NO ****!!!! Lexus is sooo far behind its not even funny!
-Jag has already designed and promoted a soon to be 400hp S-Type.
-I just viewed(at local BMW dealership) the new 4.6 liter X-5 w/340 horse and 0-60 in 6 seconds, 20's stock, and brushed aliminum EVERYWHERE.(Makes Lex 470 look like POOP!)
-BMW will also be releasing the NEW M-5 in late 2003 for 2004 model year with guess what?!?!?! 500HP!!!!!!! Holy ****!!!
-New E-55 will be available later this year(2002) with 400 hp.....(Up from the previous 349hp)
-We all know how much "bang for the buck" the new Maxima is giving....
-New 300z is reported to have been designed with the "after-market crowd" in mind as well. Not straying from the same base engine used in the Max, allowing for the 300hp stock engine to be easily moded to 340 via intake, down pipe, high flow cat, and cat-back exhaust....
-Acura, whether FWD sucks or not, is releasing a 295HP sedan.....
And on and on and on......

I think we should have a thread on CL to be printed out and sent to LEXUS corporate with the sig of ALL CL members telling them that WE WANT PERFORMANCE!!!! Im sooo sick of badging, shocks, interior namby pamby, steering ecu's, I wish I could even say wheels, etc., etc. being labeled as mods............
A mod is when I can get in my car(or a new Lex), punch it, and say holy **** my car(or this new car) feels totally different!!!!!
Years are passing and other manufacturers are killing US!

 

yeah insurance would be terrible on that car i pay 2600 a year and i'm 23 with a gs400 and a perfect record. i'd hate to see what it would be with 400HP!

 

Yeah, you make good points Tiny - everyone seems to be bumping up their numbers rather quickly as of late.

The thing is, I consider the GS a rather good platform to build on, and since we're all modding anyway, makes since to me to hold on to it, drop an ST3-4 SC in it in a year or two, and watch as mosteveryone else tries to keep up with the 700hp beast.

~$15k and amortize that cost over an already heavily depreciated car that has a ton of value left. Its a great car, and taken care of will last you quite a very long time.

But, just depends on what the big L throws out to us in the next few years as far as a Super Sedan is concerned; that will be my deciding factor.

 

Me personally, I think that both the GS300 and 400/430 are treated equally if not more so the 400/430. Granted the 400/430 costs more but had some nice features that were options only on the 300, like 17" wheels, wood steering wheel, wheel-mounted shifting initially, more torque added, etc. And all the stuff mentioned for the Sport Edition GS300 could easily be purchased separately and added to a 400/430, but even if they came out with a 430 Sport Edition, who of us would really buy it knowing a brand new model is right around the corner ?? We shouldn't complain about anything until we see or hear the specs for the new GS, everything else is just nervous speculation.

 

I completely disagree with this. Lexus has been around, what, 12 years now? They've done a TON in that time. Recently, they've shown an IS430 (talk about holy crap!) and a supercharged LS. You don't think they 'get it'?

BMW has a hot SUV, sure. And a TINY number of people will buy it. Remember, Toyota / Lexus aren't into doing things that sell tiny amounts of vehicles. If you want that, buy a Porsche.

BMW having a new M5 in 'late 2003'? That's nearly 2 years away, so why are you saying Lexus is 'so far behind'!?!?! That's stupid.

Maxima? Good bang for the buck sure, but it's more like the Acura TL - hardly in the same league as the GS.

300z is neat, but Lexus doesn't really offer 'sports cars' like that. If you're saying they should, then I guess I disagree - it really doesn't fit their image. Of course Toyota has done the Supra before so they can certainly do it again if they think it's a good business decision.

Nissan is DESPARATE to be NOTICED remember. Their sales are pathetic, although they've done better since Renault bought them.

I think you're seeing the glass as half empty. I see it as more than half full!

Lexus will never be a flat out performance company. If you don't like that, go buy a Porsche as I said or a BMW for that matter. It works for BMW although their volumes are still really pretty small.

I also agree with 1sick - 300HP is plenty for me. I can already run circles around almost everything else on the road. More power just means it's more likely my speed differential will cause me to have an accident.

