Supra sway's ?
07-09-04, 11:17 AM
#34
Lexus Champion
Important
Well guys my other post got locked due to the mod thinking it was a for sale post. I PM'd him and asked for it to be unlocked. Again Im not selling anything at this point and im just gauging intrest.
I do have some fantastic reading for you non-swaybar advicators
Please check out this info if you think your coilovers are better than swaybars or both. I would rather have a car with stock springs and struts but aftermarket swaybars than a car with just coilovers if given the choice.
http://www.rqriley.com/suspensn.html
http://www.theherd.com/articles/swaybar.html
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/020911.htm
> What is the function of the rear sway bars?
"While reading through the replies, I noticed that while poeple were covering
this question pretty nicely, all of them neglected to mention an important
function of sway bars. Sway bars are used not only to reduce body roll in
corners, but also to tune the car's handling. It is actually the easiest way
to drastically change the way a car behaves during cornering. Basically the
stiffer end of the car will tend to lose traction sooner (I really should say
the tire slip angles will be higher at that end, but than I would have to
define them
An anti-sway bar makes an end stiffer. The bigger/stiffer the
bar -- the stiffer it makes its end of the car. Most cars in the US are sold
with built-in understeer. It is safer this way because if a driver overcooks
a corner -- only natural, instinctive inputs are required to return the car
to its path. I.e., the driver has to apply his brakes and steer into the turn
(it's actually beneficial to steer less, but that's not what an average
driver will do). Very few cars in the US today will actually oversteer at the
limit. When a car oversteers, its rear will slide to the outside of the turn,
making the car turn more quickly. This makes the car turn A LOT better. It is
also much more dangerous for an inexperienced driver, since the required
correction to avoid a spin feels very unnatural and definitely takes some
practice. To prevent a spin-out the driver has to countersteer (meaning that
the steering wheel has to unwind and be turned in the opposite direction) and
KNOW what to do with the pedals. If he touches the brakes (which is probably
what 90% of people would do), he is practically guaranteed to loose it and
spin out completely. In most cases one has to accelerate, how hard depends on
the driven wheels. With rear wheel drive the acceleration must be very
slight, just enough to shift some weight to the rear tires. With front wheel
drive it is OK to give it a little more gas, but not too much or the front
end will get loose. With 4WD/AWD you accelerate as hard as you can and the
center diff takes care of the rest (unless it's an OPEN center diff)
Anyway, a rear sway bar makes the rear end of the car stiffer, reducing
understeer and increasing oversteer. If you put a stiffer rear bar on a car
that understeered a lot, you will cure some or all of that understeer and
might even induce some oversteer. The best is usually neutral -- so the car
drifts out at both ends. That's the fatsest way around a corner. The problem
arises when using things like limited-slip differentials, which tend to make
the car understeer at the limit no matter what you do with the bars. There is
also a ton of other things that affect cars balance. You can read about them
in many car handling books if you are interested."
I do have some fantastic reading for you non-swaybar advicators
Please check out this info if you think your coilovers are better than swaybars or both. I would rather have a car with stock springs and struts but aftermarket swaybars than a car with just coilovers if given the choice.
http://www.rqriley.com/suspensn.html
http://www.theherd.com/articles/swaybar.html
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/020911.htm
> What is the function of the rear sway bars?
"While reading through the replies, I noticed that while poeple were covering
this question pretty nicely, all of them neglected to mention an important
function of sway bars. Sway bars are used not only to reduce body roll in
corners, but also to tune the car's handling. It is actually the easiest way
to drastically change the way a car behaves during cornering. Basically the
stiffer end of the car will tend to lose traction sooner (I really should say
the tire slip angles will be higher at that end, but than I would have to
define them
An anti-sway bar makes an end stiffer. The bigger/stiffer thebar -- the stiffer it makes its end of the car. Most cars in the US are sold
with built-in understeer. It is safer this way because if a driver overcooks
a corner -- only natural, instinctive inputs are required to return the car
to its path. I.e., the driver has to apply his brakes and steer into the turn
(it's actually beneficial to steer less, but that's not what an average
driver will do). Very few cars in the US today will actually oversteer at the
limit. When a car oversteers, its rear will slide to the outside of the turn,
making the car turn more quickly. This makes the car turn A LOT better. It is
also much more dangerous for an inexperienced driver, since the required
correction to avoid a spin feels very unnatural and definitely takes some
practice. To prevent a spin-out the driver has to countersteer (meaning that
the steering wheel has to unwind and be turned in the opposite direction) and
KNOW what to do with the pedals. If he touches the brakes (which is probably
what 90% of people would do), he is practically guaranteed to loose it and
spin out completely. In most cases one has to accelerate, how hard depends on
the driven wheels. With rear wheel drive the acceleration must be very
slight, just enough to shift some weight to the rear tires. With front wheel
drive it is OK to give it a little more gas, but not too much or the front
end will get loose. With 4WD/AWD you accelerate as hard as you can and the
center diff takes care of the rest (unless it's an OPEN center diff)
Anyway, a rear sway bar makes the rear end of the car stiffer, reducing
understeer and increasing oversteer. If you put a stiffer rear bar on a car
that understeered a lot, you will cure some or all of that understeer and
might even induce some oversteer. The best is usually neutral -- so the car
drifts out at both ends. That's the fatsest way around a corner. The problem
arises when using things like limited-slip differentials, which tend to make
the car understeer at the limit no matter what you do with the bars. There is
also a ton of other things that affect cars balance. You can read about them
in many car handling books if you are interested."
07-09-04, 11:50 AM
#35
Anti-roll bars are obvious handling enhancements, some other things that can be done to enhance under or oversteer are: tire pressure, alignment setings, shocks, suspension bushings, weight distribution and wheels/tires.
One place to for sways/anti-roll bars is ADDCO manufacturing. When I checked with them some weeks back, they had a rear bar under development for the UCF20/21 LS400. If they get enough calls, they will R&D and if demand is sufficient, it will be available. Suspenion Techniques may be another. Give both a call and let them know.
One place to for sways/anti-roll bars is ADDCO manufacturing. When I checked with them some weeks back, they had a rear bar under development for the UCF20/21 LS400. If they get enough calls, they will R&D and if demand is sufficient, it will be available. Suspenion Techniques may be another. Give both a call and let them know.
07-09-04, 11:56 AM
#36
Lexus Champion
RA40, I have done alot of research. I do have an independant company that is willing to do this for us with enough intrest. Addco isnt intrested and neither is whiteline nor suspension techniques,eibach, etc....
I agree with the other mods you listed. As well as these I will be making polyurethane bushings and custom heim jointed control arms.
James
------------------------------------------------------------
James,
As mentioned in a prior PM to you, sales, group buys or 'gathering interest' to sell these items is strictly prohibited unless you (or the company) becomes a approved ClubLexus vendor or arranges to sell the items through an existing ClubLexus vendor. This is both for the protection of our members and the approved vendors who sponsor ClubLexus and keep it up and running.
Thank you for your understanding.
This thread is closed.
I agree with the other mods you listed. As well as these I will be making polyurethane bushings and custom heim jointed control arms.
James
------------------------------------------------------------
James,
As mentioned in a prior PM to you, sales, group buys or 'gathering interest' to sell these items is strictly prohibited unless you (or the company) becomes a approved ClubLexus vendor or arranges to sell the items through an existing ClubLexus vendor. This is both for the protection of our members and the approved vendors who sponsor ClubLexus and keep it up and running.
Thank you for your understanding.
This thread is closed.
Last edited by DaveGS4; 07-13-04 at 01:53 AM.
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