticated software to control how much power each gets based on your drive settings and the available traction. No diffs, no lockers, no problems.
Last edited by geko29; 04-22-24 at 10:57 AM.
04-22-24, 10:52 AM
#1506
Lexus Champion
CT has massive advantage over me in terms of flash and display.
04-22-24, 10:56 AM
#1507
Lexus Champion
It feels like you're conflating two very different things. I'm not aware of any normal vehicle with four locking diffs, or what the purpose of the 4th would be, should such a thing exist. It's possible some super-exotic 6x6 has them, but traditional 4-wheeled vehicles have at most three differentials: The center, which is what allows on-road-capable (this detail will become important later) 4wd in the first place, and the front and rear for each axle. Any and all of these can potentially be locked, to evenly divide the torque either between axles (center) or between the wheels on an axle (front/rear). The Land Cruiser has 3, and all 3 are lockable.
When you talk about getting out of the Samurai, you were locking the hubs, not the diffs. Many part-time 4WD vehicles leverage locking hubs so that the front portion of the driveline (prop shaft, differential, axles) does not have to spin when you're driving around in 2WD mode. The wheels can just spin freely on their own just like any RWD vehicle, which reduces wear and improves fuel economy. The hub locks "attach" the wheel to that driveline so it can receive power when 4WD is engaged. Those locks can be manual, as they were in your Samurai. This type is simpler, and was commonly found on cheaper and/or older vehicles. Or they can be automatic, where they are controlled either electronically or via engine vacuum. If you drove an Explorer around the time you had your Samurai, you would have had hubs which were automatically engaged when you pushed the "4x4" button on the dash.
Now, to totally blow your mind: Your Samurai had ZERO locking diffs. The front and rear differentials were open, and lockers or spools are one of the more popular upgrades for hardcore modified offroaders. However, remember when we talked about on-road-capable 4wd, often called full-time 4wd? That requires a center differential, which your Samurai did not have. However, the transfer case had an even front/rear torque split when 4wd was engaged, and therefore behaved the same way as a center differential that was locked all the time and could not be unlocked.
Bring this all back to the Cybertruck. No EV with 2 or more motors will ever have a center differential, locking or not. It's simply not necessary, would add weight and complexity, and dramatically reduce range, because the diff and the front/rear driveshafts would take up tons of precious battery space. Place the motors at each end, and you're done. The two-motor CT has two differentials, one driven by each motor. I don't believe either one has a locker, but I'm not 100% positive on that. The Tri-motor, only has one, in the front. In Cyberbeast trim, it has a mechanical locker. The rear has no differential because the rear wheels aren't connected to one another in any way, they each have their own motor and can therefore be controlled independently. This has the opportunity to be better than a locker, as each side can be driven differently based on the available traction. How much better depends entirely on software.
Rivian takes this to its logical conclusion, with 4 motors--one per wheel--and some pretty sophisticated software to control how much power each gets based on your drive settings and the available traction. No diffs, no lockers, no problems.
When you talk about getting out of the Samurai, you were locking the hubs, not the diffs. Many part-time 4WD vehicles leverage locking hubs so that the front portion of the driveline (prop shaft, differential, axles) does not have to spin when you're driving around in 2WD mode. The wheels can just spin freely on their own just like any RWD vehicle, which reduces wear and improves fuel economy. The hub locks "attach" the wheel to that driveline so it can receive power when 4WD is engaged. Those locks can be manual, as they were in your Samurai. This type is simpler, and was commonly found on cheaper and/or older vehicles. Or they can be automatic, where they are controlled either electronically or via engine vacuum. If you drove an Explorer around the time you had your Samurai, you would have had hubs which were automatically engaged when you pushed the "4x4" button on the dash.
Now, to totally blow your mind: Your Samurai had ZERO locking diffs. The front and rear differentials were open, and lockers or spools are one of the more popular upgrades for hardcore modified offroaders. However, remember when we talked about on-road-capable 4wd, often called full-time 4wd? That requires a center differential, which your Samurai did not have. However, the transfer case had an even front/rear torque split when 4wd was engaged, and therefore behaved the same way as a center differential that was locked all the time and could not be unlocked.