 

it's just that......

BMW guy comes on here all he has to say is M POWER and we all have to shutup cause we can't top it


Benz guy comes and says AMG and we can't touch it


Porsche comes and says......Basically anything but the boxter....were hit

Acura lists some HP numbers and says NSX..........


Audi and there.....what is it, the S8?


Even if freaking Ford and GM come on here and say WS6, SS, Cobra, Roush......what can we say


Yea, the GS is like my dream car but when I'm fighting with my friends and they say ZO6.......what do I say? SRT Stage 3 Supercharger? SC300 Twin Turbo Supra conversion?

That doesn't work does it?.......okay, I can't explain what i'm trying to say.......

 

I'm very disappointed by the fact that Lexus doesn't even offer 17" as stock and 18" as the sport package (optional). We all know when we have more torque, we would need a wider rear tyres to grab the traction. The current stock 16" and 17" aren't wide enough IMO.

All those new design interior is good. But I'd rather see Lexus had some kind of fight-back for the M and AMG, at least some solution. Since TOM'S has all the Toyota resources, they could setup a division for the Lexus, develop the ECU, brake kits, and what not. To be honest, L-tuned is a joke. Though it makes the handling gap between BMW closer but it still has a lot to catch up.

All in all, I've sent numbers of emails to Lexus, hoping that they will have a sport division for us but I guess they didn't read it.

 

Truth be told, if Lexus officially announced tomorrow that the new GS430 would have 375hp there would be a parade of ClubLexus members from coast to coast. I highly doubt that you would find many of us here nervously complaining that it's "too much power" or "too fast compared to other cars in it's class". There is a trend of late to continuously bump up hp, and us GS owners have had to wait patiently for 5 years with no increase whatsoever, and are more than anxious to see a new model and new specs. Let's be honest, even if the new GS was absolutely beautiful, wouldn't you be put off a little if they keep the same hp (ala the ES300) ?

 

Good point sick, I was thinking about that too.

But think about this, where is there a collective body of Lexus owners as large as CL?

 

I have to agree with Racing Aristo, Francis K and the like!! No doubt I love my Lexus.. And for right now, it does run circles around most cars!!... right now!!..

But, wasn't one of the reasons you got a GS4 instead of a BMW or BENZ because it gave you a 300hp engine with 0-60 in UNDER 6 seconds?? I know that was the MAJOR factor in getting my GS4!! Don't lie and tell me it's not one of the reasons you got yours...

Before, we used to brag and brag about how we had the power, the luxury and reliability and everone else was behind. Now all we say is we have the reliability!! All you guys are doing is give excuses why Lexus IS NOT up to par with the M series BMW and AMG series BENZ... All everyones says is BS!!

"well, Lexus isn't going for that market"
"Lexus will come around"
ALL EXCUSES EXCUSES EXCUSES!!

When someone on this board can post a CLEAR FACT (instead of wha they hope/think Lexus is doing) that Lexus is going to do something about this then it's all BS that ya'll are posting!!

Lets face it, Lexus has the power to put out a GS4?? with 400hp or more!! Why don't they?? Who knows! But honestly, unless you are BSing yourself, Lexus is BEEEEEEEEEEEHIND!!!

I hope and pray they have things in the works to combat the M-series and AMG series......

OH, and btw.... whoever posted about the M5 getting changes in 03 isn't stupid..... Wanna know why? Cuz in 03 the new GS will come out with, I HOPE, 350-400hp... But in that same year, BMW will come out with a 450-500hp M5... And what's going to happen guys..... what does it look like again..... WE ARE FRIGGIN BEHIND!!!!!!!!!!!!

If anyone can't see that then you are BLIND!! And BIT, his comment was not STUPID... It was completely RIGHT!!...

