1995 gs300 no start HELP!!!
01-25-22, 04:48 PM
#1
8th Gear
Thread Starter
1995 gs300 no start HELP!!!
Hello! I'm new and this is one of my first posts so thanks for looking.
I just bought a 1995 GS300 with 216,000 miles for $350 (chu-ching) and it doesn't run. It will crank and as it cranks it sounds like it's misfiring like only 1 cylinder in firing, kind of a weird sound, I have never heard it on a car. The owner told me that he was driving normal, no issues, pulled off the line to accelerate and it lost power. He pulled over and had to TURN IT OFF. Then went to start it again and it wouldn't fire. I figured it was a fuel pump so I tested that first and it had zero psi lol. I thought I was done and tried to start again and got nothing. I double-checked fuel pressure at the fuel rail and it was gushing fuel everywhere so I started looking around some more. I looked at the timing belt and it appeared to be worn out and then saw that the exhaust cam and intake cam had both advanced one tooth (I don't have pics sorry) so then I replaced the belt and put it back in time. Tried to start it again, and still nothing but now the misfire sound I mentioned earlier sounds better as if 3/6 are firing??? I don't know. I checked spark and they all had spark, I checked the injectors (listened to them fire with a screwdriver while someone cranked the engine) and they all sound good, and the airways look good leading to the intake. I have checked other simple sensors but didn't get much out of them. I replaced plugs and wires while I had things taken apart. I have tried starting with starter fluid and got no change. Also, I didn't do a compression check because I started putting things back together after I fixed the timing belt think I was done and didn't wanna take it apart again to do it lol. But I will do it if someone recommends it.
I am trying to come up with things that make sense to me of what it could be. Could it be a bad ECU? Did I blow a head gasket ( I feel like it would still start even on a blown one with starting fluid and new plugs. Plus if the previous owner said he tried to start it again after it initially broke then I think it would have gone there too because that car was already warm... just my thoughts)? Cam position sensor/Flywheel sensor? This last guess is wild but maybe it jumped a gear on the timing belt, and fell into limp mode and shut the fuel pump off and won't let itself start... (honestly I don't even know what limp mode is on cars or symptoms of it so...) again these are just fun thoughts I have while I work.
Thanks for your help in advance!
I just bought a 1995 GS300 with 216,000 miles for $350 (chu-ching) and it doesn't run. It will crank and as it cranks it sounds like it's misfiring like only 1 cylinder in firing, kind of a weird sound, I have never heard it on a car. The owner told me that he was driving normal, no issues, pulled off the line to accelerate and it lost power. He pulled over and had to TURN IT OFF. Then went to start it again and it wouldn't fire. I figured it was a fuel pump so I tested that first and it had zero psi lol. I thought I was done and tried to start again and got nothing. I double-checked fuel pressure at the fuel rail and it was gushing fuel everywhere so I started looking around some more. I looked at the timing belt and it appeared to be worn out and then saw that the exhaust cam and intake cam had both advanced one tooth (I don't have pics sorry) so then I replaced the belt and put it back in time. Tried to start it again, and still nothing but now the misfire sound I mentioned earlier sounds better as if 3/6 are firing??? I don't know. I checked spark and they all had spark, I checked the injectors (listened to them fire with a screwdriver while someone cranked the engine) and they all sound good, and the airways look good leading to the intake. I have checked other simple sensors but didn't get much out of them. I replaced plugs and wires while I had things taken apart. I have tried starting with starter fluid and got no change. Also, I didn't do a compression check because I started putting things back together after I fixed the timing belt think I was done and didn't wanna take it apart again to do it lol. But I will do it if someone recommends it.
I am trying to come up with things that make sense to me of what it could be. Could it be a bad ECU? Did I blow a head gasket ( I feel like it would still start even on a blown one with starting fluid and new plugs. Plus if the previous owner said he tried to start it again after it initially broke then I think it would have gone there too because that car was already warm... just my thoughts)? Cam position sensor/Flywheel sensor? This last guess is wild but maybe it jumped a gear on the timing belt, and fell into limp mode and shut the fuel pump off and won't let itself start... (honestly I don't even know what limp mode is on cars or symptoms of it so...) again these are just fun thoughts I have while I work.
Thanks for your help in advance!
