GSShoe

So ... i know i will get ***** for this but ... i decided to take my 98 GS400 to toyota after lexus dealership told me they would change my timing belt for $1900 ... $1900 thats crazy ... for a timing belt? anyway so i took it to toyota and they said they would do it for $399 ... which one would you have picked? ... so i get a call from the director of the service department saying the timing belt broke ... so they will cover all costs for my engine rebuilt ... and i also requested a 4 year warranty on the work they did and he agreed ... he had to change the camshaft ... 8 valves and he had to send the head to the machine shop to be resurfaced ...

i picked my car up and it seems to be fine ... except when my car is hot and in drive ... when i take my foot off the brake pedal the car thumps forward ... i figured the timing belt must be off a tooth so i took it to lexus for an inspection ... toyota payed for it ... and lexus couldn't find anything wrong with it ... they said the compression is fine and the valve seals are fine ... and the second problem is ... when i turn my car on there is a large cloud of blueish white smoke ... i know that this is from the engine oil leaking through the valves ... but lexus said that this is normal after having the valves replaced ... and that it will go away after 5000 miles ...

i guess what i'm trying to ask is ... when a car goes through something like this ... this kind of an engine rebuild ... what happens to the life expectancy? lexus told me that this is a good thing ... that it will expand the life ... but i don't know ... any comments will be really appreciated ...


i feel like i'm in the dark trying to take care of my baby .. its so frustrating


any help would really be appreciated ... even if its not helpful ... i just don't want to go through this alone ...

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

if its rebuilt by toyota themselves, i'd expect it to last just as long, if not longer than when it rolled out the factory.

But you know what they say, it's all in the installation.

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1999 Lexus GS400
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DarKnight

iTrader: (3)

Wow you sound desperate but it should be a good thing. I mean you just had your engine rebuilt plus it's warrantied so you should be good. Only thing I would have had them warranty the work as long as you owned the car.

UberNoob

sounds fair

at least toyota is cool with it and doing what they can to fix the mistake
and good for u for getting the 4 yrs warranty on their work

this "new" engine should definately last longer than if it was stock if rebuilt properly
and i dotn think toyota will mess it up again

u know, next time i need an timing belt changed, ill bring it to a toyota dealer too to see if i can work a free engine rebuild out of it
lol jk

chuckb

I don't think it should be smoking. I've never seen a new Lexus blow blue smoke. As for the clunk, could be a motor mount or tranny mount.

Dx3

iTrader: (13)

I am not understanding what happened?? How did they break your timing belt>? Were they test driving it or what after they had installed it??

Sorry to hear about this. Does this lunging seem like a transmission problem or what?>?

Jonny

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

Wait..i thought our engines were non-interference? Does it mean its still possible to bend the valves and all that?
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1999 Lexus GS400
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Dx3

iTrader: (13)

Hey man,

There is a thread in the Engine/trans section covering this.

Jonny

GWELEX

Well all in all this should be a good thing, you will just have to wait a while and see. Scary thing is this is the second motor I've heard of Toyota replacing the timing belt and getting it wrong. The first incident had almost the same results as your's, bent valves and a damaged head. Whitish smoke should not be seen, sounds like the head gasket may have a small leak. keep a close eye on coolant level and engine temps. I'm pulling for you, a new rebuild for $399 is a bargain.

GeorgeGS4

wow, your first post and it's about a broken timing belt, that's a bummer man

having a rebuilt engine is usually a good thing, and assuming they had their master tech, or someone high-up, doing the work, you should be golden.

Check for exhaust leaks, maybe something dripping onto the pipes to start. If it's a head gasket problem you'll have anti-freeze mixed with your oil, so try changing that, too.

what's your tach at when you let off your brake and you get the thumping. Could be the real low idle causing it to surge forward.... in any case, good luck and welcome to CL

Bill_GS3

I'm not sure about the lunging, but the white smoke is a no no big time. New engine, rebuilt engine, or junk ard there should be NO smoke. Granted I've seen some smoke the first start up and may first few minutes while the cats heat up, but not for up to five k.

If I remeber correctly tgese motor are a none-interference.

How did the timing belt "break"?

-Bill

SRK

Your troubles aren't over. A dealership that busts a timing belt, rebuilds the top end and then has the temerity to say that "it's normal and will go away" when it smokes, is obviously full of idiots. Stand by for lawyers.
The lunging will be the idle air control valve responding to a command caused by some other problem in the engine which makes the computer think the engine is about to stall.
I'd bet that the "techs" at that dealership will want to change the idle air control valve.....
Good luck.

BA_GS400

iTrader: (1)

Hey, welcome aboard GSShoe! Sucks that this is your first post, but, we'll go through this with ya. There's a ton of varied experience here.