 

I have to disagree to some extent LexDriver, BMW and Mercedes have been around collectively for almost 200 years, and the M division is not that old (less than 15 ?) and the same with AMG (around 6). Lexus is a 12 year old company that is now starting to incorporate a performance edition, which isn't bad for such an upstart. The GS is aimed not at the M or AMG series, but the 540 and the 430, of which it definitely holds it's own, if Mercedes and BMW had to rely on M and AMG sales, well let's just say they wouldn't be in business too long. The GS still has the power, luxury and reliability after 4 years, and no other car within it's class combines all 3, no one. And how can anyone post a CLEAR FACT, when Lexus themselves haven't even announced anything yet ? Remember, when people were bringing their 3 series in for work back in '89, Lexus wasn't even a company !! I think we've become spoiled by Lexus, because of the fact that they've done so much, so soon and so right, that we want the bar raised consistently.

 

point well taken...

and the reason why I wrote "clear fact" is because all anyone has right now is speculation.. and so far, the people who realize lexus is behind a little, are on the ball cuz UNDOUBTEDLY Lexus doesn't have a car to compete with the M3 or E55!!

PERIOD END OF STORY!! You can't argue that!!

When they do, then you guys can rip me on how I was saying Lexus is behind... Until that time, I'M RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Everyone else is just HOPING lexus does that right thing... and personally, I don't just wanna HOPE lexus makes a car to combat the M3 and E55..... I want it to happen!!

 

Well I guess my question for you is, have you ever owned an M series or AMG before ? If not, then why ? And if so, why did you get rid of it ? If you haven't, then who is to say that if Lexus makes a competitor you would actually buy it ? No one questions whether Lexus COULD make one (see the soon-to-be IS430), but should they ? The GS430 accounts for less than 25% of GS sales, I can only imagine what a sport edition would amount to. This perception that Lexus is behind is just that...perception, I mean, MB just came out with a C-class coupe after what, 15 years ?? And BMW comes out with an SUV 4 years after the LX450/470. Does BMW even have a folding hardtop convertible ?? (Z8, nope) Does MB have an SUV the size of either the LX470 or even GX470--no. But do they have a performance division ? They're working on it, again they've only had about a decade to not only enter the market but dominate it in both sales, quality, reliability, prestige and customer satisfaction, which Bimmer and Mercedes still can't get right (after 100 years in business each).

 

It's nice to see that the CL members are so passionate about their cars. I guess since we own a Lexus, we want to know that we have a very high quality and desirable car that everyone envys. With all those new super sedans coming out like M5s, E55s, S-Type Rs, and S6s... it's hard to convince ourselves that our own cars are still desirable.
Well from what I have noticed, Japanese and Europeans have very different strategies when it comes to cars and their marketing. The Europeans are always bragging about the technologies, the power ratings many years ahead. They have spy photos, press releases just to tease us and build our anticipation. With the Japanese, they are always very hush hush, no spy photos, no engine numbers... they keep quiet and let the Europeans brag and all of a sudden BAMMMMMM. They come out of no where and surprise everyone with a car that has everything the competetiors have plus more. Look at how the GS400 came out of no-where in 98 after E420, and 540 were released in 97. I'm sure they are going to use the same tatics again with the next GS release. No worries people, Lexus did not get to where it is today by being stupid. I am sure that Lexus have something up their sleeves.

 

For real, people need to calm their asses down. Why do you feel so threatened that other car companies are coming out with cars that have a higher output of horsepower than yours does? Lexus never put a gun up to you and forced you to buy their product. You bought your Lexus for whatever reason that it intrigued you. I agree wholeheartedly with what 1SickLex feels regarding the GS. It's the entire package that sold me on the car, not the fact that it can run 0-60 in under six seconds.

If you think the next M5 or the upcoming E-Class replacement is the car for you, simply because of how many horses the engine is pumping out, buy it. If you're concerned about what to tell your friends when he baits you with his Z06 (!), you should really think about diversifying your conversations a bit. If you were comfortable with the car that you drive (and you should be), then what do you have to worry about? Are you scared that your '98 GS400 can't keep up with an '03 M5? Big deal. Get some *****. GSPower is right about the dual mentality of European and Japanese car makers. Who heard anything about the GS300 SportDesign after it showed up in InsideLexus? How about the IS430? Now that was a bombshell.

Let's all take a chill pill and enjoy the cars that we are driving today, and not the ones we may or may not be driving a few years from now. Lexus has been making the right decisions so far (best-selling luxury division in the US market... not too shabby); they know how to stay competitive.