01-25-22, 07:22 PM
#2
Pole Position
Hello,
Is the CEL On?
Did anyone mess with the distributor at all?
Can you record a video of how the car sounds?
What brands did you use for replacement parts?
Is there any smoke or smell when you try to start the car?
Did you remove all the spark plugs before installing new timing belt?
Did you check for any Fault Codes stored in the memory? If you don't have an OBD2 port, you can do so by shorting pins Te1 and E1 in the Diagnostics connector under the hood and counting the number of times the CEL would flash, here is a list of those codes.
There are only Camshaft and a Zero-Point sensors installed on that car, there is no crankshaft sensor. Both are in the distributor, to check them, you will likely need an oscilloscope, which there are some cheap options available, like this one.
Make sure that the wires are not crossed, at least on 1UZ engines it is really easy to do, don't ask me how I know.. To check the spark, you can use a spark tester tool like this one, they are relatively inexpensive, but they do allow you to test if the coil is providing enough power. Good coil, cap and wires should yield enough voltage to have spark with about 7-10mm between electrodes.
If you have the timing light, it could be quite helpful to check the Ignition Timing, here is how to do it. The ECU in that car doesn't control the timing, so it is crucial to have the distributor properly aligned, if it was removed before, there is a chance it wasn't adjusted correctly.
Compression test would be quite useful, since if you have the tool, it would just require taking the cover off and unscrewing the plugs. Other cheat way to partially test the compression is to pour just a little oil in each cylinder to see if it will fire, if so, the engine is likely worn and now relies solely on oil to create compression.
The fact that there is flow from the Main fuel line doesn't necessarily indicate that there is enough pressure in the system. To check it, you can take the Return line off and see how much fuel you will get out, if there is barely any, there is not enough pressure to overcome the regulator. Not sure of your car still has that option, but there was an FP terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, connecting FP and B+ terminals powers the pump on constant.
Is it a constant sound of 3 cylinders firing, meaning that the same 3 cylinders fire each time? If so, you can try pinpointing which ones are firing by unplugging injectors until the sound would change, which can be useful.
Also check for any hissing sounds from the engine to see if there are any vacuum leaks, if that is what causes no start, you should definitely hear it. Other than that, try unplugging a few sensors to see if the ECU would react to it in any way.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
Is the CEL On?
Did anyone mess with the distributor at all?
Can you record a video of how the car sounds?
What brands did you use for replacement parts?
Is there any smoke or smell when you try to start the car?
Did you remove all the spark plugs before installing new timing belt?
Did you check for any Fault Codes stored in the memory? If you don't have an OBD2 port, you can do so by shorting pins Te1 and E1 in the Diagnostics connector under the hood and counting the number of times the CEL would flash, here is a list of those codes.
There are only Camshaft and a Zero-Point sensors installed on that car, there is no crankshaft sensor. Both are in the distributor, to check them, you will likely need an oscilloscope, which there are some cheap options available, like this one.
Make sure that the wires are not crossed, at least on 1UZ engines it is really easy to do, don't ask me how I know.. To check the spark, you can use a spark tester tool like this one, they are relatively inexpensive, but they do allow you to test if the coil is providing enough power. Good coil, cap and wires should yield enough voltage to have spark with about 7-10mm between electrodes.
If you have the timing light, it could be quite helpful to check the Ignition Timing, here is how to do it. The ECU in that car doesn't control the timing, so it is crucial to have the distributor properly aligned, if it was removed before, there is a chance it wasn't adjusted correctly.
Compression test would be quite useful, since if you have the tool, it would just require taking the cover off and unscrewing the plugs. Other cheat way to partially test the compression is to pour just a little oil in each cylinder to see if it will fire, if so, the engine is likely worn and now relies solely on oil to create compression.
The fact that there is flow from the Main fuel line doesn't necessarily indicate that there is enough pressure in the system. To check it, you can take the Return line off and see how much fuel you will get out, if there is barely any, there is not enough pressure to overcome the regulator. Not sure of your car still has that option, but there was an FP terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, connecting FP and B+ terminals powers the pump on constant.
Is it a constant sound of 3 cylinders firing, meaning that the same 3 cylinders fire each time? If so, you can try pinpointing which ones are firing by unplugging injectors until the sound would change, which can be useful.