Bring this all back to the Cybertruck. No EV with 2 or more motors will ever have a center differential, locking or not. It's simply not necessary, would add weight and complexity, and dramatically reduce range, because the diff and the front/rear driveshafts would take up tons of precious battery space. Place the motors at each end, and you're done. The two-motor CT has two differentials, one driven by each motor. I don't believe either one has a locker, but I'm not 100% positive on that. The Tri-motor, only has one, in the front. In Cyberbeast trim, it has a mechanical locker. The rear has no differential because the rear wheels aren't connected to one another in any way, they each have their own motor and can therefore be controlled independently. This has the opportunity to be better than a locker, as each side can be driven differently based on the available traction. How much better depends entirely on software.
Rivian takes this to its logical conclusion, with 4 motors--one per wheel--and some pretty sophisticated software to control how much power each gets based on your drive settings and the available traction. No diffs, no lockers, no problems.
. The Samurai ended up totalled, someone made a left turn in front of me while I had a green.As I understand with the Cybertruck, the Off-Road mode (Called Off-Road Assist) is currently disabled (greyed out), at least that's what I read in Tesla Motor club
And damn, kudos for your vehicle knowledge. Hats off to you
Last edited by AMIRZA786; 04-22-24 at 10:59 AM.
04-22-24, 11:05 AM
#1508
Lexus Champion
Torsen is a mechanical self locking diff, you don't need to lock it. I was going to put one, or a similar LSD in my IS350, but decided it wasn't worth the expense since I never tracked the car
04-22-24, 11:57 AM
#1509
Off road, I’m taking this over the Tesla truck. 🤣
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AMIRZA786 (04-22-24)
04-22-24, 12:14 PM
#1510
Lexus Champion
04-22-24, 12:16 PM
#1511
Lexus Champion
Yes you do, if you need a 50/50 split to get out of something really bad. In normal use it's 65/35 and when not locked, the Torsen adjusts the power to the axle with the most grip so it's fine.
04-22-24, 12:26 PM
#1512
Lexus Champion
. If you were stuck, you would use the button to get additional traction. The difference is, the Cybertruck without Off Road assist enabled doesn't have that option, power is not being distributed to get it out of tricky situations
04-22-24, 02:48 PM
#1513
Pole Position
The CT has some key off-road features currently disabled. You can't really compare until the full feature set has been made available.
The off-road specs on the 2013 to 2015 LX are 25 degree approach, 20 degree departure, 23 degree breakover, 8.9 inch ground clearance and 28 inch wade. There's a marginal improvements with AHC in high. Cybertruck has much better ground clearance, a much higher approach and departure angle, and with the features fully enabled it's going to be quite formidable off road.
The off-road specs on the 2013 to 2015 LX are 25 degree approach, 20 degree departure, 23 degree breakover, 8.9 inch ground clearance and 28 inch wade. There's a marginal improvements with AHC in high. Cybertruck has much better ground clearance, a much higher approach and departure angle, and with the features fully enabled it's going to be quite formidable off road.
04-22-24, 05:16 PM
#1514
Lexus Champion
The CT has some key off-road features currently disabled. You can't really compare until the full feature set has been made available.
The off-road specs on the 2013 to 2015 LX are 25 degree approach, 20 degree departure, 23 degree breakover, 8.9 inch ground clearance and 28 inch wade. There's a marginal improvements with AHC in high. Cybertruck has much better ground clearance, a much higher approach and departure angle, and with the features fully enabled it's going to be quite formidable off road.
The off-road specs on the 2013 to 2015 LX are 25 degree approach, 20 degree departure, 23 degree breakover, 8.9 inch ground clearance and 28 inch wade. There's a marginal improvements with AHC in high. Cybertruck has much better ground clearance, a much higher approach and departure angle, and with the features fully enabled it's going to be quite formidable off road.
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BayeauxLex (04-22-24)
04-22-24, 05:28 PM
#1515
Lexus Champion