Folks above bring up the very good question:
1. At what point did the belt break? That is very VERY coincidental. Just weird. I'm guessing you'll never know exactly. it's very conspicuous though.

Now, about that bluish white smoke. The Lexus guy that said this was normal and would go away in 5000 miles is WRONG. Just dead wrong. That's just ludicrous.
You are correct that generally 'bluish white smoke upon engine start-up' means a valve seal is leaking oil. This 'usually' goes away as an engine is warmed up. Depends upon how bad the seal is.
From what you mentioned of the Lexus dealer saying the compression and valves are good, this indicates that they (supposedly) did basically a compression test....and maybe maybe a leakdown test. Neither of these will show a possible leaking valve seal, but assuming they really did the test, it sounds like your rings and the valve job are ok, else the test numbers would have been low.

If it were the head gasket, the smoke would be more white and no bluish tint. Also, it will not "linger" in the air. The smoke from burning oil lingers in the air and doesn't dissipate as quickly as does radiator fluid from a leaking head gasket. In other words, I think your head gasket is fine.

YOU SHOULD HAVE THEM CHECK THE PLUGS TO DETERMINE WHICH CYLINDER IS BURNING THE OIL, THEN HAVE THEM REPLACE THOSE VALVE SEALS FOR THAT CYLINDER..
Sure, they could do *all* valve seals, but, the above is much quicker!

Regarding the life-espectancy of the rebuilt engine:
It's only as good as the parts that were not replaced! Obviously, they didn't replace all the stuff of a normal rebuild. From what you mentioned, I'd say that you still have the old oil pump, water-pump (some people do this at the time of the belt replacement), rings, crank and rod bearings, etc. *I'd treat the engine just as I would with whatever mileage it has on it.


Regarding the thump issue, I'd really like to hear more about it.
Is it a thump like a hammer? Something heavy hitting something heavy? Hollow?
Assuming this is a two part action.....does it happen when the foot comes off the brake, or when your foot touches the gas? What if you let the car idle forward before hitting the gas?
Where does it sound like the noise is coming from? Get a friend to ride with you if you need to.
It does just sound like something is loose and needs tightned, but, I can't fathom what they would have undone during their work to cause this.

Keep us updated man.....

GSShoe

hey thanks for the support guys really appreciate it ... and needed it too ...

the 98 GS400 has an intereference engine ... so if the timing belt breaks your engine will go ...
my timing belt broke because the tech timed the belt for a toyota tundra ... he said its the same engine ... i thought that the 98 GS400 had the supra engine?

anyway to clarify things ... the smoke only comes out after the car is off for a few hours and dissipates rather quickly ... and is more white then blue ... the lexus shop foreman told me this is normal after what my car went through for the first 5000 miles


the secong thing is the thumping ... its not a sound its when i take my foot off the brake pedal at idle ... the car thumps forward like it was driving on ribs ... ??? the lexus dealership has had it for a week and the shop foreman told me he can't figure out what it is ... but doesn't think it will give me a problem in the long run ...

also i've lost noticeable power ... for example my 3rd gear now feels like my 4th gear did before the mess up ... any clues? i feel like i'm driving a 6 cylinder car ...

BossGS4

iTrader: (2)

~ GS400 = 4.0L V8 / Toyota Tundra = 4.7L V8 : They might be based off of the same shortblock but they are NOT the 'same engine' that tech needs to go back to Jiffy Lube University.

~ GS400s have a V8 engine to my knowledge NO Supra ever came from the factory with a V8, an awesome Twin Turbo Inline 6 maybe ... but no V8s.

~ my suggestion to you would be to bring your car into the Toyota Dealer that did this to your car and place your car in service ON A WRITTEN SERVICE TICKET. Demand that any comments from the technicicans be written down on your service ticket VERBATIM ...... i.e if the service entry reads white smoke visible during cold start until engine warms DO NOT ACCEPT any thing like "operation normal" as the comment for that service item. So have them address the smoke issue and the transmission thump issue on a written service ticket ... the yokels obviously don't know what they're doing and are trying to tell you everything is OK . If you have no paper trail attesting to the fact that the Service Dept. told you it was OK you'll be hard pressed to get anything out of them if anything goes wrong in the future due to their errors.

~ If it were me I would take the car to a Lexus dealer and ask the service manager to go a test drive to address the issues you're having, even going as far as paying to have a diagnostic done so you have written proof that the re-build is not 'normal' (remember you are building your paper trail against the Toyota dealership). I would even call Lexus USA Customer service and make an appointment with a Regoinal Service Manager to do the same thing.

In the end you are going ot have to convince the Toyota Dealer that it is going ot be LESS EXPENSIVE for them to fix your problems and make you go away vs. telling you it's OK then paying for lawyers, more service, more parts ... etc.