Also check for any hissing sounds from the engine to see if there are any vacuum leaks, if that is what causes no start, you should definitely hear it. Other than that, try unplugging a few sensors to see if the ECU would react to it in any way.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
The following 2 users liked this post by Arsenii:
evangibbs (01-26-22),
Margate330 (01-25-22)
01-26-22, 08:19 PM
#3
8th Gear
Thread Starter
Hello,
Is the CEL On?
Did anyone mess with the distributor at all?
Can you record a video of how the car sounds?
What brands did you use for replacement parts?
Is there any smoke or smell when you try to start the car?
Did you remove all the spark plugs before installing new timing belt?
Did you check for any Fault Codes stored in the memory? If you don't have an OBD2 port, you can do so by shorting pins Te1 and E1 in the Diagnostics connector under the hood and counting the number of times the CEL would flash, here is a list of those codes.
There are only Camshaft and a Zero-Point sensors installed on that car, there is no crankshaft sensor. Both are in the distributor, to check them, you will likely need an oscilloscope, which there are some cheap options available, like this one.
Make sure that the wires are not crossed, at least on 1UZ engines it is really easy to do, don't ask me how I know.. To check the spark, you can use a spark tester tool like this one, they are relatively inexpensive, but they do allow you to test if the coil is providing enough power. Good coil, cap and wires should yield enough voltage to have spark with about 7-10mm between electrodes.
If you have the timing light, it could be quite helpful to check the Ignition Timing, here is how to do it. The ECU in that car doesn't control the timing, so it is crucial to have the distributor properly aligned, if it was removed before, there is a chance it wasn't adjusted correctly.
Compression test would be quite useful, since if you have the tool, it would just require taking the cover off and unscrewing the plugs. Other cheat way to partially test the compression is to pour just a little oil in each cylinder to see if it will fire, if so, the engine is likely worn and now relies solely on oil to create compression.
The fact that there is flow from the Main fuel line doesn't necessarily indicate that there is enough pressure in the system. To check it, you can take the Return line off and see how much fuel you will get out, if there is barely any, there is not enough pressure to overcome the regulator. Not sure of your car still has that option, but there was an FP terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, connecting FP and B+ terminals powers the pump on constant.
Is it a constant sound of 3 cylinders firing, meaning that the same 3 cylinders fire each time? If so, you can try pinpointing which ones are firing by unplugging injectors until the sound would change, which can be useful.
Also check for any hissing sounds from the engine to see if there are any vacuum leaks, if that is what causes no start, you should definitely hear it. Other than that, try unplugging a few sensors to see if the ECU would react to it in any way.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
Is the CEL On?
Did anyone mess with the distributor at all?
Can you record a video of how the car sounds?
What brands did you use for replacement parts?
Is there any smoke or smell when you try to start the car?
Did you remove all the spark plugs before installing new timing belt?
Did you check for any Fault Codes stored in the memory? If you don't have an OBD2 port, you can do so by shorting pins Te1 and E1 in the Diagnostics connector under the hood and counting the number of times the CEL would flash, here is a list of those codes.
There are only Camshaft and a Zero-Point sensors installed on that car, there is no crankshaft sensor. Both are in the distributor, to check them, you will likely need an oscilloscope, which there are some cheap options available, like this one.
Make sure that the wires are not crossed, at least on 1UZ engines it is really easy to do, don't ask me how I know.. To check the spark, you can use a spark tester tool like this one, they are relatively inexpensive, but they do allow you to test if the coil is providing enough power. Good coil, cap and wires should yield enough voltage to have spark with about 7-10mm between electrodes.
If you have the timing light, it could be quite helpful to check the Ignition Timing, here is how to do it. The ECU in that car doesn't control the timing, so it is crucial to have the distributor properly aligned, if it was removed before, there is a chance it wasn't adjusted correctly.
Compression test would be quite useful, since if you have the tool, it would just require taking the cover off and unscrewing the plugs. Other cheat way to partially test the compression is to pour just a little oil in each cylinder to see if it will fire, if so, the engine is likely worn and now relies solely on oil to create compression.
The fact that there is flow from the Main fuel line doesn't necessarily indicate that there is enough pressure in the system. To check it, you can take the Return line off and see how much fuel you will get out, if there is barely any, there is not enough pressure to overcome the regulator. Not sure of your car still has that option, but there was an FP terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, connecting FP and B+ terminals powers the pump on constant.
Is it a constant sound of 3 cylinders firing, meaning that the same 3 cylinders fire each time? If so, you can try pinpointing which ones are firing by unplugging injectors until the sound would change, which can be useful.
Also check for any hissing sounds from the engine to see if there are any vacuum leaks, if that is what causes no start, you should definitely hear it. Other than that, try unplugging a few sensors to see if the ECU would react to it in any way.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
The CEL is not on... I haven't started the car since I have had it either so I don't think I will be able to utilize a timing light quite yet lol. For replacement parts, I just got stuff at AutoZone, so I think their in house brand stuff... Sorry, not super clear. The fuel pressure seems adequate from the fuel return line (lots of pressure). I'm pretty sure I replaced the plugs and then the timing belt in that order, it has been a couple of weeks. I didn't mess with the distributor and I don't think that the previous owner did either, I didn't see any signs of bare/clean metal where the nut could have previously been if it had moved.
What sensors can I unplug to see the ECU react to the change? Also here is a video of how it is currently turning over
01-26-22, 09:23 PM
#4
Pole Position
Well, that really doesn't sound too promising, it sounds as if there is barely any compression.. Triple check the timing marks, if possible, take pictures of all three when they are aligned, you won't need to take the harmonic balancer off, there should be a mark on it that has to align with the 0 mark on the cover, here you can find an example of what I am looking for. If those are good, check the compression, maybe try adding oil to each cylinder, as I described above.
The fact that the CEL is not illuminated at all can indicate there is an issue with the ECU, since it has to be on when the Ignition is turned to the ON position without starting the engine. Check the light bulb, and try using the paperclip to see if the light would come on.
EDIT: Forgot to mention - there should be a W terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, putting a low power light bulb or LED light between W and E1 terminals will grant you a duplicate of your Check Engine Light.
P.S. Duralast, AutoZone's in-home line of parts does have quite a bit of quality hurdles, if possible, I would really suggest avoiding them. If you got the timing belt from them as well, and it is not an Aisin kit, I would strongly advise you to take it back and get an Aisin one, which you can find at RockAuto website. For spark plugs and wires, Denso or NGK is a way to go.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
The fact that the CEL is not illuminated at all can indicate there is an issue with the ECU, since it has to be on when the Ignition is turned to the ON position without starting the engine. Check the light bulb, and try using the paperclip to see if the light would come on.
EDIT: Forgot to mention - there should be a W terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, putting a low power light bulb or LED light between W and E1 terminals will grant you a duplicate of your Check Engine Light.
P.S. Duralast, AutoZone's in-home line of parts does have quite a bit of quality hurdles, if possible, I would really suggest avoiding them. If you got the timing belt from them as well, and it is not an Aisin kit, I would strongly advise you to take it back and get an Aisin one, which you can find at RockAuto website. For spark plugs and wires, Denso or NGK is a way to go.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
Last edited by Arsenii; 01-27-22 at 12:03 AM.
The following users liked this post:
evangibbs (01-28-22)
02-09-22, 10:16 PM
#5
8th Gear
Thread Starter
Well, that really doesn't sound too promising, it sounds as if there is barely any compression.. Triple check the timing marks, if possible, take pictures of all three when they are aligned, you won't need to take the harmonic balancer off, there should be a mark on it that has to align with the 0 mark on the cover, here you can find an example of what I am looking for. If those are good, check the compression, maybe try adding oil to each cylinder, as I described above.
The fact that the CEL is not illuminated at all can indicate there is an issue with the ECU, since it has to be on when the Ignition is turned to the ON position without starting the engine. Check the light bulb, and try using the paperclip to see if the light would come on.
EDIT: Forgot to mention - there should be a W terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, putting a low power light bulb or LED light between W and E1 terminals will grant you a duplicate of your Check Engine Light.
P.S. Duralast, AutoZone's in-home line of parts does have quite a bit of quality hurdles, if possible, I would really suggest avoiding them. If you got the timing belt from them as well, and it is not an Aisin kit, I would strongly advise you to take it back and get an Aisin one, which you can find at RockAuto website. For spark plugs and wires, Denso or NGK is a way to go.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
The fact that the CEL is not illuminated at all can indicate there is an issue with the ECU, since it has to be on when the Ignition is turned to the ON position without starting the engine. Check the light bulb, and try using the paperclip to see if the light would come on.
EDIT: Forgot to mention - there should be a W terminal in the Diagnostics connector under the hood, putting a low power light bulb or LED light between W and E1 terminals will grant you a duplicate of your Check Engine Light.
P.S. Duralast, AutoZone's in-home line of parts does have quite a bit of quality hurdles, if possible, I would really suggest avoiding them. If you got the timing belt from them as well, and it is not an Aisin kit, I would strongly advise you to take it back and get an Aisin one, which you can find at RockAuto website. For spark plugs and wires, Denso or NGK is a way to go.
Hope this helps and best of luck!
Thank you! So I got some more stuff for you...
I used a compression tester and here's what the results were:
1: like 15psi
2: 0psi
3: again like 15psi
4: skipped this one because I thought I was doing something wrong and its kinda covered by the intake thing
5: 15 psi
6: 120psi
Also, when looking at the brand new spark plugs when I pulled them out, the tip on number 6 looked like it was used whereas the rest looked unused, so it sounds like only 6 is working. Sounds like I gotta do the head gasket.
I was looking around the car some more and found that there was like basically no coolant in the radiator... Just thought id throw that out there in case that gives evidence of a reason why a head gasket would fail (overheating).
Also, do I need to be worried about a warped head? I have never seen a head gasket fail on all cylinders so I'm not sure really what to do next
Thanks
02-09-22, 10:52 PM
#6
Pole Position
Was there no coolant from the moment you got the car?
What about Timing Marks, are they all aligned perfectly?
How is the oil looking? Does it have a milky tint or metal flakes in it?
It sounds very unlikely that a blown head gasket would affect all but one cylinder, it should be a catastrophic failure, though a complete lack of coolant doesn't sound too promising either, gotta wonder if that engine is beyond repair. If you have access to borescope camera, you can try looking inside an engine. Taking the head off this engine will most likely warp it, so try to avoid it as much as possible.
Here is a combustion leak detector fluid that changes color if it detects exhaust fumes in the coolant, the most definitive proof of a blown gasket. That said, I have some doubts about its effectiveness if the engine doesn't even fire..
If you have access to compressed air, you can also use a Leak-Down tester like this one to see where the compression is leaking, if it is a blown gasket, you will see bubbles in the coolant, if it is a bent valve, you will hear hissing from intake or exhaust, etc.
In short, before proceeding with any repairs, you need to make sure that the engine is still worth repairing, you may end up getting a bunch of parts only to find out that the engine is completely toast. Do as much digging as possible before committing on whether you salvage what's left of your engine or get a new one. If you know a good mechanic in the area, it may also be a good time to ask for an advice as well..
Hope this helps and best of luck!
What about Timing Marks, are they all aligned perfectly?
How is the oil looking? Does it have a milky tint or metal flakes in it?
It sounds very unlikely that a blown head gasket would affect all but one cylinder, it should be a catastrophic failure, though a complete lack of coolant doesn't sound too promising either, gotta wonder if that engine is beyond repair. If you have access to borescope camera, you can try looking inside an engine. Taking the head off this engine will most likely warp it, so try to avoid it as much as possible.
Here is a combustion leak detector fluid that changes color if it detects exhaust fumes in the coolant, the most definitive proof of a blown gasket. That said, I have some doubts about its effectiveness if the engine doesn't even fire..
If you have access to compressed air, you can also use a Leak-Down tester like this one to see where the compression is leaking, if it is a blown gasket, you will see bubbles in the coolant, if it is a bent valve, you will hear hissing from intake or exhaust, etc.
In short, before proceeding with any repairs, you need to make sure that the engine is still worth repairing, you may end up getting a bunch of parts only to find out that the engine is completely toast. Do as much digging as possible before committing on whether you salvage what's left of your engine or get a new one. If you know a good mechanic in the area, it may also be a good time to ask for an advice as well..
Hope this helps and best of luck!
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